New style rear control arms that will offer better and smoother articulation (1 Viewer)

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LandCruiserPhil

Peter Pan Syndrome
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Time to upgrade and build some new rear upper and lower control arms. Looking for guys with experience and feedback on SPC Xaxis sealed joints. I will be using the SPC joints on both ends. SPC and others make control arms using the Xaxis but only use one end and use Poly on the other end. Seems like a step in the wrong direction giving poly dont flex near as good as the OEM rubber and have been known to stress control arms to the point of breakage.

Talked with several guys running control arms with all kind of joints and the only ones that have claimed to notice or feel the difference would be those with heim joints all other say no increase in noise or vibrations.

Thoughts?



Not actual sized joint I will be using below just for illustration propose.

1496682323887
 
A semi parallel 4 link usually needs another degree of freedom. Simply put, the joints often want to misalign in a way that allows minute variations in control arm length. Rubber bushings work well because they misalign as much as they squish radially - the rubber does all the work.

At any rate, go for it, but I doubt theyll last long or offer any advantages
 
A semi parallel 4 link usually needs another degree of freedom. Simply put, the joints often want to misalign in a way that allows minute variations in control arm length. Rubber bushings work well because they misalign as much as they squish radially - the rubber does all the work.

At any rate, go for it, but I doubt theyll last long or offer any advantages

My current set uses OEM bushing under full flex they are not happy and are short lived because of it. I see the advantage being the replacement joints are less costly than the OEM rubber as a whole and the SPC offer somewhat rebuildable abilities. Because the OEM style is a captured bushing they add resistance as they cycle the SPC will allow free movement.


The other concern is currently my links are ~1.75 dia with .375" walls and can take a hit. The new set up will be lighter at 1.5" x .250". Will I be able to bend the new set up in my mall travels?

Pictured below is the front control arm bushings but the rear control bushings have the same nasty look under full flex and are not happy.

img_7308-jpg.892135
 
All due respect to og Phil and not to rain on the parade here but if this is the same spc that makes upper control arms for other makes/models, it’s made in china junk. Iirc they used stamped, rolled steel. Wasn’t pretty.

Even my $100 steel wheel is made in the USA.

The 80 deserves better.
 
My current set uses OEM bushing under full flex they are not happy and are short lived because of it. I see the advantage being the replacement joints are less costly than the OEM rubber as a whole and the SPC offer somewhat rebuildable abilities. Because the OEM style is a captured bushing they add resistance as they cycle the SPC will allow free movement.


The other concern is currently my links are ~1.75 dia with .375" walls and can take a hit. The new set up will be lighter at 1.5" x .250". Will I be able to bend the new set up in my mall travels?

Pictured below is the front control arm bushings but the rear control bushings have the same nasty look under full flex and are not happy.

img_7308-jpg.892135
But you are missing my point - the bushings allow non concentric misalignment which is needed in the oem geometry. Spherical joints do not.

Anyway, if this thread is for your marketing purposes then feel free to let all your arizona wheeling buddies come on in and talk about how they got their prototypes and how rad they were. If you really want my opinion then I think you would need to delete a rear link with your proposed setup to be kinematically unbound

And 1.5x.25 is way weak. Sleeved oem control arms would be stronger. Why not 2x.25 ?
 
But you are missing my point - the bushings allow non concentric misalignment which is needed in the oem geometry. Spherical joints do not.

Anyway, if this thread is for your marketing purposes then feel free to let all your arizona wheeling buddies come on in and talk about how they got their prototypes and how rad they were. If you really want my opinion then I think you would need to delete a rear link with your proposed setup to be kinematically unbound

And 1.5x.25 is way weak. Sleeved oem control arms would be stronger. Why not 2x.25 ?

Im not missing your point I dont understand ...can you bring down to a level for an easier understanding foe the uneducated. I dont understand how it can be different than the other over the counter set up available?

No interest in any marketing or future product development, this is 100% personal needs/wants.

I dont know any AZ guys with anything other than OEM bushing or links with a jonny on one end and poly on the other?

Sleeved is what I have now. 1.5 x .250 was an easy fit for the weld in bungs I found for the size ends.
 
Phil, are you planning to use these joints in both ends? I think that may be the concern, you will need something at one end to allow linear misalignment.
 
All due respect to og Phil and not to rain on the parade here but if this is the same spc that makes upper control arms for other makes/models, it’s made in china junk. Iirc they used stamped, rolled steel. Wasn’t pretty.

Even my $100 steel wheel is made in the USA.

The 80 deserves better.

Correct Im not trying to cheap out they make a lot of links and people like Slee that sell them. Where is all the bad press I missed? Are any of joints made in the USA?
 
Phil, are you planning to use these joints in both ends? I think that may be the concern, you will need something at one end to allow linear misalignment.

Yes that was my though but again no understand the linear misalignment terminology.:doh:
 
Rubber bushings allow for twist, but they also allow slight link stretch/compression, which happens when 4 links fight each other. Changes in length, in other words.
 
Im not missing your point I dont understand ...can you bring down to a level for an easier understanding foe the uneducated. I dont understand how it can be different than the other over the counter set up available?

No interest in any marketing or future product development, this is 100% personal needs/wants.

I dont know any AZ guys with anything other than OEM bushing or links with a jonny on one end and poly on the other?

Sleeved is what I have now. 1.5 x .250 was an easy fit for the weld in bungs I found for the size ends.
I have some meteltech rears i have not installed yet.
 
I'm in the market for bushing all around as well. I will be following this as I usually like the direction Phil likes to take things.
I wish this was available for us. I had them on a previous Jeep and it rode great, was very quiet, and took out binding during articulation. Gyro joint from Nth Degree.
129_0603_04_z+2005_jeep_rubicon_unlimited+gyro_joints.jpg
gyro joint1.jpg
Gyro supported.jpg
QTnth2006h.jpg
 
He spoke of Jeep........ Is that allowed :lol:.
 
On the MT one end is a jonny joint and the other is poly, correct?

Yes. You don’t need the joint on both ends as the poly end doesn’t need to twist.

I installed the MT lowers and the comments from @nukegoat are spot on - it changed how the arms traveled and how the tires stuffed, which when working in millimeters of clearance matters. I reinstalled my Slee HD frankenarms. I still run MT uppers.

Honestly, if I was really going to mess with any of this I’d just do a Chevy 63” leaf conversion.

I also specifically don’t run super long shocks. My rear rubber bushings have been going strong for 10 years crushing mall speed bumps and the occasional foray into that rock crawling stuff.

Balance is a lot cheaper than super long travel.
 
I purchased a set of the SPC rear lower arms from Slee a few months ago. Granted I replaced stock arms, but the difference is noticeable. I mounted the sealed flex joints at the frame. Slee states it doesn't matter, but suggests this to get the joint out of the muck as much as possible.

Zero increase in noise/vibrations here.
 

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