Recipe for rockcrawling on 37s with Elockers? (2 Viewers)

[HDJdreams]

My 97 is sitting in the garage, rear hub torn apart as I replace the rear hub bearings and seals. I plan on replacing the hub studs. I am trying to figure our whether to stick with OEM or try one of the Trail Gear kits? Right now my drivetrain is stock and on 34x10.5 BFGs.

I live 3 hours from Moab and my goal is to build my 80 to hold up down there rolling on 37s. I get the impression that lots of people feel that 35s are the practical limit of the 80 platform, especially for the factory E lockers. What are the weak links and can they be upgraded?

After I get the rear back together, I need to tackle the front as I am starting to get the clicking on my original birfields after 250k miles. I plan on replacing them with the CrMo Nitro shafts. I planned putting CrMo shafts in the rear also when I regear (Nitros with solid spacers seem to be strongest combo?)

My impression was the biggest issue with the factory locker was that it would jam if the splines twist on the rear shaft. Will it hold up okay with the CrMo shafts? What works to keep hub from shearing?

What other drivetrain upgrades are recommended for 37s?

Thanks!

 

[mct75]

You can machine down the splines to keep it from twisting and getting stuck if the axle breaks.

 

[HDJdreams]

Not sure what you mean.

 

[White Stripe]

I would not use chromoly shafts or birfields in the front. You want your axle shafts to be the weak link, rather than the front differential. Blowing a front diff will ruin your wheeling trip. Breaking a front birfield is very easy to repair.

 

[ReformedJeeper]

I have wheeled my 80 pretty hard (on 37s, never in Moab, but I have done some hammer trails in it) and it holds up if you don't wheel like a jackass. That being said I would do the following to make it live:

1) upgraded 30 spline CVs and birfs upfront. I run RCV.

2) machined axle spline in the rear to avoid the twisted/stuck spline issue. Rear Factory Locked Axle Shaft Mod

3) get as much gearing as you can. 5.29s in the axle along with 3.12 crawler gears in the t case.

4) consider part time so when something breaks in the front you can easily 2 wheel drive home.

I personally haven't had any problems with hub studs, but just like knuckle studs, I check for proper torque frequently.

The only major problem I have had is that I broke the front ring and pinion. They are much weaker in reverse, so be aware of that.

 

[GW Nugget]

Cutting the shafts in Elockers is I believe a @landtank type mod so one can pull the 3rd out. More people will pipe in soon. @NLXTACY

 

[jcardona1]

37s are the new 35s. The setup works well if you respect the gas pedal. I wouldn't say I wheel my truck "hard", but I do take it on the tougher trails and have yet to have any issues.

- 37s on 17" beadlocks
- 4WU 3 link front, 14" Radflo coilovers, 200/350 PAC springs
- OME 5" comp coils & 2.5" Radflo emulsion shocks in rear w/ Ruffstuff sway bar
- Hellfire high-steer & hydro ram assist
- part time 4x4 w/ Aisin hubs & upgraded studs
- Chromoly birfs & shafts, rear OEM
- Cryo-treated Nitro 5.29 gears
- I have the 3.11 transfer gears, but have not installed them yet

 

[nukegoat]

I would not use chromoly shafts or birfields in the front. You want your axle shafts to be the weak link, rather than the front differential. Blowing a front diff will ruin your wheeling trip. Breaking a front birfield is very easy to repair.

If you know how to drive then I disagree with the fuse approach. I ran my front e locker with og longfields hard on 36's. Wouldnt have wanted oem birfs at all. No ring and pinion carnage - just dont shock load the gears and you get the confidence to keep the throttle on with the wheels locked one direction

 

[nukegoat]

Also proper r&p setup will help your gears survive a long long time. Primarily this is going to mean a good pattern but dont neglect carrier bearing preload. Paging @gearinstalls.com

 

[mct75]

Come save us, ken!

 

[landtank]

Cutting the shafts in Elockers is I believe a @landtank type mod so one can pull the 3rd out. More people will pipe in soon. @NLXTACY

not any more

 

[AutoCraft Aus]

Gearing as above, genuine cvs for me, and proper solid pinion spacers front and rear, [NO SHIMS!!!] will make the diff as strong as it can be with some upped pre load on the side brearings.

The thrust load witht he thin shims spits them out, see it alot.

The next fusable link will be the bearing cap bolt stretch.

Ideally to run any benefit from 37s over 35s, you would do trimming and not space bump stops to keep lower COG.

The hang points are many on an 80, t case, and rear chassis for departure are the 2 to spend some time curing.

 

[nukegoat]

Proper solid pinion spacers front and rear, [NO SHIMS!!!] will make the diff as strong as it can be with some upped pre load on the side brearings.

The thrust load witht he thin shims spits them out, see it alot.

What? You realize solid spacers, pinion bearing depth, and rear carrier bearings all rely on shims, right? As do tons of other systems

 

[scottryana]

I think he meant no crush sleeve you still have to use the shims to get the values right.

What? You realize solid spacers, pinion bearing depth, and rear carrier bearings all rely on shims, right? As do tons of other systems

 

[AutoCraft Aus]

What? You realize solid spacers, pinion bearing depth, and rear carrier bearings all rely on shims, right? As do tons of other systems

I think he meant no crush sleeve you still have to use the shims to get the values right.

Nope, the pinion depth shim is held captive, as you can tell by looking at it.

So, to make the diff as as strong as it can be you need to set your pinion pre load by machining the 1 piece solid spacer to set your pre load, not spit out the shim, and you need to up the side bearing load too, because spread will also cause pinion to lose contact.

Is it a bit tedous, sure, but far better than new gears and wingnuts on it to keep cleaning and rebuilding. Once you have done afew it gets easier and 2 goes is normally enough. I have my spacers cnc machined, so within 1mm of length, and fit nicely on the pinion and support the bearing nibs each end fully as well, to keep them strong with the thrust load.

And for simple mass assembly this system may be fine, but when you stop counting at 500+ cruiser diffs, 75% broken 1, 2, 3 times before you get them to set them up as I described, and only ever got 1 broken 1 back, thats enough data for me

The solid pinion spacer unless you machine it to take the shim in between a 2 part unit just thrust on the shim and spit it out after it tears open. As I said we see it all the time.

With this set up I have seen the pinion head move that far it has cut grooves in the locker carrier but the teeth have stayed in contact so it didnt break the crownwheel or pinion.

You also need at least a later 4 pinion carrier for strength [no big hole in it to get side gears in and out] or with a factory locker centre, or other locker the carrier is also the better stronger design.

Hope that helps

 

[nukegoat]

Nope, the pinion depth shim is held captive, as you can tell by looking at it.

So, to make the diff as as strong as it can be you need to set your pinion pre load by machining the 1 piece solid spacer to set your pre load, not spit out the shim, and you need to up the side bearing load too, because spread will also cause pinion to lose contact.

Is it a bit tedous, sure, but far better than new gears and wingnuts on it to keep cleaning and rebuilding. Once you have done afew it gets easier and 2 goes is normally enough. I have my spacers cnc machined, so within 1mm of length, and fit nicely on the pinion and support the bearing nibs each end fully as well, to keep them strong with the thrust load.

And for simple mass assembly this system may be fine, but when you stop counting at 500+ cruiser diffs, 75% broken 1, 2, 3 times before you get them to set them up as I described, and only ever got 1 broken 1 back, thats enough data for me

The solid pinion spacer unless you machine it to take the shim in between a 2 part unit just thrust on the shim and spit it out after it tears open. As I said we see it all the time.

With this set up I have seen the pinion head move that far it has cut grooves in the locker carrier but the teeth have stayed in contact so it didnt break the crownwheel or pinion.

You also need at least a later 4 pinion carrier for strength [no big hole in it to get side gears in and out] or with a factory locker centre, or other locker the carrier is also the better stronger design.

Hope that helps

Rubbish. Shims wont spit out.

 

[86tuning]

Ima gonna say you're splitting hairs if you're making custom solid spacers vs using shims to set up the spacers.

But hey, I only build drift cars...

 

[mct75]

I'm still waiting on Ken to set the record straight...

 

[scottryana]

Haha I am sure Darren isn't making things up. If he has seen it, there is no reason to question it. The Aussie guys abuse the crap out of their trucks. I have witnessed them beating their trucks much more than we do here. I absolutely trust Ken and his setups but it is possible he hasn't seen the same kind of abuse Darren has seen.

I would trust either one of them. Ken has a very solid reputation and I wouldn't hesitate to get my gears setup by him, but I wouldn't mind getting more information on how Darren sets gears up. I know they have some parts in Australia that we didn't get here. Even heavier duty ring and pinions?

 

[Tapage]

but I wouldn't mind getting more information on how Darren sets gears up.

X2 .. since I'm partially lost .. any chance a pic to take a visual of what you technique .. ?