Rice's 1FZ-FE rebuild Thread (2 Viewers)

[Rice]

Bringing you up to real time, including some setbacks.

First .... what is proper method to installing studs? Once the stud depth is measured apply blue loctite to the stud threads and thread them in. Place head gasket and head on the engine and torque to 29 Ft Lb. Then leave it overnight. This pulls the studs against the threads to cure and insures the studs are vertical.

Next day .... Now perform the final torque sequence, in this case 90 degrees plus 90 degrees.

The bad news .... During the final sequence I was 80 degrees of 90 degrees into stud #11 of 14 and heard a pop. I finished torquing the head and all the studs are holding torque but the pop is causing me to lose sleep. Head gasket number 2 should be here today and the head is coming back off to investigate. Will report back if/when I have some news.

 

[roadstr6]

Fingers crossed, Rice...that sucks.

 

[elkaholic]

X2

Fingers crossed, Rice...that sucks.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

A pop?

Sure that the studs weren't bottomed out in the block?

You can pull a single stud after all are torqued to inspect and then reinstall without replacing the head gasket. That's what I'd start with to minimize the work involved and that would show you whether or not your stud broke!

 

[Rice]

A pop?

Sure that the studs weren't bottomed out in the block?

You can pull a single stud after all are torqued to inspect and then reinstall without replacing the head gasket. That's what I'd start with to minimize the work involved and that would show you whether or not your stud broke!

You will not be pulling a stud that is loctited into place without pulling the head. No, the stud is not bottomed. In that the stud is holding torque there is little chance it is the problem. Remaining possibles become a cracked block (not likely on an inline 6), cracked head (more likely), or a washer that was not flush.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

You will not be pulling a stud that is loctited into place without pulling the head. No, the stud is not bottomed. In that the stud is holding torque there is little chance it is the problem. Remaining possibles become a cracked block (not likely on an inline 6), cracked head (more likely), or a washer that was not flush.

The studs have the hex driver in the top, correct? You thinking double-nut method is the only way to get it out?

I thought that the studs were supposed to be lubricated on both sides with lube or clean engine oil when installing, not loctited into the block.

 

[Rice]

The studs have the hex driver in the top, correct? You thinking double-nut method is the only way to get it out?

I thought that the studs were supposed to be lubricated on both sides with lube or clean engine oil when installing, not loctited into the block.

Hex Driver = yes. Not likely to be able to unlock the stud.

Loctite on head studs is sometimes dictated by the application and sometimes by preference. 1st gen chevy engines have open holes that enter into the water jacket. Loctite is required there to prevent leaking. Toyota does not have open holes so my decision was a preference based on never wanting the stud to twist and change its height, i.e. stud is always 3.275" above the deck.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Hex Driver = yes. Not likely to be able to unlock the stud.

Loctite on head studs is sometimes dictated by the application and sometimes by preference. 1st gen chevy engines have open holes that enter into the water jacket. Loctite is required there to prevent leaking. Toyota does not have open holes so my decision was a preference based on never wanting the stud to twist and change its height, i.e. stud is always 3.275" above the deck.

Gotcha, thanks for explaining Makes sense!

 

[Rice]

Sorry, wish I had something to report. The school week has me buttoned down until at least Friday.
New head gasket arrived Monday and I have found a local speed shop that says they can check the head for cracks but otherwise I wait.

 

[weejub]

**nervous**

 

[NCFJ]

Pour chicken's blood in cylinder #3 while scratching the oil pan with a turkey's claw. Then burn a Wren's nest on top of the intake and you should be good to go. Obviously, all prior to disassembly.

 

[OGBeno]

Updates Rice?

 

[Rice]

Updates Rice?

Still waiting for Friday to get here so I can commit some time to it.

 

[Rice]

Greetings all.

I managed a couple hours on the 1FZ yesterday. Pulled the head to give a close inspection. What I found left me feeling at ease. From the looks of it I did a nice job putting torque lube on the threads but I was too stingy on the washers. There were scuff marks between the washer and the head where the washer turned. Much like a pop you would get from dry lug nuts I'm fairly comfortable that's what happened.

I gave Ben a call this morning to get his thoughts on this and he says absolutely. There is no reasonable way the block cracked and it's very unlikely the head cracked. So we're going forward.

In the end I'm still glad I pulled the head back off. The washers that came with the ARP studs have a very small outside diameter which concerned me from the start. The extreme pressure on the soft aluminum resulted in the washers sinking into the head by a couple thousandths .... which means my final torque values (90 degrees plus 90 degrees) were not delivering an accurate yield. (Ruben @70Cruza I am curious to learn if this could have played into the situation you described with your motor)

So from here I will go back back with a new head gasket, an ample amount of assembly lube, and I will be using the OEM head washers.


Back to the beginning .... "old" head gasket

Re-clean the block and head to make sure no oils on the mating surfaces and will be ready to go back:

Head gasket for sale cheap. Only used once.

Relative size of washers. ARP = small. OEM = Large. Nut included for reference:

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Sweet!! Head is on!

 

[fj40z]

Good news Rice!!

 

[Rice]

Followup to the ARP washers ..... It appears this is the very question Ryan (@scottryana) posed some time ago in the 80's tech section and I missed it when doing build research.

Head bolt washer diameter

Since these studs were made for Supra's that's the next place I went to look .... same story. Supra guys say that given enough boost they have had the head "lift", thus the gasket is toasted:

The great ARP Head Stud Washer debate

 

[NCFJ]

Glad to hear the good news

 

[scottryana]

Rice, you can reuse the stock washer or you can order larger ARP washers singularly. I don't have the number with me, but if you do need it let me know.

*Edit - wait did I read that you were torquing the ARP studs by angle? I haven't actually had time to read the whole thread but the ARP studs should just be torqued to ft/lbs.

** You guys hide some pretty good stuff in this NC forum, like the turbo thread I had no idea this was here.**

Followup to the ARP washers ..... It appears this is the very question Ryan (@scottryana) posed some time ago in the 80's tech section and I missed it when doing build research.

Head bolt washer diameter

Since these studs were made for Supra's that's the next place I went to look .... same story. Supra guys say that given enough boost they have had the head "lift", thus the gasket is toasted:

The great ARP Head Stud Washer debate

 

[lt1fire]

Engine Pron on monday morning is always a good way to start the week. Great build up Rice!