New style rear control arms that will offer better and smoother articulation

[TRAIL TAILOR]

Does Tom Wayes buggy get 20,000 miles on it each year? Can you elaborate on your experience with curie joints blowing out fast?

I've never found a heim regardless if its a FK, rough stuff or budget basement brand that doesn't eventually get some level of play in it. Shock load plus environmental factors such as abrasive grit, moisture take their toll, nothing is immune to the forces of nature. Yes some are much better than others, but you pay dearly for that.

And i currently run FK's on my 3 link, one of which has noticeable play after two years in service.

I'd like to know as well since Currie has a couple of race rigs that have the same joints on them for over two years (per them). They may have rebuilt them, but still running same outer casings and balls.

Do a search on Pirate, Jeep, TacoWorld and the FK are notorious for snapping off and or bending.

 

[nukegoat]

I'd like to know as well since Currie has a couple of race rigs that have the same joints on them for over two years (per them). They may have rebuilt them, but still running same outer casings and balls.

Do a search on Pirate, Jeep, TacoWorld and the FK are notorious for snapping off and or bending.

Please provide those links from pirate on FK heims snapping off. I sure as hell haven't seen them.

 

[Sc0-]

OEM are bonded sleeve

Talking about sleeving the links themselves to allow rotation between ends. Kind of like how a pintle rotates on a trailer tongue in a military application.

 

[maxamillion2345]

Does Tom Wayes buggy get 20,000 miles on it each year? Can you elaborate on your experience with curie joints blowing out fast?

I've never found a heim regardless if its a FK, rough stuff or budget basement brand that doesn't eventually get some level of play in it. Shock load plus environmental factors such as abrasive grit, moisture take their toll, nothing is immune to the forces of nature. Yes some are much better than others, but you pay dearly for that.

And i currently run FK's on my 3 link, one of which has noticeable play after two years in service.

Tom's buggy racks up a lot of extremely hard miles. Racing is a whole different game.

My buddy has had some of Toms hand me downs on his rig for the last few years and that gets beat hard as well and they're still tight.

The JJs creeper joints enduro joints etc etc are all basically the same. My enduro joints lasted I would say roughly 8000 miles before devetloping appreciable slop. Other local guys here have had the same experience with every joint.

I won't run joints again. All the heims on my rig are still tight. But maybe beating on joints with 40s a 3 link and cummins is a little different idk. Everything wears out but I'd just stick with rubber or poly bushings on a stock suspension. Heims on a 3/4 link.

 

[-Spike-]

Breaking out the sawzall next...

Do yourself a favor and get a carbide blade if you haven't already. I tried several high-quality bi-metal blades on a similar situation on Tundra front control arms and wore the teeth off immediately, barely scratched the bushing tube. Got a Diablo carbide blade at Home Depot and cut them like buttah.

 

[maxamillion2345]

Bending strength is not the issue generally for suspension arms. Deformation from impact and subsequent weakness is the issue. I don't have a dog in this fight, just pointing out that a material that resists denting is going to be superior than one that resists bending

Which is why I have 2" .250 wall DOM links. .188 is probably not enough but that was just an example. I'm not worried about denting my .250 wall at all. Bending is a concern though and theres even some that claim that 2" .250 is not enough. I've never bent a link personally. If I do I'll step it up to 2.25 .375 wall. Theres always chromo and heat treat too, that really keeps the dings and scrapes away.

 

[Box Rocket]

FWIW, I had roughly 15k miles on the Trail Tailor arms with Currie joints with a decent amount of wheeling miles before I removed them and they were still tight.

 

[scrowley]

On the MT one end is a jonny joint and the other is poly, correct?

Metal tech axle side bushings are garbage. Junk after each wheeling season. Same in other friends rigs. But nice arm otherwise.

 

[SmokingRocks]

Tom's buggy racks up a lot of extremely hard miles. Racing is a whole different game.

My buddy has had some of Toms hand me downs on his rig for the last few years and that gets beat hard as well and they're still tight.

The JJs creeper joints enduro joints etc etc are all basically the same. My enduro joints lasted I would say roughly 8000 miles before devetloping appreciable slop. Other local guys here have had the same experience with every joint.

I won't run joints again. All the heims on my rig are still tight. But maybe beating on joints with 40s a 3 link and cummins is a little different idk. Everything wears out but I'd just stick with rubber or poly bushings on a stock suspension. Heims on a 3/4 link.

I can see why heims would be the racing choice, they offer the most hard wired connection. What that means is you feel every hit the joint takes, which can be fatiguing in a rig that is driven to the trail and back home after. Jonny Joints or any ball in bushing joint IMO is the split between rubber bushings and heims.

Anyway I just finished my tire rotation, oil change and shaft/joint lube session and here's what I can report:

• One of 6 FK has some play in it (4 steering link ends, 2 front 3-link uca)
• One of 2 Curie JJ's 1.25" needs to be rebuilt (front 3 link LCA frame side mounts)
• Two sleeved poly bushings frame side rear UCA's are completely toast
• Two Heims axle side rear UCA's are shot

Front 3 link set up has ~30,000mi of driving to trails, on trails and home again
Man-a-fre rear UCA's have ~50,000 mi on them... And those are my first priority to change out.

 

[richardlillard1]

It’s been my experience that a joint which can be rebuilt will need to be rebuilt. Often at an inopportune time. Like the climb up and over the camelback on Hotel Rock, the second day of your seven day vacation through Utah.

Thanks a heap, ballistic.

 

[SmokingRocks]

That looks like a failure which could have been prevented. There should be a lock stud in the collar, if installed correctly it should not back out. Sucks that it happened though.

 

[richardlillard1]

That looks like a failure which could have been prevented. There should be a lock stud in the collar, if installed correctly it should not back out. Sucks that it happened though.

Everything was tightened down and the lock screws were tightened down when they were installed in December of 2017. It didn’t stop them from backing out and when I talked to a couple locals who have used these joints on their rigs, they’ve had the same issues. One of them even needing to go so far as tacking the lock down collars in place, thus eliminating the ability to rebuilt the joints in the future without grinding said welds off.

So I want to agree with you, but that just isn’t the case.

To be completely fair, the joint did hold up for about 15,000 miles between December and May (I drive the truck a lot; daily driving a 3-linked Land Cruiser, the horror!) and did quite a few trail days before failing. It still shouldn’t have been an issue, in my opinion.

That said, it was still only one small issue compared to the other problems I’ve had with those joints and that company’s crap idea of customer service.

 

[SmokingRocks]

All good points, after reading all the experiences and having lived with a 3 linked heim heavy rig I think I am leaning towards the sealed SPC joint. After all it is the only joint other than OEM that I haven't had issues with.

 

[maxamillion2345]

It’s been my experience that a joint which can be rebuilt will need to be rebuilt. Often at an inopportune time. Like the climb up and over the camelback on Hotel Rock, the second day of your seven day vacation through Utah.

Thanks a heap, ballistic.
View attachment 1741704

Yep! Thats where I'm at with rebuildable joints.

 

[richardlillard1]

All good points, after reading all the experiences and having lived with a 3 linked heim heavy rig I think I am leaning towards the sealed SPC joint. After all it is the only joint other than OEM that I haven't had issues with.

I would be curious to try a dual durometer bushing like that at some point, but I think I might have better luck with the FK heims so I’ll run those next. Especially given that on the jeeps I wheel with that’s about the only thing which they aren’t breaking.

 

[bwesty]

View attachment 1741706 View attachment 1741707
Yep! Thats where I'm at with rebuildable joints.

View attachment 1741706 View attachment 1741707

I will gladly continue using the OEM Toyota rubber for greatest reliability and less noise and vibrations vs those rebuildable units or poly.

 

[SmokingRocks]

I would be curious to try a dual durometer bushing like that at some point, but I think I might have better luck with the FK heims so I’ll run those next. Especially given that on the jeeps I wheel with that’s about the only thing which they aren’t breaking.

Fair enough and based on my experience they are just as durable as the other joints if and more so if you get good units... I just hate the squeaking, creaking, pops when turning into the starbucks parking lot. I get tired of lubing my heims

 

[richardlillard1]

Yep! Thats where I'm at with rebuildable joints.

View attachment 1741706 View attachment 1741707

Now try getting those joints off the truck when the uniball is made of some soft 303 stainless BS and it deforms to clamp down on the bolt whenever you apply 130ft lbs or more to the fasteners. What a delight.

There are still joints stuck on my truck, which will need to be cut off before new joints can be put in place. That’s sure to be a happy fun time with no issues or swearing involved.

 

[baldilocks]

All photos of Joint failures have one thing in common - the appearance of being dry - greaseless.

 

[maxamillion2345]

I will gladly continue using the OEM Toyota rubber for greatest reliability and less noise and vibrations vs those rebuildable units or poly.

I guess that was ultimately my point. I'd avoid getting too crazy swapping joints/ends with the stock link setup. Building stronger thicker bigger links is not a bad idea though!