RockJock82
Sometimes you have to kick a little A$$
What is the benefit of running the wheel adapters versus recentering with the press in centers out of curiosity minus the obvious ($$).
ARCHIVE Bolt-on HMMWV H1 Wheels
- Thread starter NKP Garage
- Start date
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Read page 1, post 15
Here is the rundown of how this came about....
We started looking into moving up to a 37" tire on the EMSPowered FZJ80. A few things that became apparent quick:
* 37" tires are around $400-500 per tire
* Bead lock wheels are around $375-600 per wheel, and they're only a single bead lock, not double beadlock. So if the inside bead pops you're still stuck on the trail.
* Add up the cost of a set of 37's and a set of single bead lock wheels and you're already at around $3000 even on the cheaper end of the scale or at $4300+ at the more expensive end of the scale. You end up with a single bead lock wheel that is still vulnerable to popping the inner bead. And next time you need tires you'll be paying $1600+ for another set of 37" tires.
The other option that has been out there for a few years was re-centered HMMWV wheels. Re-centered HMMWV wheels are typically around $250-400 per wheel. This is where a company takes a military HMMWV surplus wheel, they cut the center out of the wheel and then weld in a new center at the desired offset and bolt-pattern. This is a good option for the offroader that does not see much street/highway use. It allows you to run a double bead lock HMMWV wheel. It allows you to purchase military surplus HMMWV 37" tires that fit the HMMWV wheels for around $75-150 (depending on where you get them). Anytime you blow a tire or need a set of new ones the cost for a set of replacement tires is much less. The problem that comes with re-centered wheels is that no matter how well they're done, there is still a good chance that the new center that is welded or pressed in is not going to be true center. This causes an out of balance wheel at normal driving or highway speeds, and what people who have tried them and had problems usually call "death wobble". Every once in a while you get lucky and you'll get a re-centered wheel that is perfectly centered, but more times than not they're not.
The other option which is what we went with is to keep use the HMMWV double bead lock wheels in original form without modification. But the HMMWV wheels are 16.5x8.25 with a 7" backspacing and an 8x6.5 bolt pattern. No chance that will fit on a Land Cruiser. You could use a combination of adapters and spacers, but there are no spacers or adapters on the market that would a correct fit for this setup. To do it right you would need a wheel adapter that goes from the Toyota Land Cruiser 6x5.5 lug pattern to 8x6.5 HMMWV lug pattern, while being hub-centric and lug-centric to the Land Cruiser hub and also hub-centric and lug-centric to the HMMWV wheel, and also the being the correct depth to put the wheel backspacing at the correct place for the Land Cruiser. There wasn't an adapter out there that did all these things properly. So we measured, re-measured, drew one up on CAD, measured again, did some more measuring, cut a sample from scrap material, adjusted the CAD drawings, measured some more, had a set cut on the CNC and thats where we are today. The first set is on the truck for testing.
We'll be testing these for the next few weeks and putting them to the test at highway speeds, street driving, beating them up on the trails and rocks to test strength and checking them at intervals along the way. Once we're done with testing they'll be available for sale for you guys.
The advantage of doing it this way? You don't modify the wheel so it stays truly centered. You don't modify your vehicle. You have a proper hub-centric/lug-centric setup so that the wheel and hub always stay centered together. You are able to run the military 8 bolt, 12 bolt or 24 bolt double bead lock wheels without modification, and they cost around $75-150 per wheel (sometimes as low as $50). Because you're running a double bead lock wheel you can air down to 0 psi (zero) if you really wanted to and you won't lose the bead. You are able to purchase military surplus HMMWV tires at $75-150 per tire (sometimes less). And if you really want to be ready for the zombie apocalypse you can even run the military HMMWV runflat inserts so that you can keep on driving even if someone shoots out your tire
We'll also be working on a bolt-on "rock-ring" to protect the studs for you hardcore rock crawler types that are worried about the studs poking out.
Not everything in that post is accurate.
Your statement is vauge, is there a specific technical issue you want to address?
This is Tech, it is fair to have a technical discussion on products even between other vendors. FYI I do draw the line when competing vendors use that to state why their products are better. Not saying that is what is going on here
I have been asked by the thread OP to practice some common business courtesy and not jack up his thread.
I don't have any problems with wheel adapters that I will address in this tread. I believe the adapters in question look to be pretty legit from what I can tell by pictures.
I'm in a difficult position because if I talk tech in this thread I am stepping on the OP's toes. If I tell people about my opinion then others will see my motives as biased.
Any suggestions on how to move forward?
I don't have any problems with wheel adapters that I will address in this tread. I believe the adapters in question look to be pretty legit from what I can tell by pictures.
I'm in a difficult position because if I talk tech in this thread I am stepping on the OP's toes. If I tell people about my opinion then others will see my motives as biased.
Any suggestions on how to move forward?
NLXTACY
Wits' End
Post and let the mod gods decide.
If you have tech to contribute, please do so as long as you understand the bounds I listed above
Your friendly 80's moderator
Post your own solution (in another thread) and your assumed tech associated with it and let the masses decide which they want to do.
I agree with scottryana, start your own thread, and we, the readers will decide.
Mr. Moderator.... one last question. Is it better to talk tech in this thread or start a new one? If I start a new tech thread does that cross the line that requires me to be a vendor?
Maybe I missed some earlier posts. If you are Pimping your product not apprpriate. If you have some tech realted to this item, then that is appropriate.
We do not want to start a climate in tech where others are afraid to psot something tech, because they afraid of hurting a for sale thread. For sale threads belong in the venders section
New products are introduced in tech and are open to tech discussion related to that product. If he came in and said my spacers are better than yours because xxx, that would be inapprpriate.
If he is hitting on the negatives related to a competing product as a way to market his own or make it look better, inapproriate.
I hope that clarifies
We do not want to start a climate in tech where others are afraid to psot something tech, because they afraid of hurting a for sale thread. For sale threads belong in the venders section
New products are introduced in tech and are open to tech discussion related to that product. If he came in and said my spacers are better than yours because xxx, that would be inapprpriate.
If he is hitting on the negatives related to a competing product as a way to market his own or make it look better, inapproriate.
I hope that clarifies
Depends, PM me with what you want to chat about and I will help figure out what is appropriate
I went to the gov.liquidation site and checked a bunch of the tire/wheel lots, they are all advertised as "condition H7", which is unservicable or past the date code. Still a cheap way to get a set of wheels, though. And the tires may work fine. I've been thinking about going to 37's and you'll be hearing from me. Great product !
- Thread starter
- #156
Thanks! Let us know if you have any questions.I went to the gov.liquidation site and checked a bunch of the tire/wheel lots, they are all advertised as "condition H7", which is unservicable or past the date code. Still a cheap way to get a set of wheels, though. And the tires may work fine. I've been thinking about going to 37's and you'll be hearing from me. Great product !
Okay, here's a question. Not sure if I missed it earlier, but I've heard some bead-lock wheels are not DOT certified for on-highway use. I assume these ex-military wheels ARE okay for highway use ? Just another duck to get in the row. Thanks !!
- Thread starter
- #159
You are right, single bead lock wheels and modified re-centered HMMWV wheels are typically not DOT certified.Okay, here's a question. Not sure if I missed it earlier, but I've heard some bead-lock wheels are not DOT certified for on-highway use. I assume these ex-military wheels ARE okay for highway use ? Just another duck to get in the row. Thanks !!
Yes, these wheels are DOT certified if you use them in their un-modified form with our wheel adapters.
- Thread starter
- #160
Our shop truck is on OME medium springs in the front, and OME heavy springs in the rear. The rear clears with plenty of space. The front rubs slightly in one spot. If you wanted to you could run it on the same suspension setup we have on the EMSPowered truck and take a hammer or a cut off tool to the 3" section of metal in the wheel well that it rubs on.
For our use though. We are going to install OME J springs front/rear on the EMSPowered truck. That should give us around 3.75"-4" of lift and clear the tires just fine.
