Best practices when installing a Driveshaft (Propeller shaft flange nuts, bolts, studs) (2 Viewers)

[Kernal]

So was in the middle of installing a new Toyota rear driveshaft (FZJ80) using new Toyota hardware and the thought came up, should we be using threadlocker, anti-seize, or nothing at all when using new hardware??

Checking the FSM there's no mention of using anything (anti-seize, threadlocker, etc) on these fasteners and the question of using a threadlocker (or anti-seize) for this application hasn't been discussed for awhile.

Background:

In a few past threads (2006, 2007, 2008) it was discussed that new Toyota nuts and bolts for this job come with a thin green coating on them. The specs for that coating don't appear to be published but the consensus was that it's a thread locking/sealing compound, similar in color (but appears to be thinner IMO) compared to what's found on the short end of new differential carrier studs for example.

Consider also that the original transfer case flange studs are not replaced when servicing/replacing the driveshaft (prop shaft), so there's no (new) factory (Dry) thread locking coating on those (but there appears to be some on new nuts).

Hardware:

There's a (Propeller shaft) Hexagon Bolt Set (90105-11H00) which consists of a bolt, nut, and washer, the bolt and nut have the green coating (see photo).

And if you order new Propeller Shaft nuts (90179-11005) for the transfer case flange studs they also appear to have the very thin green coating (see photo).

And last are the washers for the transfer case flange nuts (90201-11013) which appear to not have any green coating.

The nuts, bolts, and washers (front, rear) apparently have changed (part numbers) over the years, the parts gurus would know those details.

Questions:

Point is, can we assume that the reason the FSM doesn't indicate the use of a thread locking compound on those nuts and bolts is because it's not required and/or because new hardware already has it applied and/or because the nuts appear to be distorted thread lock nuts??

But then if someone reuses the old nuts and bolts (which appear not to be single use according to the FSM) can we assume thread locker should be used?? (AFAIK it's not discussed in the FSM)

Also, for the original transfer case flange studs, should anything be applied to those studs even when using new nuts (that come pre-coated)??


So just a few questions for the hive mind to ponder and a poll.

The first two photos show different views the same part number (kit 90105-11H00) :

The top photo appears to show an uneven amount of the coating on the threads:

If you click twice to magnify you can better see the green coating in the threads which appears more uniform on this bolt:

These last photos show a new Toyota (Propeller Shaft) Nut (90179-11005) which is available separately or comes with the kit above.

Top view:

The bottom views show the hexagon (deformed) shape of the lower threads, so it appears that this new unused nut may be a distorted thread type of lock nut.

Another view a bit more angled to better show the distorted threads of a new Toyota nut (click twice to magnify):

 

[Kernal]

So rephrased the title a bit, particularly because (other than the torque specs) the FSM doesn't mention using anything on the fasteners. The poll is geared toward what someone has used in the past.

Either way, it's all good
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If you look at the flange nuts in the photos above they appear to be a type of distorted thread locknut (? obround). What is different is that the deformed section is at the bottom of the nut/threads (IME most are either top lock where the deformed threads are at the top or in the middle of the nut).

Distorted thread locknut - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

FWIW here's a link for pre-applied (by the manufacturer) thread locking/sealing compound.

The green coating found on the new Toyota hardware may be somewhat similar to Loctite/Henkel DRI 202 pre-applied (dry) thread locking/sealing product (which is medium strength but green). It's pretty much available just to manufacturers in large volumes (buckets/pails).

LOCTITE® DRI 202

In high volume applications when using a liquid threadlocker isn’t feasible and you need threaded parts to be ready for immediate use, turn to LOCTITE® DRI 202 ECO. This 2-part, medium strength, general purpose threadlocker is pre-applied and activated during assembly, curing to provide...

next.henkel-adhesives.com

https://datasheets.tdx.henkel.com/LOCTITE-DRI-202-ECO-en_GL.pdf

 

[LandLocked93]

The diff in views appears to show a tapered alignment on the nut.
That said, I've not noticed it on my own diff flange bolts/nuts and have not used thread lock compound thereon. And I've had no issues as a result.

Not sure it matters either way.
Which is to say how difficult do you want the removal of said bolts/nuts to be in the case you want/need to remove them?
Thread lock compound will set them in place resulting in beyond OEM torque specs to remove. Which is irrelevant, really.
Personal preference overall imo.

 

[mudgudgeon]

I've never used thread locker on any of these bolts. Have had prop shafts out numerous times on all my Cruisers.
My current cruiser, the first time i removed the rear shaft, nuts where so tight i didn't think i was going to get them undone.
Some of the hardware was not original, so I ordered new hardware. Hadn't noticed the green coating.
Had similar experience with a previous cruiser

I've akways just used the arm-strong torque wrench or guedentite.
How do you get s proper torque wrench into this application?
I doubt I'd be tightening to the torque figures quoted, and never had any issues with them working loose.

 

[jonheld]

LOL. I use anti-seize on both front and rear drive shaft hardware, never used a torque wrench on them, and have done this for years. I purchased a long 14mm wrench that I use to remove the hardware, and install them with standard wrenches. I have never had any come loose and always need the long 14mm to get things off.

 

[MUDZLLA]

I've had driveshaft flange nuts come loose while highway driving with a couple go missing. Probably didn't install them properly in the first place. The vibration was a give-away before things got out of hand. Definitely need to tighten these suckers good and try to get them all torqued evenly by hand. No way to get a torque wrench on them though.

Not a fan of threadlocker in general so not the person to ask about that.

 

[Godwin]

I use blue thread locker, a long 14 mm wrench and a ratchet with an extension and this has always worked. I have had driveshaft fasteners loosen in the past but that would have due to insufficient tightening.

 

[jayp2]

I suppose it depends in part on whether you live in an area prone to rust or not.

If you do, you will never use thread locker on anything.....every new/used fastener on any vehicle gets hit with anti sieze lube before reinstall

 

[tmxmotorsports]

I can tell you never use red lock tight .I didn't think I was going to break them loose I to have a linger 14 mm 6 point wrench I use to loosen the bolts with and on some I have to double wrench them there so tight.

 

[SNLC]

Use a small torch (like a crackhead torch) to heat up a bolt/nut with loctite on it. The loctite melts.

I learned this nearly 20yrs ago working on a Pinzgauer. The Pinz has excellent FSMs just like Toyota. The Pinz uses loctite on nearly everything. The FSM straight up says use heat before removing bolts. Melt the loctite and bolts come right out.

Cheers

 

[manofthewoods]

Reserved

I pretty much put a drop of blue on everything, including my breakfast cereal. When I did my project (major rebuild/reset) a few years ago, I put a little on every bolt except internal stuff like head bolts.
And, yeah, I had to guess torque on those 14mm drive shaft nuts.
Call me crazy.

 

[Kernal]

"the first time i removed the rear shaft, nuts where so tight i didn't think i was going to get them undone."

FWIW I experienced the same when removing the original flange nuts on the rear propeller shaft of a 97 FZJ80. After repeated use of penetrating oil and some heat then using a Mid-range (up to ~200 ft lb) cordless impact wrench it would not budge half the bolts/nuts loose (time for a bigger impact wrench I guess). IIRC it was difficult to get a direct line with sockets and the impact wrench onto some of the bolts/nuts, had to use a wobble and you lose some impact force when using that IME.

Also could not get my longest ratcheting box wrench on the nuts or bolts because it just wouldn't fit.

But what did work however was leg power for the last couple of bolts (rear flange) that would not budge. I used a ~10" long closed box wrench and essentially stood on the wrench using my foot and leg power while laying on my back in the left rear wheel well. Only then did the stuck bolts/nuts come loose (Vehicle in Park, Transfer in Hi, Emergency Brake handle pulled).

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Others said:

"No way to get a torque wrench on them though"

"How do you get a proper torque wrench into this application"

FWIW: It was a bit of a pain but I got to all the nuts and bolts by getting to one or maybe two at a time then rotating the driveshaft for the next bolt or nut. I used a thin 14mm socket with a short (about 1 1/2") wobble type extension with the torque wrench. This was done with the Transmission in Park, Transfer in Neutral, Parking brake on full for the rear driveshaft.

Safety Note: the vehicle was up on 4-12 ton jack stands under the frame, two front and two rear, with wheels installed (so if it fell I wouldn't be totally squished). If the frame comes up off the jack stands (if you raise the axle further) the jack stands should be raised higher to fill the gap IMHO. FWIW

Technically the wobble extension could possibly result in a lower torque at the fastener than the setting of the wrench, but because it was a very short extension and it wasn't deviated more than a few degrees, the difference should be negligible, IMHO. (If this was a Mars Lander we'd consult with the Engineers to do the calculations before launch )

For the differential flange end I also held the nut with a 14mm box wrench to keep it from spinning.

The hard part was getting out from under the vehicle a bazillion times, then releasing the Parking brake, rotating a wheel (to rotate the propeller shaft), pulling the Parking brake back on, sliding back under the vehicle, torquing a nut or bolt, then getting out from under the vehicle --- and repeat until done. The other hard part was getting enough leverage on the torque wrench while under the vehicle, that was a bit of a challenge but you can use the floor jack to raise the axle to give you a bit more room to work.

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Point of all the above, these fasteners appeared to be installed very tightly at the factory (they did not appear stuck from corrosion) and there was no significant residue on the threads.

IMHO I think we have to assume that when Toyota installed the Propeller shafts originally they must have been installed using some type of calibrated torque wrench/tool ie: for safety/liability reasons. Hence the reason that the FSM has a listing for a torque spec for the nuts and bolts, front and rear.

Either way, can we assume that the original factory fasteners were coated with a pre-applied threadlocker/sealer as the new replacements appear to have??

FWIW here's a cut and paste from the Loctite DRI-202 threadlocker/sealer that may be somewhat similar to what Toyota puts on new hardware??

 

[77mustard40]

Pulled my Landtank front DC DS today to grease and get better access to the Y-Pipe flange bolts (exhaust leak), I had installed this DC about a year and a half ago with a touch of anti-seize on the hardware. Everything was still tight but manageable with std long handle box end wrenches. Reinstalled it the same way as I didn’t see anything that made me think I needed change my approach.