FastCarGuy
SILVER Star
What I'd do for a shop with a two post hoist 
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X2!!!!!!!!
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X2!!!!!!!!
Northwest fabworks BLACK BOX (1 Viewer)
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While I agree that removing the Tcase is totally optional. Given that some of us are not young bucks anymore, couple that with dripping Tcase juice on your face, it made sense for me to remove it. Also, this gave me the opportunity to do the Tcase input seal, Tranny output seal at the same time. What I'd do for a shop with a two post hoist
Never mind the tcase falling on you
inkpot
SILVER Star
While I agree that removing the Tcase is totally optional. Given that some of us are not young bucks anymore, couple that with dripping Tcase juice on your face, it made sense for me to remove it. Also, this gave me the opportunity to do the Tcase input seal, Tranny output seal at the same time. What I'd do for a shop with a two post hoist
Age
dont matter. Some of us are turning 70 this year, and still doing it On the rig, as long as there are none of those seals to replace. Grinding uphill with trifocals
is kinda a brail situation, but not really that hard. Just gotta take yur time. I have had a couple dozen sets of the gear clusters set down on my sternum
so I can wheel my creeper in/out from under the rig. If your worried about getting gear oil on your body, hire this job out. 
alia176
SILVER Star
Age
Y'all like to lay on the creeper way more than I do apparently. Good on ya for still bending and stooping
alia176
SILVER Star
Never mind the tcase falling on you
Never happened to me cause I don't use cheap jacks as my life is worth way more than saving a few $$$
Never happened to me cause I don't use cheap jacks as my life is worth way more than saving a few $$$
Sounds like I need one of those. Please share the jack you are using to secure the transfercase from falling off
alia176
SILVER Star
My buddy who has way more tools than I do let's me borrow it as needed. It's nothing special, just a true trans jack with two axis fine adjustments. large tray, chains and a huge foot pattern for stability. I think he's had this thing since the late 80's cause it's rather heavy to load/unload from a vehicle.
Harbor Freight has a smaller version of his jack with similar capabilities which I think is a safe jack to use for our application. Neither the Tranny nor the Tcase weigh that much so the HF model would work well for the budget.
Edit: here it is and I've used it. It's a good bang for the buck 800 lbs. Low Lift Transmission Jack
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JaketheSSnake
SILVER Star
I have the hf trans jack. It's been a lifesaver. I wish I would've bought one 20 years a go. I even use it to mount my sliders. It's so nice just to bolt something in without having to physically hold it in place and keep it lined up.
inkpot
SILVER Star
Well. It DOES qualify as Laying Down o. The Job, and Tools cant see me under the car!Y'all like to lay on the creeper way more than I do apparently. Good on ya for still bending and stooping
Please update this thread when you figure out which pump (and exterior tank) you'll be using! Pictures of any setup you put together would also be super duper helpful!!
I have a blackbox installed in between H55f and split case in my 62 - and can vouch for everything that's been said thus far. It's an incredibly awesome unit, but it definitely does need more oil capacity for longevity and ease-of-use. The fact that this isn't clearly expressed upfront by NWF (or better-yet, them providing a kitted solution that includes a ported drain plug, exterior oil reservoir with cooling fins and a pump) is certainly annoying and reflects poorly on them (especially after it being on the market for so many years...) - but then again, hopefully everyone considering this upgrade (and the performance and awesomeness this thing brings IS DEFINITELY AN UPGRADE) will do enough research.
I've only put about 1200 miles total on my BB since installing, but right away was dealing with an oil-burping situation and was never excited about the proposed future of changing it's fluid every 1000 miles (which can really only be done using the breather tube, and thus necessitates an access port built into the floor of my rig) - and am going to be doing this exterior oil reservoir+pump solution before putting the truck back in serious use.
The planetary design and fact that the BB input shaft (i.e. output shaft from transmission) IS also the sun gear actually mandates that all gears are in mesh and moving at all times - so regardless of whether the load is being transmitted through in high or low range, all gears are always spinning and splashing oil).
Plus, a system that pumps fluid between the BB and transfer case is probably harder to engineer than adding the exterior tank system being recommended in this thread.
I'm not sure I agree - I've blown 2 sets of upgraded low-range gears. Even the folks at advance adapters who sold them to me quietly implied that the stock gears transfer case are much stronger - and that a doubler box is a better recommended route to lower gearing (not to mention more ranges).
Also - it's not that the system always overheats (it certainly could though) - it's more just the fact that it doesn't have enough room in it for the amount of oil it needs - and for the same reason (not enough room) is going to constantly burp oil unless a separate reservoir is added.
JohnnyOshow22
KK0TEQ
@Zoverlander all this was figured out on @MountNGoat 60 series
Breather and reservoir added to the engine bay in the back right corner
Cooler and pump mounted underneath close to the black box
I don't have the links to the reservoir or pump bit I'll get @MountNGoat to post those up. He also had to do a few other things with a temperature sensor so the pump didn't turn on prematurely but I'll let him do that. I think he also wired in a float in the reservoir to indicate low levels
Breather and reservoir added to the engine bay in the back right corner
Cooler and pump mounted underneath close to the black box
I don't have the links to the reservoir or pump bit I'll get @MountNGoat to post those up. He also had to do a few other things with a temperature sensor so the pump didn't turn on prematurely but I'll let him do that. I think he also wired in a float in the reservoir to indicate low levels
So is it a coincidence that my son Johnny @JohnnyOshow22 is posting up to @Zoverlander today on MUD when Zoverlander and I also traded info on Instagram today on this very topic, instigated by me out of the blue ?
When Johnny's shop learned directly from NWFW personnel that the Black Box needs an external reservoir, pump and cooler, and a third hole drilled in the case to facilitate the oil circuit while leaving the breather open to atmosphere, if running for extended periods on the road, literally ONE WEEK after Georg @orangefj45 got the thing rebuilt for me, with new plastic guides that had disintegrated due to lack of oil/heat, I was flabbergasted/gobsmocked/f'n mad. Note that Georg HAD talked to them about my build and they were not saying this at the time, which was springtime 2018. Following Tor Slining's lead we had even put a deflector on the breather port thinking that would help the oil belching, but it did not. I was/am totally invested in this drive train solution because with the BB installed, the new structural belly pan/skid plate/cross member is designed specifically for this drive train, with the BB falling in behind the H55F as Johnny has said. For those not familiar with my FJ60, Georg has done a 1HZ/turbo/H55F swap on it. I had the 4:1 low range Tcase gears. I LOVED the gear reduction but didn't care for the high range 10% underdrive or the noise of the gears. When I grenaded the gears at Turf N Surf I looked for a new direction and decided on the Black Box. Actually Johnny was the one that told me about it, so really this whole story/journey is his fault. With stock gears in the split case and a Black Box the final drive ratio is 50% lower than just having 4:1 gears in the split case.
I really needed a solution to the oil belching and having just replaced the power steering pump and a bunch of stuff in my wife's 80, it got me to thinking. The power steering pump only has two ports - not three. I tossed out the idea to Georg to not disassemble everything and drill a third hole in the BB, but rather to just use the breather/drain in the BB for the oil loop. My thought was that I would pull oil out of the BB via the drain, going through a cooler first, then to the pump and up to the top of the reservoir, and then gravity feed it from the bottom of the reservoir back in through the breather, thus creating internal negative pressure rather than forcing it in through the breather which would internally pressurize the BB and possibly push fluid into the split case. The reservoir itself would have a breather to atmosphere.
Georg agreed this wasn't crazy, and we set to work. I sourced the pump and reservoir and sent them to Georg. Georg wanted a method of alerting me if the oil in the system was running low, and his right hand man Dominic found an aircraft oil float sensor that they integrated that into my reservoir. If the reservoir fluid gets too low, this will activate a warning light on my dash. They supplied a cooler, and installed the system, with Dominic creating all the custom bracketry necessary for the pump, cooler and reservoir. In total, the system holds 3 qts.
I drove it home the one hour from the shop and for the first time ever oil wasn't dripping on my driveway from being belched out the breather. I was ecstatic. The next morning it was rather cool, and when I turned the key the oil pump made a rather loud squealing noise as it tried to move the thick gear oil through lines and ports that were never sized for this rate of fluid flow. The relay feeding power to the pump is tied into a keyed-on ignition circuit, so I decided to install a thermo switch on the relay ground. I found a normally open 105F switch on Amazon (half the width of my pinky nail and ~ 1mm thick), placed it against the oil hose adjacent to the BB drain port, taped in on, then wrapped it in split heater hose, and zip-tied the assembly. Now, on a cold morning, the switch is open, the relay ground isn't complete, and the relay doesn't send power to the pump. But once on the road for a while the heat in the BB migrates to the hose by the drain, the circuit closes, and the relay the powers the pump, circulating oil as designed.
I've just put close to 3000 miles on this assembly on a 12 day western U.S. road trip, which also included some hard core trails, and it worked perfectly. Johnny's already posted a few pics of the system above, but this weekend I'll put some more pics up, as well as a detailed list of the parts used to make this work. It's also worth noting that we had to lengthen the transmission tunnel hump to make everything clear, whereas in a 62 the stock auto trans already took care of this, making the switch to an H55F and Black Box a little simpler.
It's a fantastic combination that provides great low range crawling (123:1) and allows you to keep your diff gears high for lower highway rpms. I get to use 4.10 diff gears with my 37's and still crawl, while running 70 on the highway at 2600 rpms in 5th gear (2600 rpms in 1st-low-low gets you 2 mph). And my front and rear drive shafts are within 1/2" of each other in length now, meaning I only need one trail spare. Videos of trucks running down the highway are boring, so here's a video (thank you Valley Hybrid's Adam Schwyhart!) of the Black Box-enabled Goat in action on an optional line up Rubicon's Cadillac Hill, with Georg's toes in the background as he spots me up .
?When Johnny's shop learned directly from NWFW personnel that the Black Box needs an external reservoir, pump and cooler, and a third hole drilled in the case to facilitate the oil circuit while leaving the breather open to atmosphere, if running for extended periods on the road, literally ONE WEEK
after Georg @orangefj45 got the thing rebuilt for me, with new plastic guides that had disintegrated due to lack of oil/heat, I was flabbergasted/gobsmocked/f'n mad. Note that Georg HAD talked to them about my build and they were not saying this at the time, which was springtime 2018. Following Tor Slining's lead we had even put a deflector on the breather port thinking that would help the oil belching, but it did not. I was/am totally invested in this drive train solution because with the BB installed, the new structural belly pan/skid plate/cross member is designed specifically for this drive train, with the BB falling in behind the H55F as Johnny has said. For those not familiar with my FJ60, Georg has done a 1HZ/turbo/H55F swap on it. I had the 4:1 low range Tcase gears. I LOVED the gear reduction but didn't care for the high range 10% underdrive or the noise of the gears. When I grenaded the gears at Turf N Surf I looked for a new direction and decided on the Black Box. Actually Johnny was the one that told me about it, so really this whole story/journey is his fault. With stock gears in the split case and a Black Box the final drive ratio is 50% lower than just having 4:1 gears in the split case.I really needed a solution to the oil belching and having just replaced the power steering pump and a bunch of stuff in my wife's 80, it got me to thinking. The power steering pump only has two ports - not three. I tossed out the idea to Georg to not disassemble everything and drill a third hole in the BB, but rather to just use the breather/drain in the BB for the oil loop. My thought was that I would pull oil out of the BB via the drain, going through a cooler first, then to the pump and up to the top of the reservoir, and then gravity feed it from the bottom of the reservoir back in through the breather, thus creating internal negative pressure rather than forcing it in through the breather which would internally pressurize the BB and possibly push fluid into the split case. The reservoir itself would have a breather to atmosphere.
Georg agreed this wasn't crazy, and we set to work. I sourced the pump and reservoir and sent them to Georg. Georg wanted a method of alerting me if the oil in the system was running low, and his right hand man Dominic found an aircraft oil float sensor that they integrated that into my reservoir. If the reservoir fluid gets too low, this will activate a warning light on my dash. They supplied a cooler, and installed the system, with Dominic creating all the custom bracketry necessary for the pump, cooler and reservoir. In total, the system holds 3 qts.
I drove it home the one hour from the shop and for the first time ever oil wasn't dripping on my driveway from being belched out the breather. I was ecstatic. The next morning it was rather cool, and when I turned the key the oil pump made a rather loud squealing noise as it tried to move the thick gear oil through lines and ports that were never sized for this rate of fluid flow. The relay feeding power to the pump is tied into a keyed-on ignition circuit, so I decided to install a thermo switch on the relay ground. I found a normally open 105F switch on Amazon (half the width of my pinky nail and ~ 1mm thick), placed it against the oil hose adjacent to the BB drain port, taped in on, then wrapped it in split heater hose, and zip-tied the assembly. Now, on a cold morning, the switch is open, the relay ground isn't complete, and the relay doesn't send power to the pump. But once on the road for a while the heat in the BB migrates to the hose by the drain, the circuit closes, and the relay the powers the pump, circulating oil as designed.
I've just put close to 3000 miles on this assembly on a 12 day western U.S. road trip, which also included some hard core trails, and it worked perfectly. Johnny's already posted a few pics of the system above, but this weekend I'll put some more pics up, as well as a detailed list of the parts used to make this work. It's also worth noting that we had to lengthen the transmission tunnel hump to make everything clear, whereas in a 62 the stock auto trans already took care of this, making the switch to an H55F and Black Box a little simpler.
It's a fantastic combination that provides great low range crawling (123:1) and allows you to keep your diff gears high for lower highway rpms. I get to use 4.10 diff gears with my 37's and still crawl, while running 70 on the highway at 2600 rpms in 5th gear (2600 rpms in 1st-low-low gets you 2 mph
). And my front and rear drive shafts are within 1/2" of each other in length now, meaning I only need one trail spare. Videos of trucks running down the highway are boring, so here's a video (thank you Valley Hybrid's Adam Schwyhart!) of the Black Box-enabled Goat in action on an optional line up Rubicon's Cadillac Hill, with Georg's toes in the background as he spots me up .
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HDJdreams
SILVER Star
No.
I spoke to them about it a couple months ago after seeing this thread. Their box is very specifically designed for NP205, the output of the box is the NP205 input gear. It shares fluid with the main case of NP205. He had no concerns about highway use.
Looking at there website it looks like if you have a a440 you could get the use the black box to mate up an atlas transfer case. Probably need some extensive body modification to tuck it up there but the hardware seems like it could work
