Scout P/Steering Install Question

Joined
Mar 26, 2004
Messages
405
Location
SE Mo
Seems like p/steering upgrades are on alot of peoples to do lists. I've been reading/searching allot of this myself. I decided to go with the Scout box, as it just seems like the easier of the two main options ( Saginaw out front, or Scout ) to install. When deciding where/how to mount the box, am I looking to keep the swing of the pitman arm as flat as possible, or is this mainly a non issue. For the guys who have done this, do you feel like doing the Ford shock tower mod would of been better/easier then dealing with the stock one? The reason I ask is, I don't have access to a plasma cutter or torches. An option could be grinding off the rivets and pulling the stock shock mount, then modifying, then bolting on. Good idea ( bolts ) ? For a steering shaft, I have one from an '88 mini, and one from a '95 T-100. My gameplan from looking at both shafts, use the ragjoint/ujoint from the mini ( bigger ujoint than T-100 ) that originally connected to the mini p/s box, and connect it to my Cruiser ragjoint coupler. This would allow me to use stock Toyota parts at the firewall side ( for future replacements). Stock mini steering shaft w/slip joint shortend to whatever length I'll need with a 13/16"x 36 ujoint for the Scout box. I have a 2 1/2" drop pitman arm, and the relay rod Mark sells, sleeves for the frame, and will pick up some plate to add to mounting area. Can anyone add to what I might have missed? Thanks Guys, the info/experiance you Guys have to offer is amazing. Al
 
Joined
Feb 19, 2004
Messages
3,386
Location
Pepperell MA
Did this on a 40. I put the Ford tower on. I thought I'd have to cut too much off the stock piece for it to be strong enough to use. I didn't have a torch at the time either so I just drilled the rivets and knocked the stocker off with a BFH.

Since the rig I'm working on isn't gonna be much more than a mild wheeler/street truck I shortened the Ford tower to match the stock shock tower height. If I were building a rock truck I would have replaced both front shock towers with Ford parts for the extra available shock length.

For the steering box joint I used an Astro van piece I had in the parts pile. Cut the Astro shaft and sleeve it to the Toyota joint if you like. Or spend the coin on a Flaming River brand joint or similar.

I think I needed 3/8" thick plate on the outside of the frame to space the box away from the radiator.

Only thing I didn't see was some kind of bearing or bushing for the bottom of the steering column. IIRC Kurt at Cruiser Outfitters has a nice bronze bushing that works well. I used a pillow block on the bottom of the column ('76 FJ40). You can get a expensive one from the Cruiser specialists or a less expensive version from Northern Tool. 3/4" dia. fits the steering column. If you buy a less expensive bearing from Northern Tool you need to file the holes into slots or redrill the bottom of the steering column mounting flange.

HTH,
Nick
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2004
Messages
405
Location
SE Mo
Hey Nick, thanks for the info. So when you plated the frame did you do both inner and outer? How much would you say the radiator mounting frame interfered with the box? Good call on the bearing, had seen it mentioned, but forgot to add it. Do you think the dropped pitman arm will help with relay rod angles, allowing a more level angle? I guess I should of mentioned I have roughly a 4" lift on the Cruiser. Overall, are you happy with your swap, or would you do something different now, looking back. Many thanks, as I hope to start on it this wkend. Al
 
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
6,896
Location
sittin on the couch in UT
62 Dust Collector said:
Where did you get the ford shock towers from?


any ford dealer can get them i think around 12 bucks a piece:cheers:
 

Full_Throttle

1985 BJ73 RHD
Joined
Jun 4, 2005
Messages
329
Location
West Frankfort Illinois
Just did this.
I used a 4" electric grinder on my shock tower. I didn't have to take it off, and it seems pleanty strong for my use. Mine won't be a monster off-road beast, so I think it's ok. Are you doing a spring over suspension? If not I don't think the pitman drop will be an issue.
Which rod are you referring to that you got from Mark? Pics or a link?
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2005
Messages
970
Location
Ouray, Colorado
Seeing that pics are worth a thousand words, heres ten grand. In the last pic you can see where i ground off the nipples on the frame side of box to keep tight. There is more than enough truss strength in the shock mount after grinding,grind silly.



100_1148.jpg

100_1147.jpg

100_1149.jpg

100_1150.jpg

100_1151.jpg

100_1152.jpg

100_1153.jpg

100_1154.jpg

100_1155.jpg

100_1156.jpg
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2004
Messages
405
Location
SE Mo
Looking Good. The pic's give me a better idea of whats up with the shock tower. Full_Throttle. look on Marks site ( Marks Offroad.net ) under specials. Its p/n # 122-20m, tell him your doing a Scout setup, as the relay rod seems to be different than whats used on a up front Saginaw setup. Al
 
Joined
Apr 20, 2005
Messages
365
Location
not the" no", but the F-no CA
Search the forum, I just ordered towers online and got them delivered, same ones as every one else, and I posted the address, but I didn't keep it. I ordered 4 (just felt like I should have an extra pair incase one of my buddies goes spring over) came out to like $55 to my door, but that is four shipped.
 

PabloCruise

SILVER Star
Joined
Jun 3, 2004
Messages
22,585
Location
Northern Colorado
burnttoastburgos said:
Seeing that pics are worth a thousand words, heres ten grand. In the last pic you can see where i ground off the nipples on the frame side of box to keep tight. There is more than enough truss strength in the shock mount after grinding,grind silly.



100_1148.jpg

100_1147.jpg

100_1149.jpg

100_1150.jpg

100_1151.jpg

100_1152.jpg

100_1153.jpg

100_1154.jpg

100_1155.jpg

100_1156.jpg

Wow!

Thanks for posting these pics...

If I had seen them before adding my F250 mounts, I would have tried this. I am in the midst of a FJ60 PS conversion and wish I had waited until I mounted my box to do the shock mounts...
 
Joined
Sep 3, 2004
Messages
668
Location
Juneau, AK
Going back to part of the original question, is it better if the throw of the pitman arm is flat or at an angle?

Just thinking about it, it seems like level would be better.

Also, do all saginaw pitman arms fit all saginaw boxes? Would be nice to just wander around looking for a pitman arm (since my $free.99 box didn't come with an arm).
 

PabloCruise

SILVER Star
Joined
Jun 3, 2004
Messages
22,585
Location
Northern Colorado
I believe you want a certain amount of drop to lessen bump steer?

I am no expert - just quoting what I have read...

I believe if the height between your pitman arm and the pass side knuckle is great, it puts your drag link at an angle and will give you less control when you encounter bumps (ie suspension compresses or droops)
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2003
Messages
786
Location
Folsom, CA
Read all about it on my webpage listed in my signature line.
 
Joined
Jan 7, 2005
Messages
6,537
Location
The Greatland
Website
www.facebook.com
IFAIK all sag arms will fit all sag boxes.

I assume that you are talking about the plane of arc when you ask if the arm is better level or not. I've pondered this a little and I don't think it affects you steering at all. No in any way that I can see. A few boxes are tilted right from the factory (IFS mini-trucks for example).

As to the drop arm question. If you can get the steering geometry that you want with a flat arm, that is better. It needs less cleanace from springs and frame and whatever else is there and it puts less strain on the bearings in the sector shaft of the steering box. An arm with a lot of drop and shorten the life of your steering box. A lot if the drop is extreme.

A drop arm can help a lot with bump steer if you have a lot of lift. You want you drag link to be as close to horizontal as is practical to reduce bumpsteer.


Mark...
 
Joined
Jul 13, 2003
Messages
786
Location
Folsom, CA
With the Scout boxes, because it travels over the front spring, an arm with too much drop will hit the spring when turning. The best deal is to get the arm you want then positiion the Scout box so the steering arm just clears the bottom of the frame when turning. Remember though, you still have to have the top of the tie rod to clear the frame also. This allows for the maximum clearance between the arm/tie rod end and the spring. Look at Woody's install under the Tech links at the top of this page. He used a built-in stop to keep the arm from hitting the spring.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top Bottom