Just my dos centavos: If you want to really do a good job at restoring Land Cruisers, this is *most definitely* a corner of the Internet you will need to be visiting again.
Should I jump on this 62 or pass due to accident history?
- Thread starter nye307
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- Thread starter
- #22
Doesn't seem super helpful to be honest. Had a thread with a concrete question and the last four or five responses are about something entirely different, half of them disingenuous and snide. These trucks have been around a long time and they're relatively simple machines. I'll wager most everything has been figured out. I may need to read this forum, but I don't see much need to engage the community when these are the sort of responses I get.
I quickly scanned thru this thread, and didn't see where you said what the price would be, other than saying the price is right on this one.
if it is $1,000 buy it, if it is $5,000 I wouldn't but that is me, I'm kind of a bottom feeder
the trans rebuild can add up quick,
pricing right now, is all over the place.
a well done fairly stock rig with tasteful mods, whether 60 or 62 series will almost always fetch the highest price
a 62 with an H55 will sell better than a 62 with auto here on this forum
check out some recent for sale threads here in the classifieds for guidance on what rigs are selling for
forum.ih8mud.com
if it is $1,000 buy it, if it is $5,000 I wouldn't but that is me, I'm kind of a bottom feeder
the trans rebuild can add up quick,
pricing right now, is all over the place.
a well done fairly stock rig with tasteful mods, whether 60 or 62 series will almost always fetch the highest price
a 62 with an H55 will sell better than a 62 with auto here on this forum
check out some recent for sale threads here in the classifieds for guidance on what rigs are selling for
FJ60 | FJ62 | BJ60 | HJ61
Classifieds : Toyota 60-series / 61-series / 62-series Land Cruiser
forum.ih8mud.com
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- Thread starter
- #24
Thanks @3_puppies , definitely helpful!
I try not to talk prices because I'm concerned the comments section during a sale may lead back to a thread where I mentioned what I got it for or what the refurbishment budget was. There might be a little bit of "well if he got it for X I'm not paying Y". I'll say was a very fair price. Adding on a conservative (high) estimate for a transmission rebuild it would have landed lower than what I was seeing for asking prices for other, similar condition 62s.
The problem is if that accident history lowers the sale price by an unknown amount it's just not worth investing all that time into. I was hoping for a general consensus that nobody cares on a restored truck but that's kind of the opposite of what I gathered from asking around in various places
I try not to talk prices because I'm concerned the comments section during a sale may lead back to a thread where I mentioned what I got it for or what the refurbishment budget was. There might be a little bit of "well if he got it for X I'm not paying Y". I'll say was a very fair price. Adding on a conservative (high) estimate for a transmission rebuild it would have landed lower than what I was seeing for asking prices for other, similar condition 62s.
The problem is if that accident history lowers the sale price by an unknown amount it's just not worth investing all that time into. I was hoping for a general consensus that nobody cares on a restored truck but that's kind of the opposite of what I gathered from asking around in various places
That particular 62 has some pretty bad rust, and if that much is visible and fully rotted out, there is a lot more hiding. It needs a lot of mechanical base lining too which add$ up quick! I would keep looking and be willing to spend a little more for less rust. 
And accident history wouldn't phase me, personally, if title isn't salvage.
And accident history wouldn't phase me, personally, if title isn't salvage.
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You mentioned "bidders". If the idea is to put the finished product on BAT for the purpose of fetching top dollar then yes, I believe the carfax history will diminish the value.
Dont take these contributions to your plan as disingenuous, these responses are just honest and to the point, and accurate. Please take the wealth (and years) of land cruiser experience to heart from this site, as well as the work-life advice as its meant as genuine help as no-one wants to see you take a financial hit on a vehicle resto, just looking casually at the truck i see easily 15k to get it to some standard of sell-ability.
You need to understand that when WE 'restore' these trucks for ourselves we (usually) LOSE money on the prospect as a whole, its just the nature of doing this properly. You would be better off doing this work for people who already own these trucks, and billing per hour or as a quote price. Much better prospect of making money, and you know that you wont lose 100+hrs of work money and time on a bad BAT (or other) sale.
You need to understand that when WE 'restore' these trucks for ourselves we (usually) LOSE money on the prospect as a whole, its just the nature of doing this properly. You would be better off doing this work for people who already own these trucks, and billing per hour or as a quote price. Much better prospect of making money, and you know that you wont lose 100+hrs of work money and time on a bad BAT (or other) sale.
- Thread starter
- #29
Reading through the comments some of them appear genuine, others... not so much. Which is really more befitting a facebook group than a technical automotive forum IMO.
My back is against a wall and a friend of mine threw me a lifeline by offering to show me the finer points of something he's been successful at. I have covered under a carport in my backyard about $40,000 worth of pristine restored Mercedes W126 (actually worth maybe 10k on a good day) that took four years and change to get to that point. So I get how expensive and all consuming restoring a car can be. At the same time, I've seen someone do it for a profit consistently over the past couple of years. And I look back on my experience with my 126 and think had I not been living in an apartment and could have done X,Y,Z myself or had I not insisted on sheepskin flooring or putting MLV in every conceivable place or high end speakers or having the best guy in the country redo my wood veneer... realistically I probably could have done it for a hell of a lot less.
I've looked at this from a variety of angles and both feel its viable and worth gambling what's ultimately only a few thousand dollars. I would be just as unemployed if I wasn't doing this, at least this way I'm having fun and am occupied. I do appreciate the concern from those who expressed it genuinely but the bandwagoning is not particularly helpful.
My back is against a wall and a friend of mine threw me a lifeline by offering to show me the finer points of something he's been successful at. I have covered under a carport in my backyard about $40,000 worth of pristine restored Mercedes W126 (actually worth maybe 10k on a good day) that took four years and change to get to that point. So I get how expensive and all consuming restoring a car can be. At the same time, I've seen someone do it for a profit consistently over the past couple of years. And I look back on my experience with my 126 and think had I not been living in an apartment and could have done X,Y,Z myself or had I not insisted on sheepskin flooring or putting MLV in every conceivable place or high end speakers or having the best guy in the country redo my wood veneer... realistically I probably could have done it for a hell of a lot less.
I've looked at this from a variety of angles and both feel its viable and worth gambling what's ultimately only a few thousand dollars. I would be just as unemployed if I wasn't doing this, at least this way I'm having fun and am occupied. I do appreciate the concern from those who expressed it genuinely but the bandwagoning is not particularly helpful.
To qualify my statements and my background...
I had restored a '67 alfa gtv in 1986/7 (I know brain damaged). As a broke college student I chose to daily drive the alfa which quickly lead to a 4runner purchase and sale of that pos italian marvel. Had a couple 60 series I drove up to 1997 then jumped into a niche that I thought would pan out but was a decade plus early for the "LV" market. I bought a total of twenty-three fj45 wagons (half those under $1,500) and horse traded a fair number of 40, 55, and 60's. Parted majority of the wagons before selling out and moving a thousand miles a couple times. I worked with a number of the active shops at that time and was "in the circle" selling 45 parts worldwide. Learned a lot.
One of the the most import lessons after being 'taken' by a respected local body shop on a wagon repair gone wrong was bodywork and rust repair. You presented a FJ62 to fix and flip with a lot of rust. Some of those sections are only double layer but some triple and none are single layer. To be safe, a minimum 1" beyond rust should be replaced. Aluminum filler can be used but there is a balance to get things to point where they don't reappear. That is before fill and skim just to get to paint. Good paint materials are $$$. Color matching a 36 year old truck will be tough. Not a beginner job. Respraying the whole truck is going to cost coin.
On the other end of the spectrum is Greg Mushro. I had a private tour of his place a decade ago off hours by an employee and was shocked. Mushro came in to the LC market around 2000 and has bilked hundreds if not thousands of buyers into buying shiat. His employees are directed to turn and burn the repairs. Bondo is king and cheap paint is used on all parts, metal, plastic, and upolstery. Don't be that guy.
I know this is a 6x forum, but to be honest the trucks other than fitting a queen size futon in back are rough to drive. In 1981 the 60 was introduced in the US with vacuum attempt to make a tractor engine EPA compliant. In 1988 the "EFI" 62 came in ditching the carb. Poor fuel economy, a 4 speed for the "55 mph" mandated roads followed by the anemic automatic transmission in the 62 only makes that worse. Toyota's largest flaw was never offering the turbo six cylinder diesel with cast iron 5 speed in NA. If you are talented you may rebuild the auto (check the output wear!) and tcase and mechanically get that back on road. Or you farm that out and must deal with time, parts restrictions etc to get truck back on road. At 230,000 miles will you service the drivelines laying on shop floor or just replace with olde flange hardware? Good buyers will notice.
I also offer this. We may see a precipitous decline in collector car interest in the next few years, maybe months. The covid heyday is gone. I have a buddy with a Rover shop and peak sales are off nearly 50%. Your buddy may have made some good deals but like house flipping there must be a market and your investment/profit must be realistic. You have a kid at home and need to make sure your family comes first.
I had restored a '67 alfa gtv in 1986/7 (I know brain damaged). As a broke college student I chose to daily drive the alfa which quickly lead to a 4runner purchase and sale of that pos italian marvel. Had a couple 60 series I drove up to 1997 then jumped into a niche that I thought would pan out but was a decade plus early for the "LV" market. I bought a total of twenty-three fj45 wagons (half those under $1,500) and horse traded a fair number of 40, 55, and 60's. Parted majority of the wagons before selling out and moving a thousand miles a couple times. I worked with a number of the active shops at that time and was "in the circle" selling 45 parts worldwide. Learned a lot.
One of the the most import lessons after being 'taken' by a respected local body shop on a wagon repair gone wrong was bodywork and rust repair. You presented a FJ62 to fix and flip with a lot of rust. Some of those sections are only double layer but some triple and none are single layer. To be safe, a minimum 1" beyond rust should be replaced. Aluminum filler can be used but there is a balance to get things to point where they don't reappear. That is before fill and skim just to get to paint. Good paint materials are $$$. Color matching a 36 year old truck will be tough. Not a beginner job. Respraying the whole truck is going to cost coin.
On the other end of the spectrum is Greg Mushro. I had a private tour of his place a decade ago off hours by an employee and was shocked. Mushro came in to the LC market around 2000 and has bilked hundreds if not thousands of buyers into buying shiat. His employees are directed to turn and burn the repairs. Bondo is king and cheap paint is used on all parts, metal, plastic, and upolstery. Don't be that guy.
I know this is a 6x forum, but to be honest the trucks other than fitting a queen size futon in back are rough to drive. In 1981 the 60 was introduced in the US with vacuum attempt to make a tractor engine EPA compliant. In 1988 the "EFI" 62 came in ditching the carb. Poor fuel economy, a 4 speed for the "55 mph" mandated roads followed by the anemic automatic transmission in the 62 only makes that worse. Toyota's largest flaw was never offering the turbo six cylinder diesel with cast iron 5 speed in NA. If you are talented you may rebuild the auto (check the output wear!) and tcase and mechanically get that back on road. Or you farm that out and must deal with time, parts restrictions etc to get truck back on road. At 230,000 miles will you service the drivelines laying on shop floor or just replace with olde flange hardware? Good buyers will notice.
I also offer this. We may see a precipitous decline in collector car interest in the next few years, maybe months. The covid heyday is gone. I have a buddy with a Rover shop and peak sales are off nearly 50%. Your buddy may have made some good deals but like house flipping there must be a market and your investment/profit must be realistic. You have a kid at home and need to make sure your family comes first.
I have seen a ton of people buy a 60 because of the look or the idea or a cool fantasy. Then the reality of driving these beasts hit. Nothing like modern vehicles at all. Then they end up selling them within the year. They find its not an instagram fantasy or whatever they had in their mind of a 60 would be. Bottom line you have to love these vehicles for what they are and what they are not as they have a lot of the latter . Once these go out of vogue maybe the prices will drop again as the price increase has only been since around 2021ish. Before that you could find nice rigs for 5k.
For all you 6x series guys I’m just sad some of the focus and the joy of driving an “old fj” finally shifted to your realm of cruisers and made the prices go up. I’ve owned a few 6x series but never as a nice rig, always just beaters/ drivers and hunting rigs 500 to 3500 max price. Those same rigs went stupid at Covid and are now the “cool” cruiser. When you can go to the mall and buy clothing with 60 series stuff on it you’ve really made it to the big time of cool trend. But damn BaT and the thought of flipping cars sure ruined the market for well put together rigs and or nice clean original rigs. I always steered away from 60s cause they were to modern to drive but still gutless wonders, you know a nice v8 swap and onto a 80 chassis then they are finally driveable.
The entire cruiser market got ruined at covid with stupid free money and ignorance buyers and shawdy sellers. We are still in the leveling off but it will come around. Good vehicles will again bring top dollar and shawdy vehicles will still sell for more than they are worth but hopefully the trends will find a happy medium.
The entire cruiser market got ruined at covid with stupid free money and ignorance buyers and shawdy sellers. We are still in the leveling off but it will come around. Good vehicles will again bring top dollar and shawdy vehicles will still sell for more than they are worth but hopefully the trends will find a happy medium.
To the OP:
I think the advice given here is rock solid. I have fixed/flipped (in a good sense) everything from '88 Camrys to Jeep Cherokees to pickup bed trailers over the last 30 years. Unless you get a diamond-in-the-rough for cheap from a neighbor or friend, most vehicles you can buy, repair, and resell are already priced at 80-100% of what they'll ever sell for. Doing 'one at month' as you proposed, would have you in your garage 24x7 just on sheer hours alone.
I too, see the LC market getting softer on BaT, and elsewhere. You may not like what's being said here, but most of it is very valid. I enjoy fixing vehicles for myself and friends, but if I had a financial gun to my head and/or had to please outside customers, it would be a whole different story. If you are juggling kids and their homework, etc., this make this sort of thing even harder.
You obviously have passion, and that's great! Just apply it where it won't wear you don't to a frazzle.
I think the advice given here is rock solid. I have fixed/flipped (in a good sense) everything from '88 Camrys to Jeep Cherokees to pickup bed trailers over the last 30 years. Unless you get a diamond-in-the-rough for cheap from a neighbor or friend, most vehicles you can buy, repair, and resell are already priced at 80-100% of what they'll ever sell for. Doing 'one at month' as you proposed, would have you in your garage 24x7 just on sheer hours alone.
I too, see the LC market getting softer on BaT, and elsewhere. You may not like what's being said here, but most of it is very valid. I enjoy fixing vehicles for myself and friends, but if I had a financial gun to my head and/or had to please outside customers, it would be a whole different story. If you are juggling kids and their homework, etc., this make this sort of thing even harder.
You obviously have passion, and that's great! Just apply it where it won't wear you don't to a frazzle.
You seem dead set, which is good. That means you won't quit half way through. You'll also have to learn things the hard way. Welcome to the club... I'll be blunt.
If you came here looking for someone to blow smoke up your backside, you came to the wrong place. Most of the older users here are entering five or six decades of life, maybe more and they have seen a boatload of new faces come here, ask lots of flipper questions and seen many of them burn into the ground. I've seen several guys come in here thinking they could get rich quick, do a quick wash and rub then double their money to some unsuspecting buyer. Few of them make it. Most of them get known as thieves and scammers. You still see their stuff sell, but you also hear about the lawsuits. Some are decent people and try hard to make a go of the cruiser selling game and you watch them suffer, then see them sell off everything when they get a divorce. That's the reason you see advice that tells you to take a breath and look before you leap. Especially when you come across as desperate and unemployed. If you take it as a personal insult, then that is your problem. Not the fault of the people trying to make sure you know what you are getting into before you make a leap into an all uphill fight.
Now, about your original question. That cruiser you put up is a pile of crap. It better be dirt a$$ cheap, because that thing is going to eat you alive once you start digging into it and the kind of people who have $25k in their bank account are going to want to see one that has "At Most" one crash. Not five. In this market, you might win the lottery and get your coin, but you are rolling the dice hard and hoping for a dummy with more money than good sense to come along. Yes, they are out there, but do you want to be the one telling a Judge that "Buyer Beware" applies to your sale?
You wanna make a $20-25k rig, you start with an $8-12K one that has surface rust only, from the desert and you replace every rotten piece of plastic on it with the ones you stole from a rust bucket pile like the one you put up and fix the drive train leaks. Then you do your magic and market it to the right place. Who knows you might get paid stupid money for it from someone who is desperate to be cool.
You want to sell one for $12-15K, you buy that one, do a great job of fixing it, make every single mechanical piece on it work the right way and spend 3 months doing body work, then sell it to someone who has that kind of coin laying around and is willing to accept it for what it is. A rehabbed rig that has hidden rust bombs waiting to go off in a few years.
Good luck. If you never come back, then so be it.
