Builds The "Red Rocket" Troopy

[theglobb]

Think I'm going with this. Amazon product ASIN B0081S8S20 Made in china but 24v, should last longer than just running a 12v starter on 24v. The catch is I can put a 4-year warranty on it for $20 extra dollars cause of amazon. Whenever it inevitably fails just put a new one in. Once I get more money I might buy another so I always have a spare on me incase it craps out on me in a sticky spot.

 

[theglobb]

Merry Christmas everyone! Here are some of my very helpful presents.

 

[robmobile73]

If I was a college student with no money or if I was a multi-millionaire in his fifties and I knew I could get a new 24 volt starter for 151 bucks Amazon prime, I'd stash that 151 away and have it ready, and run that 12 volt starter on 24 volts till it burned up being gentle with it. What would you do with it anyway if it was sitting in your garage?........... That is provided I had a stick shift vehicle friends here and there to help push start and I wasn't doing a ridiculous road trip....... People commented on 12 volt winches running on 24 volts that's a pretty hefty electric motor too. .. it's true. .. I bought a 12 volt winch and run it off 24 volts based off that same advice I heard

.... I turned it on for 3 to 5 seconds and then turn it off for three to five. Good luck whatever you do!

 

[Roastchestnuts]

Merry Christmas everyone! Here are some of my very helpful presents.

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love the nikon EM.

 

[jblueridge]

Made in china but 24v, should last longer

When I bought a new made in china alternator off the internet, I was actually sent a rebuilt Denso unit that was probably from a 12HT motor.
I then had to spend some more money to get the face of the oil inlet machined flat again.
Machinist believed the core was damaged at that spot on purpose to prevent it being rebuilt.
The alternator works fine but I swapped my original alt back in after getting it repaired by Precision Power in Michigan.
I am a hoarder so the chinese alt is on the shelf, waiting.

 

[PabloCruise]

Merry Christmas everyone! Here are some of my very helpful presents.

View attachment 3201580

Paging @Laughingjackal

 

[theglobb]

Progress! Adapter plates cut, troopy in position, time to see how stuff lines up and bolts together. The swap definitely won't be done over break but I'm hoping to at least get the motor mounted and maybe a radiator mounted as well. The roof I'm working under is quite low so I can't lift the engine hoist that high, gonna have to take the whole front end of the troopy off and apart to just move the engine in and through.

 

[mjosoba]

Awesome man!

 

[robmobile73]

Progress! Adapter plates cut, troopy in position, time to see how stuff lines up and bolts together. The swap definitely won't be done over break but I'm hoping to at least get the motor mounted and maybe a radiator mounted as well. The roof I'm working under is quite low so I can't lift the engine hoist that high, gonna have to take the whole front end of the troopy off and apart to just move the engine in and through.




View attachment 3208672View attachment 3208671

That's awesome man! It looks like you are making a plate to adapt the rear of the isuzu belhousing to the front of the tranny and ditching the 3B h55 belhousing.?.? Lot of people will want to hear about this and perhaps want a copy of the "cut file" or patterns. If you designed this, wondering how you got the bolt pattern shape/turned into a cut file. Could they make it from a photo with measurments, or did they need a pattern?

 

[lacalvette]

If the h55f gonna be used, an adapter on the gear box output shaft should be used.
Did not see wear on the shaft with a 3B but the spline can twist when mate to a 12HT.

"DIY" hd mcnamara gear

i'm working on a 5spd for somebody right now and it's got the usual wear on the main-shaft where the t-case input gear resides. good used shafts are expensive, new shafts are difficult to find and the McNamara gears are'nt cheap either. on top of that we're on a tight budget and timeline so i...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[theglobb]

a bit more progress today, my dad has off work on Thursday or Friday so something will happen then. Kinda crazy how different these trucks can look with 30 minutes of front-end disassembly

Here's the liquid filled motor mounts I got, @Dougal recommended I try to make it work with the OEM 3B mounts cause they are meant to withstand the engine's vibrations for decades while the liquid-filled mounts aren't as sturdy but OEM 3B motor mounts are $190 for 1... Dont have the money for that at the moment, especially while these go for $45 each. If it means I'll have to replace them every 75k miles, so be it.

Something else I was worried about was trying to figure out a throwout bearing to use as the stock isuzu setup is pretty funky... well turns out the inner diameter of the toyota (on the right) and isuzu (on the left) are exactly the same! 34.8mm, what are the odds? I don't know but that's pretty awesome.

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That's awesome man! It looks like you are making a plate to adapt the rear of the isuzu belhousing to the front of the tranny and ditching the 3B h55 belhousing.?.? Lot of people will want to hear about this and perhaps want a copy of the "cut file" or patterns. If you designed this, wondering how you got the bolt pattern shape/turned into a cut file. Could they make it from a photo with measurments, or did they need a pattern?

Yes, multiple reasons wouldn't allow to use the 3B bellhousing to the Isuzu engine, mainly the clutch and pressure plate were just too big from the Isuzu engine to fit within the Toyota bellhousing, also just the length of everything would have been hard to match up. Just putting a plate between the Isuzu bell housing and Toyota transmission to adapt the 2 is much simpler, cheaper, and you can use the adapter plate (1 in. thick) to make up space due tp the input shaft being too long with using the isuzu engine/bellhousing combo.

After I finish the swap as a whole I plan on making a thread explaining what I did in detailing and attaching all the files, measurements, and everything else I had to do to make it work. Dont want to start publishing if something doesn't end up working out and then confusing someone trying to do the same in the future.

If the h55f gonna be used, an adapter on the gear box output shaft should be used.
Did not see wear on the shaft with a 3B but the spline can twist when mate to a 12HT.

"DIY" hd mcnamara gear

i'm working on a 5spd for somebody right now and it's got the usual wear on the main-shaft where the t-case input gear resides. good used shafts are expensive, new shafts are difficult to find and the McNamara gears are'nt cheap either. on top of that we're on a tight budget and timeline so i...

forum.ih8mud.com

Thanks for this heads up, never heard of it before. The h55 is being used for this. The 12HT power specs are pretty similar to the 4BD1T so this is a bit concerning. The thread that's been linked confuses me a bit just cause I have really never dealt with any internal transmission issues so I'm not exactly familiar with what he is referencing. My whole plan with this swap was to keep everything as reasonably stock as possible... yea an isuzu engine is being swapped in but I didn't want to have to move the transmission around/cut or lengthen driveshafts, modify anything else in the driveline, etc etc so I'd prefer to not have to do this.

Does anyone have other thoughts on this topic? I'd like to get as many points of view as possible.

Here's how the Red Rocket lays now, awaiting surgery

 

[robmobile73]

a bit more progress today, my dad has off work on Thursday or Friday so something will happen then. Kinda crazy how different these trucks can look with 30 minutes of front-end disassembly

View attachment 3209768
View attachment 3209767

Here's the liquid filled motor mounts I got, @Dougal recommended I try to make it work with the OEM 3B mounts cause they are meant to withstand the engine's vibrations for decades while the liquid-filled mounts aren't as sturdy but OEM 3B motor mounts are $190 for 1... Dont have the money for that at the moment, especially while these go for $45 each. If it means I'll have to replace them every 75k miles, so be it.
View attachment 3209766

Something else I was worried about was trying to figure out a throwout bearing to use as the stock isuzu setup is pretty funky... well turns out the inner diameter of the toyota (on the right) and isuzu (on the left) are exactly the same! 34.8mm, what are the odds? I don't know but that's pretty awesome.
View attachment 3209765


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Yes, multiple reasons wouldn't allow to use the 3B bellhousing to the Isuzu engine, mainly the clutch and pressure plate were just too big from the Isuzu engine to fit within the Toyota bellhousing, also just the length of everything would have been hard to match up. Just putting a plate between the Isuzu bell housing and Toyota transmission to adapt the 2 is much simpler, cheaper, and you can use the adapter plate (1 in. thick) to make up space due tp the input shaft being too long with using the isuzu engine/bellhousing combo.

After I finish the swap as a whole I plan on making a thread explaining what I did in detailing and attaching all the files, measurements, and everything else I had to do to make it work. Dont want to start publishing if something doesn't end up working out and then confusing someone trying to do the same in the future.

Thanks for this heads up, never heard of it before. The h55 is being used for this. The 12HT power specs are pretty similar to the 4BD1T so this is a bit concerning. The thread that's been linked confuses me a bit just cause I have really never dealt with any internal transmission issues so I'm not exactly familiar with what he is referencing. My whole plan with this swap was to keep everything as reasonably stock as possible... yea an isuzu engine is being swapped in but I didn't want to have to move the transmission around/cut or lengthen driveshafts, modify anything else in the driveline, etc etc so I'd prefer to not have to do this.

Does anyone have other thoughts on this topic? I'd like to get as many points of view as possible.

Here's how the Red Rocket lays now, awaiting surgery
View attachment 3209764

I used some motor mounts just like that on my tranny cross member. Mostly because they were cheap/readily available and I thought they'd work well. Recomendations: Try to get the angles and distances right so that they are not pulling the engine down to the mount, or torquing the mount at an angle. You can torque and pull those mounts, but they will transmit more vibes to the frame if you do that. Tighter mounts may mean more vibes if it's not all lined up. Looser mounts may feel better but could lead to driveline shifting/torquing engine which will be noticable with fan blade impacting shroud....................Last time I did a engine swap I mounted the rubber mounts to the engine mounts and then mounted some 3/8" bar stock plates with much larger bolt holes to the bottom of the rubber mounts with fender washers and lowered it into the frame into the proper position. I then tacked the plates to the frame and unbolted them from the engine mounts and lifted the engine back up. I then completely welded, braced and gusseted those plates to the frame. It was simple, strong, and worked well, but it isn't as pretty as alot of the CNC, jet cut, premade mounts that alot of custom builds used................................You'll figure it out, but for me ugly strong and properly placed is better than pretty and transmitting lots of vibes to the frame. Getting it to work without damage is not hard, but making it smooth and quiet is more difficult. To do the previous and make it look nice well those guys win car shows.

 

[lacalvette]

The long output shaft on the back of the gear box goes through the T-case.
In the T-case, the first gear to slide on it is the T-case input gear.
The gear box output shaft have long spline to engage the input gear and a pto gear.

I guess that the spline contact between the input gear and the output shaft may be weak when using a powerful engine. So some people weld the input gear and the pto gear together thus increasing spline contact. (Not 100% sure if the regular spacer has spline).

Not saying that this is a must. Just an possible upgrade.
Hope it make sense

 

[RHINO]

when i did the swap in my pig, i was also running a 4.7 toybox crawler and the stock 4 speed case, then add 37" tires to the mix, you see where i'm going.

maybe i have a soft foot on the skinny pedal, but i never had a lick of trouble with the shafts or gears or anything in that rig.

 

[theglobb]

All about the bell housing/adapter plate today. Went to test-fit it andddd... clearance issues with the firewall. This was solved by about 15 minutes of hammering. It feels bad to just hammer away on an old cruiser but this troopy is so rusty that in the next couple of years of body work it has ahead of it... this is nothing haha.

A closer look at the 2 adapter plates being used to adapt the Toyota transmission to the Isuzu bellhousing.

wont slide onto the input shaft all the way... time to hammer

The aftermath, but it fits now!

Thats all today, hopefully more progress tomorrow!

 

[RHINO]

i knew a simple plate adaptor could work with the longer B input shaft, good job!

but it woulda been cool to watch you make a steel bellhousing like we talked about.

 

[theglobb]

The long output shaft on the back of the gear box goes through the T-case.
In the T-case, the first gear to slide on it is the T-case input gear.
The gear box output shaft have long spline to engage the input gear and a pto gear.

I guess that the spline contact between the input gear and the output shaft may be weak when using a powerful engine. So some people weld the input gear and the pto gear together thus increasing spline contact. (Not 100% sure if the regular spacer has spline).

Not saying that this is a must. Just an possible upgrade.
Hope it make sense

Thank you for taking the time to explain this in depth to me! I can understand it much better now. At the moment I'm obviously prioritizing other things but if some massive roadblock with the swap happens then I might just give it a shot!

when i did the swap in my pig, i was also running a 4.7 toybox crawler and the stock 4 speed case, then add 37" tires to the mix, you see where i'm going.

maybe i have a soft foot on the skinny pedal, but i never had a lick of trouble with the shafts or gears or anything in that rig.

Sweet, good to know. I guess we will see what happens. How many miles did u put on ur rig with the 4BD1T?

 

[RHINO]

Sweet, good to know. I guess we will see what happens. How many miles did u put on ur rig with the 4BD1T?

oh geez, well not hundreds of thousand but at least a couple tens of thousand

edit, absolutely loved it, that engine is amazing IMOP,,, but ultimately i developed an adversion to diesel fuel for some reason and just could never get the smell out of my nose.

i ran a 3" exhaust right from the turbo down pipe with a straight through glass muffler and it sounded great, not loud at all, really let the turbo whine.

 

[FJBen]

oh geez, well not hundreds of thousand but at least a couple tens of thousand

edit, absolutely loved it, that engine is amazing IMOP,,, but ultimately i developed an adversion to diesel fuel for some reason and just could never get the smell out of my nose.

i ran a 3" exhaust right from the turbo down pipe with a straight through glass muffler and it sounded great, not loud at all, really let the turbo whine.

I need to finish my exhaust. Trying to figure which muffler to use so it’s not frito lay van annoying, but still sounds good

 

[RHINO]

I need to finish my exhaust. Trying to figure which muffler to use so it’s not frito lay van annoying, but still sounds good

i dont remember wich one i used, but it was blue pretty sure it was a Walker Blue Streak