Builds Moonshine - A Build Thread

[Hojack]

Actually had some time to start reading through your build thread Johnny. Only to page 7... a lot more to go but see the SOA stuff. Nice to see when doing these builds we all go through the same learning experience. Nice to have these build forums where we can get advice from those who’ve done this before. @boots4 has a boat load of knowledge.

 

[S4Cruiser]

??

Already have chevy 63" springs in the back

Fold down rear tire carrier??

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Fold down rear tire carrier??

Yes, figured since I was welding on the rear crossmember, might as well put those on Fold down tire carrier will be slick!

 

[mr jits]

Just finished reading your tow rig build thread, there's some salty folks on that Ferd site.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Just finished reading your tow rig build thread, there's some salty folks on that Ferd site.

Right? Jesus, it's worse than pirate sometimes. I very rarely ever go over there anymore.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Drove moonshine to work yesterday. Felt damn good to drive her again.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Only issue I have is that I cannot shift into rear low. I can shift into front high/neutral/low, and rear high/neutral, but low is not engaging. Does not matter if the front is in neutral or in low, I cannot put the rear in low.

After adjusting the cables (with no affect), and checking for interference, EDIT: I didn't find any. Rear shift rail will not go all the way into gear. It will move enough to engage the teeth, but not fully. When trying to move in RWD low, the case pops out of gear before the truck moves.

the only place I found that's interfering is the "rocker arm" that goes from the rear control cable up to the shift rail on the transfer case. It seems to be hitting the "retainer mount". See here:

http://www.northwestfab.com/assets/images/Installation Manuals/Installation Manual GM NP205 Shifter.pdf

Earlier in this process I modified the rear shift rail for twin sticks, but after reassembly, the transfer case shift tested normally on the bench, before I put it in the truck, so I don't think that's the issue. I used this process:

How to: NP 205 twin stick CHEAP! - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

@mr jits did you have this issue? I have a potential fix, but want your thoughts first.

EDIT: *sigh* the transfer case has to come out. ****. Hopefully I left myself enough room to remove it without dropping the transmission crossmember.

 

[cody c]

It looks like you built an under seat storage compartment on moonshine as well? More info or is that covered elsewhere? Always thought that would be a great addition.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

It looks like you built an under seat storage compartment on moonshine as well? More info or is that covered elsewhere? Always thought that would be a great addition.

It's a seat box from Wagon Gear @kevinmrowland wagongear.com

 

[cody c]

It's a seat box from Wagon Gear @kevinmrowland wagongear.com

Oh, sweet, I though he built his differently, but that is a good piece of kit to have.

I've wanted to do that on pretty much all the toyota's I've had since that thread, I have a "National" brand driver seat now which allows the seat bottom to fold forward against the steering wheel and has a storage box under it so it kind of scratches that itch, and that is a fair bit of work for the storage space achieved.

Edit: the fold down tire carrier sounds cool, the thing with those is you pretty much need a winch to lower especially with that size of tire. If you put springs or something to help with the weight then you gotta worry about it snapping up unloaded and taking someones finger on the way back up. I'm curious how your design will work for it, but we'll leave that for another day, you got lots on your plate.

 

[mr jits]

Only issue I have is that I cannot shift into rear low. I can shift into front high/neutral/low, and rear high/neutral, but low is not engaging. Does not matter if the front is in neutral or in low, I cannot put the rear in low.

After adjusting the cables (with no affect), and checking for interference, EDIT: I didn't find any. Rear shift rail will not go all the way into gear. It will move enough to engage the teeth, but not fully. When trying to move in RWD low, the case pops out of gear before the truck moves.

the only place I found that's interfering is the "rocker arm" that goes from the rear control cable up to the shift rail on the transfer case. It seems to be hitting the "retainer mount". See here:

http://www.northwestfab.com/assets/images/Installation Manuals/Installation Manual GM NP205 Shifter.pdf

Earlier in this process I modified the rear shift rail for twin sticks, but after reassembly, the transfer case shift tested normally on the bench, before I put it in the truck, so I don't think that's the issue. I used this process:

How to: NP 205 twin stick CHEAP! - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

@mr jits did you have this issue? I have a potential fix, but want your thoughts first.

EDIT: *sigh* the transfer case has to come out. f***. Hopefully I left myself enough room to remove it without dropping the transmission crossmember.

I had the same issue until I adjusted the shift cable properly. It takes a lot of force to engage the rear low output. Also, the 205 does not like being shifted stationary. A slow roll allows for much smoother shifting than being at a stop (obviously transmission in neutral, with no input to the cases, or the black box in neutral). I found from my own experience and from talking to others, that the 205 can be a finicky beast with cable shifters, but once they're adjusted properly, it shifts like butter.
difficulty shifting np205 - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I had the same issue until I adjusted the shift cable properly. It takes a lot of force to engage the rear low output. Also, the 205 does not like being shifted stationary. A slow roll allows for much smoother shifting than being at a stop (obviously transmission in neutral, with no input to the cases, or the black box in neutral). I found from my own experience and from talking to others, that the 205 can be a finicky beast with cable shifters, but once they're adjusted properly, it shifts like butter.
difficulty shifting np205 - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum

Have any tips for adjusting the cable properly? I've spent about two hours adjusting the rear cable now and still can't get it in gear, moving or not, neutral or not, regardless of the front output gear selection. I have put all my might into shifting into rear low, it's just not going in all the way.

If not, no worries, I'll keep working on it.

 

[mr jits]

Have any tips for adjusting the cable properly? I've spent about two hours adjusting the rear cable now and still can't get it in gear, moving or not, neutral or not, regardless of the front output gear selection. I have put all my might into shifting into rear low, it's just not going in all the way.

If not, no worries, I'll keep working on it.

I started with the rail in four low, and adjusted the cables from there (making absolutely sure the rail was all the way in). When you ground your rails for front digs, did you check to see how tight your detent balls are against the rails? Some folks put a small washer in there to reduce the pressure of the detent.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I started with the rail in four low, and adjusted the cables from there (making absolutely sure the rail was all the way in). When you ground your rails for front digs, did you check to see how tight your detent balls are against the rails? Some folks put a small washer in there to reduce the pressure of the detent.

The stock spring puts too much pressure on the detent ball? Now that's interesting. I'll test that out, thanks man.

Also, thanks for the tip about the cable adjustment. I can't get into 4 low, but I'll try that once I figure out how.

 

[mr jits]

The stock spring puts too much pressure on the detent ball? Now that's interesting. I'll test that out, thanks man.

Also, thanks for the tip about the cable adjustment. I can't get into 4 low, but I'll try that once I figure out how.

After the rail modification, you had no issues shifting, correct?
You were able to shift both rails smoothly with the cases on the bench/floor?
You attempted shifting with the truck stationary/moving?
Did you attempt, at all, shifting into low on the rear while the front was in high (or vice versa)? Very simply, doing so will bind the hell out of a 205. I did so on accident without having the ability to do a front dig and it was the better part of two hours to get the rear output to reengage (with the help of @boots4 ).

 

[GLTHFJ60]

After the rail modification, you had no issues shifting, correct?

Correct

You were able to shift both rails smoothly with the cases on the bench/floor?

Correct

You attempted shifting with the truck stationary/moving?

Correct

Did you attempt, at all, shifting into low on the rear while the front was in high (or vice versa)?

Once, yes, but I don't have any issues before or since, shifting the front between high/neutral/low, or the rear between high/neutral

Very simply, doing so will bind the hell out of a 205. I did so on accident without having the ability to do a front dig and it was the better part of two hours to get the rear output to reengage (with the help of @boots4 ).

Answers above. Going to go out and remove the rear shift rail detent and see if it will go into gear.

Really appreciate the help sir

 

[mr jits]

Answers above. Going to go out and remove the rear shift rail detent and see if it will go into gear.

Really appreciate the help sir

Any time. For me (other than the first time on trail with Boots and trying to shift the front output before the rear), my rear output issues was directly related to the cable shifter. I'm not sure if it was cable stretching/not having enough throw, but once I readjusted with the rail in the rear low position, I didn't have further issue.
You'll see it come up I believe two times in my build thread, but the first time was the first time on trail, the second was after removal of the transmission when I thought I'd broken it. Both times were remedied by adjusting the cable shifter with low range engaged.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Adjusted the cable so that 75% of the travel is pushing in towards the rear shift rail, to no avail. Removed the rear rail shift detent with no change, still wont go all the way into gear.

*sigh* I'll drop the transfer case and put in the new shift rails I ordered from nwf, and inspect the rear rail shift collar for damage.

Guess it's a good thing Logan's Run was canceled

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I'm such an idiot.

Tried again to shift the case with the cables disconnected and couldn't get into rear low even with a pry bar. Pulled the case out, which was surprisingly easy. Had it on the bench and my wife comes out, says "looks like the shift rail bolt is hitting the case". Turns out that the nut on the bolt that was holding the lever arm to the rear shift rail was hitting the case and preventing it from going all the way into gear. Put a pin with a cotter to hold it in place and we're good to go. Tested all shift patterns and there are now no issues. When I tested before, I didn't check to ensure that the rear rail was all the way in gear.

Frustrated that its a problem I caused, but very relieved that it was something simple to fix.

Will reinstall tomorrow.

New pin installed, now with ample clearance.

Offending bolt and nut. You can see, if you squint, the smushed edge of the nut.

 

[cruisermatt]

Hey, you need something to talk about around the campfire!!

Time to update the lineup in your signature