RockJock82
Sometimes you have to kick a little A$$
Dang man we were almost neighbors!
Builds Another LS swap? Really??? (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter ARJMN
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- ls swap lx450 tucson csc
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- Thread starter
- #222
Yep! I also looked for houses over by you, but didn’t find any that checked the boxes. I need to get out of a neighborhood with HOA and no room for a shop.
When my 1FZ decides to let the smoke out, I want to drop in the 6BT.... following along!
PS, I love my certiflat table. those guys rock
PS, I love my certiflat table. those guys rock
- Thread starter
- #224
I love my certiflat table. I will have a much bigger one when i get into a new place with room. When it comes to layout and weld tables, i have never thought “you know there is just too much room here”
i am not sure what to do with the 1FZ that will come out. It is in amazing shape with exception of the oil pump. I will probably tear it down to check it put and learn. Maybe just do a stock refresh and sell for part cost. Who knows?
i’ve never ever said “that’s enough room” in relation to anything with a shop
@JunkCrzr89 may actually want to buy that 1FZ from you.
JunkCrzr89
Competent Ignoramoose
I would definitely be interested in getting the engine from you. Mine has 351k and I’m sure will $hit the bed at some point.i’ve never ever said “that’s enough room” in relation to anything with a shop
@JunkCrzr89 may actually want to buy that 1FZ from you.
- Thread starter
- #227
A quick update on the every lasting build project. I keep telling myself I am at 95% complete, which makes sense due to the last 10% taking 90% of the time. I am focusing on solving all the heat related issues now that we have some cooler temps coming. The engine cooling has not even been a consideration since adding the Ron Davis radiator and building a shroud that actually works. The issue I have is that the under hood temps are still a bit higher than I like, and are more than sufficient to boil the gasoline on the firewall mounted fuel filter/regulator. My plan is to bite the bullet, drop the tank to access the fuel lines, and relocate the F/R to the frame rail and install a GM fuel cooler like the donor truck had. I will also look to fabricate new fuel lines that run along the outside of the frame rail in order to keep them well away from the heat of the cats and exhaust tubing. Time to buy some more tools......bulk fuel line, flaring set, fittings, and bender are in order. It will be a PITA to have to drop that ****ing 38 gallon tank again, but if the whole effort solves the issue, it will be final tears shed over it. Peripheral to that is the decision to find another hood and start fresh from there on installing the required venting to clear the BTUs from under the bonnet. The setup I have now works very well, but is a little too "racer boy" for my taste. Then again, I had to do it to learn it. I threw everything I thought looked interesting at Lexi Jo, and I have learned heaps the past 3 years.
Also on the docket is and ABS/Charcoal Canister delete. My ABS has never worked on this rig, and when I took the instrument cluster apart to replace all the lights, I discovered that one of the POs removed the ABS light. In the end, it is ok as Lexi Jo has become my test mule for all the learning to be carried over to Project Rufus. I will be much more picky on how and what goes on to to Rufus when the build begins this winter. I also discovered that my DIY charcoal canister rehab has failed. I have abundant vacuum but it is not drawing the vapors off the tank, which combined with the fuel being heated under the hood, makes for the tank becoming a pressure vessel that announces its discontent with an audible and butt detectable BONNNNGGGG when the tank swells under pressure. I drilled out the center of the gas cap to allow it to vent positive pressure as an ICA, but that means the garage smells like gas and slow off-road breezes carry the pungent essence of 87 octane. What will occupy the reclaimed space??? Well, I do still have a hot water system brought back from Oz, as well as the makings of a full OBA system to install. I will at some point have to stop putting money into the gasser in order to focus on the oil burner, but I also recall that Lexi Jo will be my primary rig until Rufus is done, and it took me nearly 2 years of weekends before I had enough confidence in her to trek off for a long distance trip. I am much more prepared for the future build than I was for the past, so hopefully it wont be another ongoing project like this one.
I'll post up when I get to work this weekend. If you have experience with LS fuel systems and fancy a chat, reach out to me. I welcome all the learning I can get.
Also on the docket is and ABS/Charcoal Canister delete. My ABS has never worked on this rig, and when I took the instrument cluster apart to replace all the lights, I discovered that one of the POs removed the ABS light. In the end, it is ok as Lexi Jo has become my test mule for all the learning to be carried over to Project Rufus. I will be much more picky on how and what goes on to to Rufus when the build begins this winter. I also discovered that my DIY charcoal canister rehab has failed. I have abundant vacuum but it is not drawing the vapors off the tank, which combined with the fuel being heated under the hood, makes for the tank becoming a pressure vessel that announces its discontent with an audible and butt detectable BONNNNGGGG when the tank swells under pressure. I drilled out the center of the gas cap to allow it to vent positive pressure as an ICA, but that means the garage smells like gas and slow off-road breezes carry the pungent essence of 87 octane. What will occupy the reclaimed space??? Well, I do still have a hot water system brought back from Oz, as well as the makings of a full OBA system to install. I will at some point have to stop putting money into the gasser in order to focus on the oil burner, but I also recall that Lexi Jo will be my primary rig until Rufus is done, and it took me nearly 2 years of weekends before I had enough confidence in her to trek off for a long distance trip. I am much more prepared for the future build than I was for the past, so hopefully it wont be another ongoing project like this one.
I'll post up when I get to work this weekend. If you have experience with LS fuel systems and fancy a chat, reach out to me. I welcome all the learning I can get.
RockJock82
Sometimes you have to kick a little A$$
Are you running the GM vapor purge solenoid? Some fellas have added fender or hood vents to help some of the heat to escape.
- Thread starter
- #229
Sorry for the 6 month delay in responding...
I am not running the GM purge system anymore on the install, and to be honest, I am not sure the Speartech harness has provision for it. I dont recall how I ordered i, but I do recall having every connector plugged in to the engine. I am also not running fender vents, but I am running hood louvers made for JK and XJ Jeeps. I have it pretty well under control at this point and would like to find another hood so I could blend it all in and do it much cleaner than it is now. I am working on relocating the filter/regulator out from under the hood and moving it down to the frame rail just outside of the tank. There is a great space there and plenty of room. I will post some pics of the setup this weekend. On a side note, snaking those rigid fuel lines out in one piece was a task. I am sure they subbed those up on the body before it was dropped on the chassis. My last minute debate is whether or not to add a GM fuel cooler to the tank return. I might order one off Amazon and have it on hand in case I decide to do it. Stay tuned.
RockJock82
Sometimes you have to kick a little A$$
Fits here pretty good. Going to over do it and build an aluminum heat shield also. Main feed line is -an6 to the motor from the pump.
- Thread starter
- #231
That is very much like what I am thinking. Thanks for the pic!
I did not re-read the entire thread, but ? anyway. What are you guys doing on venting the gas tank. Are you just running the vent hose to the charcoal caniser and then what? or something else? I have a vent, but I know thats not where I want to be.
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- #233
I have trued a few different setups with mixed results. My charcoal canister fell to the same fate as many others, so i cut it open cleaned all the charcoal out, added new, welded it all back together, and then the check valve failed and would not vent the tank…adding to my tank swelling issue. I then removed all that stuff and vented to atmosphere via a line and sintered brass muffler inside the front bumper. This taught me the importance of keeping the vent as high above the tank as possible, and led to venting gas out the line when full and on a steep decline. I am now going the route of venting it inside the fuel filler cavity with a Holley vent/rollover valve. Stay tuned, I’ll post the results. I will make this statement on my own experience: dont do an extended main tank, do an aux tank if you need more fuel and don’t want to carry jerries. The Manefre 38 gallon tank, aside from consuming a ton more space underneath and crowding the tcase, is much longer and when you go up or down steep slopes, the fuel runs to the low end and can come gushing out of the filler neck when full. On top of that, the mods called out to the sending u it make the gauge read wonky.
Ok thanks for the feedback, I essentially have done the same thing as to venting to atmosphere, I simply ran a long hose over to the inside of the driver side fender ( this on a FJ60 with 5.7 vortec). I also had a similar case of "stupid" while on steep descent and raw gas is coming out the vent (thankfully the fuel) was clear to drain without hitting anything hot. But in the end, rather dumb on my part. I've looked at a couple of the roll-over type valves, but I'm not sure that would stop fuel flow until major angle changes. I've been looking for something that vents vapor / but not liquid, never been able to find anything so far. I probably had near a full tank of gas which made the situation worse. Very fun when you coming down the slope and you smell gas and you get out and see a straw sized flow of fuel (in my case up front of the driver side front tire and its going full tilt. At first I thought I had some type of fuel hose leak...but it was my vent (gas tank)
I've not studied the charcoal cannister setup and i'm not clear if it vents full time or enforces some controls as to pressue, so i'm think would simply have a full charcoal canister (full with gas) in not too much time (I'll plead ignorance on the full operation). I know my engine has a vaccum port (5.7 vortec) and I belive it has a vent arangement of some type ( i never installed the emmissions related vent setup) I may have to get out the red-neck engineering handbook and see. Of course if its ECM controlled that may be a problem becuse I doubt the aftermarket engine harness I have ...had any setup for that. I'm really looking for a simple mechanical soluation, I was hoping to find some type of valve that vents fumes but not liquid (and made for fuel) that could plumb into the vent line, maybe I'm dreaming. I plan to install one of the roll-over vents I have now, but I don't think thats the best safe solution.
I'm sure these guys with the hard core desert race setups have something, or that may just vent at a high point on the roll cage or something.
I've not studied the charcoal cannister setup and i'm not clear if it vents full time or enforces some controls as to pressue, so i'm think would simply have a full charcoal canister (full with gas) in not too much time (I'll plead ignorance on the full operation). I know my engine has a vaccum port (5.7 vortec) and I belive it has a vent arangement of some type ( i never installed the emmissions related vent setup) I may have to get out the red-neck engineering handbook and see. Of course if its ECM controlled that may be a problem becuse I doubt the aftermarket engine harness I have ...had any setup for that. I'm really looking for a simple mechanical soluation, I was hoping to find some type of valve that vents fumes but not liquid (and made for fuel) that could plumb into the vent line, maybe I'm dreaming. I plan to install one of the roll-over vents I have now, but I don't think thats the best safe solution.
I'm sure these guys with the hard core desert race setups have something, or that may just vent at a high point on the roll cage or something.
- Thread starter
- #235
I tapped some friends of a friend who build race rigs, and they run rollover valves routed way up high above the tanks. No evap system on those. Passenger vehicles use an active evap system but i dont know much on how they actually function. Most use engine vacuum to pull a vacuum on the tank by periodically opening the evap valve. Timed or feedback triggered…i don’t know.
Yea I agree, I've not devoted any study to the issue really but I'm aware that in the old days there was vaccum controls, and now you have electronic controls and some are dumb and some are ECM controlled, and the ECM also monitors fuel tank pressure.
I think the magic is getting the vent (end of the vent hose) above the fuel tank as high as that is possible (but has to vent outside the vehicle). The problem in my case or experince was descending a very steep slope, where the fuel tank likely became the high point of the fuel system and then of course that gave rise to the opportunity for liquid fuel to flow out the vent hose. I'm just in a delemia that will a roll-over valve deal with that....of course in the conecpt of the vehicle is not in a roll-over position. Maybe me a combination of a charcoal cannister / vent tank...and a rollover-valve.
I do understand the raw fuel / liquid fuel is going to potentially drain on teh vent hose...pending vehicle 60orientation. But I also would not want the vent tank or charocal cannister to become loaded up with liquid fuel . Vapor is one thing...liquid fuel is another, and I do follow gas vapor is dangerous too.
More study.... I will put a rollover value on my vent hose for now, but not sure thats the best solution as to the vent hose (in my case FJ60) that comes off teh firewall and of which I assume use to connect to the old school evap system. I thik the best best is to replicate the evap system in some manner, because the vehicle design and dynamics have not changed, but in my case the engine has changed and old evap stuff is long gone.
- Thread starter
- #237
Time for another update on the never ending project that is my LS swap. I have been saying with a smile for over a year that I am 95% complete, which is right in line with most personal/professional projects I have been involved with as 90% of the work occurs in the last 10% of the content. I think back to when I started and remember that I went from a running(knocking) and driving rig to a garage full of subassemblies and a gutted engine bay in 8 hours. From there it was a few weeks of enthusiastic days getting it cleaned, prepped, fitted, and tacked ahead of finally shoeing the new powertrain in for the first time. If I didn't say it in one of my previous posts, I had that engine in and out 13 times getting it all dialed, and I still have a lesson or two learned after the welds were cool and location was locked in. I would love to have another one in the future to try a few other details out. Note to self, keep eyes open for another donor. Beyond that admission that I have a problem that better for my health than drugs, but probably just as expensive, I do really enjoy this sh1t.
So, fuel system... After the work shown in the post above, I got back to the work of going the way pf progress again. To rehash the issue that I was trying to resolve, I have been fighting heat in the fuel. I placed the fuel filter/regulator in the engine bay up high and there is simply too much heat in there with the 6L pumping out BTUs like a furnace. The Chevy truck the engine came out of locates it on the frame rail, so no reason it cant go back there, right? @RockJock82 posted the pic from his latest build and that is right in line with what I wanted to do. My headache was that I chose to run a Manefre 38 gallon tank and while it is nice to have the added range, that damn thing is huge and sucks up all available space inside the frame rails. This left me to find real-estate on the other side of the rails. Luckily, there was plenty. To save you the toils of reading about all my iterations, I will only lay out the final one. In short, I always try to have items serve as many functions as they can while still being simple and robust. Using a CAD template, I was able to transfer the design over to some plate I had laying around. Since this was going to serve as the mounting plate and a stone guard for the filter/regulator, I had no qualms using 1/8" plate. It was within the capabilities of my press brake and was already powder coated black, so touch up was minimal. A quick note, M8 and M5 riv-nuts fit perfectly in the holes in the frame. I was able to make use of a number of them on this effort. Where I couldn't fit my riv-nut setter, I used a bolt and some washers to flare them instead.
So, fuel system... After the work shown in the post above, I got back to the work of going the way pf progress again. To rehash the issue that I was trying to resolve, I have been fighting heat in the fuel. I placed the fuel filter/regulator in the engine bay up high and there is simply too much heat in there with the 6L pumping out BTUs like a furnace. The Chevy truck the engine came out of locates it on the frame rail, so no reason it cant go back there, right? @RockJock82 posted the pic from his latest build and that is right in line with what I wanted to do. My headache was that I chose to run a Manefre 38 gallon tank and while it is nice to have the added range, that damn thing is huge and sucks up all available space inside the frame rails. This left me to find real-estate on the other side of the rails. Luckily, there was plenty. To save you the toils of reading about all my iterations, I will only lay out the final one. In short, I always try to have items serve as many functions as they can while still being simple and robust. Using a CAD template, I was able to transfer the design over to some plate I had laying around. Since this was going to serve as the mounting plate and a stone guard for the filter/regulator, I had no qualms using 1/8" plate. It was within the capabilities of my press brake and was already powder coated black, so touch up was minimal. A quick note, M8 and M5 riv-nuts fit perfectly in the holes in the frame. I was able to make use of a number of them on this effort. Where I couldn't fit my riv-nut setter, I used a bolt and some washers to flare them instead.
- Thread starter
- #238
After the paint cured for a few hours, I hung the bracket on the frame rail, followed by the filter assembly. I ended up opening the pass through up a bit to allow easier installation of the hose and to reduce the side load on the AN fittings.
- Thread starter
- #239
Next up was the construction of new fuel lines. The line from the filter forward to the engine is -6AN stainless steel braid and it sheathed in 3/4" Earl's Silicone Thermal Sleeve. This was on the expensive end of the scale at $11 per foot, but it is top notch stuff. I used some AN fittings I had left over from the original build, but I will say I have learned that there is a notable difference between the Amazon fittings here and the good ones you get from Summit, JEGS, or Don's Hot Rod in Tucson. THey are just cheaper in every way from finish, tolerance, and color. Good AN fittings will run from $12 and up depending on the size and design, so it is tempting to order a kit off Amazon, but I encourage you to spend the extra dollars for the good stuff if you can squeeze the turnip a bit harder. The hose was finished off with some Earl's Self Vulcanizing Tape. This stuff is the shizz, but you need to be 100% sure you are good when it contacts because the bond is instant and absolute. You will have to cut it off if you mess up. Next was to run a new vent line for the tank. Ideally this will run up as high as you can go, or run through the factory evap system if still in place. My charcoal canister signed off long ago and I have since removed it to reclaim that space under the hood. I ran the new vent line up the fill tube and installed a sintered brass muffler to serve as debris shield. This will not be a perfect solution if you get into water that deep, but as I can attest from my run of the Highwater Mark Trail in Arkansas in December, if the water is that high, you are already swamped.
- Thread starter
- #240
Since I have performed and ABS delete on my LX anyway, I made use of the routing formally reserved for the ABS harness. The hose runs forward from the filter and is clipped almost every 12 inches using Cat ladder clips on existing studs and captive nuts. Standard Cat 12mm cable ties were used along the frame and a blue high temp tie was used where it comes closest to the exhaust. The thermal shield runs all the way to the fuel rail and is routed outboard, up, and around the brake booster to stay well away from engine heat. So far this new layout has solved my vapor locking and fuel boiling issue. When the heat of summer arrives, if I see any evidence that this is not sufficient, a GM fuel cooler will be added. A space claim has been reserved for such a contingency.
