Pros and cons on Harbor Freight's 12,000 lbs Bad Land winch (2 Viewers)

[LC4LIFE]

^^this^^ I only run Warn, mainly because its all I have ever had and they are dead reliable. I also want my winch to run regardless of how often I may or may not need it. Kind of like why I use OEM parts on my truck. I also want it to work and run always anytime I ask it to. I would use one on a car hauler trailer, but not my Cruiser.

 

[landtank]

what I'm hearing:

I only run XXX and have never have run a HF because they suck, justified by some unfounded fear that someone close to them would die if they did.

Seriously?

I think if winching capabilities determine whether or not you die, you probably aren't a hobby wheeler.

If you are a hobby wheeler and am interested in an electric winch, based on those who have used them, the Badlands winch isn't a bad choice.

 

[Dragos80]

Just to throw another wrench in the winch gear now, when you buy a winch consider if you will switch the steel cable for a synthetic rope.
The heat some winches disperse is one of the big enemies of the synthetic rope. Some heat is also generated by the in-drum brake.

 

[HandForged]

Everywhere I go I see these discussions on cheap winches Vs. More expensive or Warn. I'll toss my little bit of truth in here for you folks and quantify it with this. I live in the wilderness, the honest to god...this place will kill you if you let it wilderness of Montana. I have 5 trucks, the wife has 1. They all have winches on them. Why? we freaking use them.... all the time in winter. To pull out stuck trucks and move fallen trees, you name it, we do it. I have a couple of badlands winches. I have a few warn winches. In most instances, I can't tell one from the other in use. Other than the badlands winches are slow. The other thing I don't like about them is they are over-rated. meaning a 10k is barely an 8k winch. Let's be honest, most guys buy a winch because it looks cool bolted to the front of the truck. They might use it 2 times a year. For that, a HF winch will work wonderfully. If you're going to drag trees and cars all day you'll burn one up fast. Here are some tricks for you with the HF stuff. Get one and bolt it on. When it dies (and it will with heavy use) throw it away and go get another one....like you do with all HF tools.

 

[Box Rocket]

what I'm hearing:

I only run XXX and have never have run a HF because they suck, justified by some unfounded fear that someone close to them would die if they did.

Seriously?

I think if winching capabilities determine whether or not you die, you probably aren't a hobby wheeler.

If you are a hobby wheeler and am interested in an electric winch, based on those who have used them, the Badlands winch isn't a bad choice.

I’ve used badlands, and a few other “cheap” winches. Never said anyone would die because they own a cheap winch. If that’s what you took from my earlier comment go back and read the first part of my post. I’m talking about reliability. Most of us will never be in a position where someone could die in a winching situation. That’s why I commented about that being “over dramatic “. There’s enough data out there that I don’t think any will debate there’s better reliability ( and warranty) from quality winches like ComeUp and Warn. So if someone is looking for a winch with excellent reliability the cheap winches typically are not the best choice. Any winch is better than no winch. And frankly if I were to buy one of the cheap winches it would be a Badlands.

 

[94landcruiser]

Seems like (outside the possibility of injury) this discussion is similar to Dyson vs cheap vacuums. I have had 4 60.00 vacuums over the last 20 years (still have two of them. My Brother has had 2 Dysons. He paid 3-500 and has one working vacuum vs I have 240 in all 4 and have 2.

 

[flintknapper]

Seems like (outside the possibility of injury) this discussion is similar to Dyson vs cheap vacuums. I have had 4 60.00 vacuums over the last 20 years (still have two of them. My Brother has had 2 Dysons. He paid 3-500 and has one working vacuum vs I have 240 in all 4 and have 2.

Mkay..........

Except in your analogy....when your vacuum quits you are at home. You go down to Walmart/HF/Other and buy a new cheap vacuum, life goes on.

If your cheap winch fails...depending upon where you are, you might be there for a long, long time and the value of the winch might seem a bit harder to realize at that point. The old "when it fails just go get another one" moniker is fine when there is no significant inconvenience or potential risks involved.

 

[94landcruiser]

What are the third through 7th words of my post?

I said except the possibility of danger.

Also, in your construct, everyone needs life-saving tech, if you are a thrill-seeker, hell-bent of endangering yourself & your truck, by all means, get the 100% it will work gear. (I'm sorry anything made by man will eventually fail)

But there are bargain basement purchases to be had that can and will do the job.

I am sure there are Gwagen snobs that think Land Cruisers are for the poor schlubs of the world.

 

[flintknapper]

What are the third through 7th words of my post?

I said except the possibility of danger.

Also, in your construct, everyone needs life-saving tech, if you are a thrill-seeker, hell-bent of endangering yourself & your truck, by all means, get the 100% it will work gear. (I'm sorry anything made by man will eventually fail)

But there are bargain basement purchases to be had that can and will do the job.

I am sure there are Gwagen snobs that think Land Cruisers are for the poor schlubs of the world.

Actually, you said:

"(outside the possibility of injury)"

"Danger" might encompass any number of situations and levels.

But I'm not going to argue semantics.

My point (you so easily missed) is that there is potentially MUCH more at play when off-road and in need of a winch for assistance, whether that is self recovery or simply the need to be able to continue forward.

Discounting your sensationalism ("everyone needs life-saving tech") it is well to remember that unexpected circumstances can and do occur. In fact, the vast majority of winch use results from things you certainly didn't plan for. These things tend NOT to require "Life Saving" tech, but can result in putting you (and perhaps others) in a most uncomfortable position.

YOUR off-roading might not require it and you might not venture outside of cell-phone service, but many do.

I can cite you a plethora of situations (not involving life or death) that if your winch (ANY winch) fails you....you are going to be in for one heck of a miserable (and probably expensive) time. They don't involve "Thrill Seeking" or a disregard for safety, just things that 'happen'.

If you never off-road in places that someone else can't just drive right up and get you...fine, cheap (read low quality) winches are for you. If you very infrequently have use for a winch and strictly adhere to the limitations of the cheaper winch, that too might work for you.

If your winch is just pretty much a 'cool' looking accessory and you mostly jump the curb stop at McDonalds...then by all means purchase the one of your liking.

Just consider your needs and factor in its use in a 'worst case' scenario and not when things are going as planned. This applies to the capacity of the winch and well as its longevity/reliability.

IF you are one of those who subscribe to the "use it until it fails, go buy ANOTHER cheap one" group, great. Just make sure you are always somewhere and under circumstances where it really doesn't make a damn.

Folks simply have different perspectives about 'value'. You are entitled to yours.

 

[94landcruiser]

Actually, you said:

"(outside the possibility of injury)"

But I'm not going to argue semantics.

My point (you so easily missed) is that there is potentially MUCH more at play when off-road and in need of a winch for assistance, whether that is self recovery or simply the need to be able to continue forward.

Discounting your sensationalism ("everyone needs life-saving tech") it is well to remember that unexpected circumstances can and do occur. In fact, the vast majority of winch use results from things you certainly didn't plan for. These things tend NOT to require "Life Saving" tech, but can result in putting you (and perhaps others) in a most uncomfortable position.

YOUR off-roading might not require it and you might not venture outside of cell-phone service, but many do.

I can cite you a plethora of situations (not involving life or death) that if your winch (ANY winch) fails you....you are going to be in for one heck of a miserable (and probably expensive) time. They don't involve "Thrill Seeking" or a disregard for safety, just things that 'happen'.

If you never off-road in places that someone else can't just drive right up and get you...fine, cheap (read low quality) winches are for you. If you very infrequently have use for a winch and strictly adhere to the limitations of the cheaper winch, that too might work for you.

If your winch is just pretty much a 'cool' looking accessory and you mostly jump the curb stop at McDonalds...then by all means purchase the one of your liking.

Just consider your needs and factor in its use in a 'worst case' scenario and not when things are going as planned. This applies to the capacity of the winch and well as its longevity/reliability.

IF you are one of those who subscribe to the "use it until it fails, go buy ANOTHER cheap one" group, great. Just make sure you are always somewhere and under circumstances where it really doesn't make a damn.

Folks simply have different perspectives about 'value'. You are entitled to yours.

Just like with all due respect means f00k off, I won't argue semantics means YOU ARE arguing semantics.

I have appreciated the responses and am now able to make a reasoned decision based on my needs and opinions.

Have a great day.

 

[flintknapper]

Just like with all due respect means f00k off, I won't argue semantics means YOU ARE arguing semantics.

I have appreciated the responses and am now able to make a reasoned decision based on my needs and opinions.

Have a great day.

^^^^^

'With all due respect is an adverb phrase used to signal that you are about to disagree with someone or criticize them. Usually, all due respect is intended to soften the effect of disagreeing or criticizing someone.'

Certainly NOT a F-U.

I'm sorry you choose to take it that way. But it is your privilege to be wrong. Not flattering....but your privilege.

As for semantics....you wrote two different things in two different posts...and I was 'trying' to allow for your meaning. That is a courtesy. Try not to have such a negative view of things. Often things ARE just what they appear to be on the face of it.

 

[94landcruiser]

^^^^^

'With all due respect is an adverb phrase used to signal that you are about disagree with someone or criticize them. Usually, with all due respect is intended to soften the effect of disagreeing or criticizing someone.'

Certainly NOT a F-U.

I'm sorry you choose to take it that way. But it is your privilege to be wrong. Not flattering....but your privilege.

As for semantics....you wrote two different things in two different posts...and I was 'trying' to allow for your meaning. That is a courtesy. Try not to have a such a negative view of things. Often things ARE just what they appear to be on the face of things.

Way to validate you are not going to argue semantics. By writing a dissertation on semantics.

Perhaps you might consider that your opinions/beliefs/thoughts are not 100% engraved in stone??

 

[Box Rocket]

Simplifying my outlook on winches (and other things)......Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

 

[mudgudgeon]

My Brother has had 2 Dysons. He paid 3-500 and has one working vacuum vs I have 240 in all 4 and have 2.

So who's vacuum collection sucks the most?

 

[flintknapper]

Simplifying my outlook on winches (and other things)......Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

Excellent! Serves me well in most endeavors.

 

[Dragos80]

Oh wow.
I didn't come here for a grammar lesson.
I got Facebook grammar police for that.

 

[greentruck]

Excellent application for the winch. I'm not bashing anyone's winch as I'm really not a Winch Snob as some might perceive. I'm simply pragmatic. The BadLands winch can/should work great for those using it within the confines of its engineered design.

Now that the winch has been out for awhile and folks have burned up a bunch of them (OPERATOR ERROR) it has been realized that the 5% duty cycle * is something that is best adhered to and the winch is slowly gaining a better reputation.
SNIP

I wouldn't be dogging the HF too much here for the stated duty cycle. It's not really all that different in practice than with any of the planetary drive winches. My Smittybilt XRC12 gets hot pretty quick, too, and so will just about anything that puts a hot motor on one end and drives it through a quickly warming transmission on the other end, Never used a Warn planetary that was bigger than 6k, but the little one I had on my Trooper got pretty hot pretty fast the few times I used it hard.

I suspect HF is putting that conservative figure out in order to limit the rookie mistakes people do make. It's hard to get in much trouble if you wait 15 minutes after a brief pull and likely helps keep warranty claims under control. But I doubt it's exceptionally different than others with the same design. Most have no or minimal ventilation for either the motor or drive. Put that much juice through under load and the physics tend to dictate quickly rising heat no matter who built your winch.

When using them, I wear heavy gloves and keep touching the parts that will get hot to monitor what's going on because if you sense the heat uncomfortably through the leather it's time to pause. Now that infrared temp reading guns are cheap (yep, you can get one at HF) that might be more precise than the gloved finger. Yes, that could be an issue where speed was important, but speed is also what gets you into trouble with a winch. You're better off in most cases taking things slow and easy. YMMV of course, but speed is what you usually don't want even if your winch is capable.

Just to be clear what I am observing here, it's operator error that kills most winches, including Warn. True, you might expect more mechanical failures from a Smittybilt or HF, but I've not seen much evidence of this being a a problem. Fundamentally, if you expect to do a lot of pulling, you would be better off with an 8274, but parking one on your front bumper on a 80 usually doesn't do your approach angle much good.

And it's fine to spend whatever you can on a winch, but the practical differences vs price are more marginal than is often asserted. Very rarely do you encounter worst case scenarios, but if that's what you like getting into, maybe you should spend those $$. For those that don't, less expensive winches still tend to serve well IMO.

 

[Box Rocket]

Fortuantely, many of the quality brands are including some kind of overheating warning system on winches. Heat can be an issue but usually just allowing some time for the winch to cool down after overheating is enough to keep winching.
On the topic of heat, the motor can get hot for sure, but a lot of the heat can actually come from the brake system in the winch. Most winches have the brake inside the winch drum. This is not really a problem for winches that use a wire rope, but a hot drum can damage synthetic winch ropes. One of the cool things about the ComeUp winches is their cone brake design. It's outside the drum so it won't transfer heat the same way and damage synthetic rope.

Mechanical failures are actually pretty rare with most winches. A lot of the cheaper winches are using lower quality Chinese steel on gears etc and I've heard of some failures but it doesn't happen often. The more common failure is electrical. User error can be the culprit but water intrusion is what kills winches. Many of the cheaper winches don't have the best seals and some don't have any seals around the contactors. If you get a cheap winch it's well worth your time to do what you can to seal up the electricals better and replace the internal grease with some higher quality grease (Sometimes there's just not enough grease inside). Doing those two things will really improve the reliability of a less expensive winch.

 

[flintknapper]

Oh wow.
I didn't come here for a grammar lesson.
I got Facebook grammar police for that.

I 'have' facebook.....

 

[94landcruiser]

He helped his uncle Jack, off a horse.

Leave out that comma, it's a whole other thing.