Is this insane? Or just stupid? (2 Viewers)

[45Dougal]

Mr. Dougal,

Perhaps there is a cultural difference at play here.
Also, perhaps I took your reply as only looking at the pictures and not reading my posts. But you’re British, so of course you’d actually read my post.

My thoughts and approach here is that there are currently only 4 small bolts holding these seats in and that is considered “fine”. If I apply structural steel along with gussets and heftier bolts, I feel I’d be ahead of the game as far as the seats go. Also, the passengers (my children most often) would be secured by the seat belts, which would be secured to the roll bar and tub and not the seats. So the seats are really only for sitting. Even 1x2” 1/8” wall tube is stronger than the tub I would think. However, it would all still be anchored to the tub so…

Be that as it may, I am rethinking things to anchor under the roll bar, however, that starts me down the rabbit hole of fabrication that I thought I might be avoiding.

All in all, I like the idea of using the factory seats in a different manner without major modifications to the body or seats. That’s the fun I guess.

I do appreciate your help, really. I wasn’t yelling, I was capitalizing to reiterate my point.

Ian
Or in British English, Ian.

I don't think my nationality is relevant (whatever you assume it to be), and i think most folks here can read.
This is more likely about me being an engineer and you being something else.
Go ahead and pop your kids on there. Probably fine.

 

[sogncab]

This vehicle has no airbags…
We die like men.

Or absolutely any engineering with regard to safety. That crumple zone is when one side touches the other side. You're basically straddling the frame sitting in front

Recently a local kid broke up with his girlfriend. He decided he wasn't for this world anymore and plowed an F150 into an overpass piller at mach jesus on the interstate. He lived. Engine was in the back seat.

Do that in a 40, and it'll be like stomping on a ketchup packet.

 

[RevISK]

I don't think my nationality is relevant (whatever you assume it to be), and i think most folks here can read.
This is more likely about me being an engineer and you being something else.
Go ahead and pop your kids on there. Probably fine.

Ok. Your location says UK so I made the assumption that it might be a possible cultural difference to how you interpreted my capitalization.

You being an engineer is a great fact, one that I could never just assume based on our interactions thus far, and as for me being “something else”, yes, I certainly am that. I am a designer by trade (among other things).

I welcome your suggestions and input, for instance, what size tubing would you recommend in this instance? Surely we can agree that the seatbelts are the deciding factor in safety, right?

Regardless, get your ass over here and let’s have a beer or several and I’ll treat you to the best bbq you’ve ever had. Then we’ll solve this quandary together. Deal?

Ian

 

[RevISK]

Or absolutely any engineering with regard to safety. That crumple zone is when one side touches the other side. You're basically straddling the frame sitting in front

Recently a local kid broke up with his girlfriend. He decided he wasn't for this world anymore and plowed an F150 into an overpass piller at mach jesus on the interstate. He lived. Engine was in the back seat.

Do that in a 40, and it'll be like stomping on a ketchup packet.

I drove a 40 in high school and it actually saved my neck a few times over in just its nimbleness.

Obviously I was being sarcastic with that post but come on , we’re driving high speed tractors here.

The Tundra, Highlander and hell, even the 62 are “safe”, the 40 is for living.

 

[Living in the Past]

This vehicle has no airbags…
We die like men.

I'm at an age I would agree. Now small kids I think need to be protected until they are old enough to make those decisions for themselves. My kids are in their late thirties early forties now. When they were young by the time we had a third child the oldest was just about to get out of a child's seat. I never had three in the Bronco seat I had in my 68 FJ40. Seat was secured to the floor with grade eight bolts and heavy fender washers. Had a large piece of angle iron bolted thru the floor into the frame on each. Seat belts were bolted to the angle iron. Took my kid safety seriously.

Besides the small unistrut I see only two bolts being used on the bottom of the seat. Neither of the factory locations at the top are bolted to anything. Originally seat bolts to the wheel well and the heavy boxed section at the at the top of the tub. Any type of front impact wouldn't be surprised to have the unistrut flex forward and the fold down leg to fold up. I'm careless and I get hurt figured that's on me. Someone else getting hurt because of my carelessness is completely different.

 

[RevISK]

I'm at an age I would agree. Now small kids I think need to be protected until they are old enough to make those decisions for themselves. My kids are in their late thirties early forties now. When they were young by the time we had a third child the oldest was just about to get out of a child's seat. I never had three in the Bronco seat I had in my 68 FJ40. Seat was secured to the floor with grade eight bolts and heavy fender washers. Had a large piece of angle iron bolted thru the floor into the frame on each. Seat belts were bolted to the angle iron. Took my kid safety seriously.

Besides the small unistrut I see only two bolts being used on the bottom of the seat. Neither of the factory locations at the top are bolted to anything. Originally seat bolts to the wheel well and the heavy boxed section at the at the top of the tub. Any type of front impact wouldn't be surprised to have the unistrut flex forward and the fold down leg to fold up. I'm careless and I get hurt figured that's on me. Someone else getting hurt because of my carelessness is completely different.

It’s literally just a mock-up.
Just a test to see if the seating works and I’ll move on from there.

My kids are everything, aside from them riding in a 40, no matter the configuration, their safety is paramount.

 

[thatcabledude]

@DangerNoodle used Rover seats to do something similar. Maybe find it in his build thread for ideas.

 

[thatcabledude]

IIRC, @White Stripe did to.

 

[77mustard40]

Ian I had a friend use the rear seat from an old Scout, I think he still has the 40 with the forward facing rear seat. IIRC it tumbles forward behind the front buckets when not used. Let me know if you want to see some pics.

 

[DangerNoodle]

@DangerNoodle used Rover seats to do something similar. Maybe find it in his build thread for ideas.

I like them, not the most comfortable, but way better over the stock postion for long wheeling. Shorter people like them more as well.

Next one I'm doing is getting streched about 12" and a full floor pan removal and 4 full bucket seats lol.

 

[EStein]

Messing around trying to figure out how best to install a Bestop fold and tumble rear seat and I get this idea. Surely someone has done this?

The Bestop sits too low and I’m looking at 5 holes to drill into the tub. This route would use all factory holes where the jump seats mount and would only need one hole for the seat belts between seats.

Just a mockup currently… looking for thoughts or ridicule.

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I don’t have anything to add design wise, but that set up is super cool! If only Toyota had designed the jump seats to swing out and face forward.

 

[White Stripe]

These are mine

 

[EStein]

I should also reiterate that no matter what, 3-point belts are going in. Maybe even 4-point if I can make it work.

I would think if you can get the seatbelts secured, sitting forward is tons safer than sitting sideways with a lap belt.

 

[MOTOV8R]

Pics of the seats I mentioned. I never ended up using these and sold them. They bolt to the edge of the rear wheel wells and fold down. One seat has a leg that folds down, the other seat rests on the one with the leg. They were really heavy wall tube. Unfortunately I do not have any pics of these sitting in the back of a 40.

 

[kerplunk]

This vehicle has no airbags…
We die like men.

More likely wimper away with severe back pain for the next 40 years....

Was recently driving my other car down the freeway when traffic slowed to a stop, except the guy behind me, which I hadn't noticed until I finally figured out why I was suddenly accelerating toward the guy in front of me from a dead stop with my foot on the break....

And how the !#$% did the seat just slam the @#$% into my back so !#$%ing hard??? (getting back into the car after trading insurance / etc., it was reclined 2 inches...)

I'd assume inattentive people (he claimed he was tired, fell asleep) run head into the back of other cars is probably the most common accident happening these days. Newer cars have all been built to adapt, some of the newest just brake for you. That seat probably isn't any worse than the original sideways facing jump seats, it might be better, but is worth considering how it can be made better if you ever plan on being in common US traffic...

 

[45Dougal]

Bottom line: If you put a couple of big guys in these seats and go for it over a bumpy road, would they stay there? No it would bend. That shouldn't happen at all.

In a crash you'll see a much greater load and it could be in any direction.
Yes, in the 70s the focus was on seat belt mountings and the seat was just there to sit on.
Modern seats shouldn't fold up underneath you in a crash in any direction.

You could add a second strut across under the front of the seats which would prevent the leg issue. Increasing the size of the box to say thin wall 2x2 should make the base fairly secure (if its fastened to something solid and with appropriate reinforcement). The seat back is still another story though but maybe you could add a third strut for arguments sake but now it's becoming a circus.

Access to the seats is another issue. They're climbing over these struts? Worse with one at the front and top too. Is that the entry/ escape plan?

I like the configuration but I'd retain access to the back door and that means welding up something a bit smarter, unless you're just chugging around the farm at low speed and want a quick solution.

My kids ride in isofix child seats which clip into seat bases, which in turn clip into modern seats pilfered from a modern car - no seat belts are used to fit them.
The seats are bolted directly through the floor with reinforcement plates.

You have a roll bar - how about getting something welded up onto it to carry those seats properly? Just remember to check what its bolted to.

Alternatively you might find a standard van seat frame on ebay which can be hacked around.

 

[rkymtnflyfisher]

Regardless, get your ass over here and let’s have a beer or several and I’ll treat you to the best bbq you’ve ever had. Then we’ll solve this quandary together. Deal?

Now we're getting somewhere.

 

[RevISK]

Now we're getting somewhere.

I tried.

 

[RevISK]

Now we're getting somewhere.

I tried.

Pics of the seats I mentioned. I never ended up using these and sold them. They bolt to the edge of the rear wheel wells and fold down. One seat has a leg that folds down, the other seat rests on the one with the leg. They were really heavy wall tube. Unfortunately I do not have any pics of these sitting in the back of a 40.

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this is great food for thought, thanks for taking the time to post these.

 

[RevISK]

Bottom line: If you put a couple of big guys in these seats and go for it over a bumpy road, would they stay there? No it would bend. That shouldn't happen at all.

In a crash you'll see a much greater load and it could be in any direction.
Yes, in the 70s the focus was on seat belt mountings and the seat was just there to sit on.
Modern seats shouldn't fold up underneath you in a crash in any direction.

You could add a second strut across under the front of the seats which would prevent the leg issue. Increasing the size of the box to say thin wall 2x2 should make the base fairly secure (if its fastened to something solid and with appropriate reinforcement). The seat back is still another story though but maybe you could add a third strut for arguments sake but now it's becoming a circus.

Access to the seats is another issue. They're climbing over these struts? Worse with one at the front and top too. Is that the entry/ escape plan?

I like the configuration but I'd retain access to the back door and that means welding up something a bit smarter, unless you're just chugging around the farm at low speed and want a quick solution.

My kids ride in isofix child seats which clip into seat bases, which in turn clip into modern seats pilfered from a modern car - no seat belts are used to fit them.
The seats are bolted directly through the floor with reinforcement plates.

You have a roll bar - how about getting something welded up onto it to carry those seats properly? Just remember to check what its bolted to.

Alternatively you might find a standard van seat frame on ebay which can be hacked around.

You mention access and escape plan, with the Bestop passengers would have to enter via the small V created by moving the front seats forward. I had my daughter do it when I had the Bestop sitting in there and while doable it wasn’t great.
This configuration was a lot easier to enter through the back, even if they had to step over the bar. In fact, it increased the available exit options by adding rear entry.