3.5 Ecoboost swap...thoughts? (1 Viewer)

[White Stripe]

SO....I was hoping for more "info" on a swap than suggestions on other options. I have my other option, it's an LS with a 4l65 or 4l80 to stock toyota split case, done/tried/true.

Getting info about the Hughes Adapter (3.5 EB to GM transmission) was what I'm looking for. I think having the 6r80 would be far superior, it's an extremely tough transmission and is designed for the EB. Going to a GM 4 speed might ruin the benefits of the swap, but would elimnate the transfercase issue. I've spent hours digging through other EB swaps and have narrowed things down to really one single insurmountable hurdle. The transfer case (as mentioned in this discussion) is a passenger side drop on our vehicles, while on all Fords it is a drivers side drop. This hurdle is somewhat big. The 6r80 has a 31 spline output 6 bolt pattern and no-one makes an adapter .

First option, I found some people saying you can swap the internals from a Ford NP205 (drivers drop) into a Chevy NP205 (passenger drop). Retaining the 31 spline input and 6 bolt pattern, I do believe it would bolt up to the 6r80. Second option, literally clock a ford NP205 to the other side and drill/tap new drain/fill/vent holes. The NP205 uses a lube bath (sounds fun?) not a pump, so lubrication shouldn't be an issue. Adjusting shift linkages would be doable but a PITA. Third option would be to find a machine shop capable of either converting the 6r80 output shaft to 19 spline or visa versa with the Toyota case.

Anyone else know how to remedy this problem?

To get a driver drop front diff you can flip the axle housing, flip the knuckle balls, and weld on new spring perches. Then you need to install new drain plug, weld up the old vent, drill and install new vent.

 

[Morgan Evans]

To get a driver drop front diff you can flip the axle housing, flip the knuckle balls, and weld on new spring perches. Then you need to install new drain plug, weld up the old vent, drill and install new vent.

Has anyone done this? Doesn't seem too difficult considering

 

[White Stripe]

Has anyone done this? Doesn't seem too difficult considering

No reason it can't be flipped that I'm aware of. U will also have to notch for ring gear clearance. About a days worth of fabrication if u can fabricate. Will probably have to cut the diff cover off and flip it also. Or weld on a aftermarket armor diff cover. Keep in mind your tcase linkage will be on the driver side after this.

 

[cruisermatt]

by the way. @cruisermatt , you said on my forum they bolt right in. you might want to rethink that

It seemed a appropriate response to your short vague question that seemed to have minimal thought behind it
@Morgan Evans is at least trying to figure out some actual tech info

Anyone run a divorced case in a 60/62? @cruisermatt you run a doubled 203, is it possible to double a 205/203 and get the output on the passenger side?

Sure, GM 205 or just use the 60 split case like I do.

 

[Morgan Evans]

So....Ford NP205 input gears put in a Chevy 6 bolt NP205 case appears to be the ticket as of now. 205's are getting pricey out there....

 

[60 toy ota]

To get a driver drop front diff you can flip the axle housing, flip the knuckle balls, and weld on new spring perches. Then you need to install new drain plug, weld up the old vent, drill and install new vent.

That'll give you 1 forward speed and 6(?) Reverse speeds. You'd also have flip the 3rd back to right side up

 

[chelo]

I've researched all of this. If you really are worried about the case and want to keep it auto, keep the ford 6r80 transmission and use an atlas case. The ford bronco guys are doing it.
The bronco guys are using the coyote engine though with the 6R80 with an aftermarket controller. Its starts to get spendy. The ford trans has been rated to take big power.

 

[bigboiimigel]

@cruisermatt its okay i was just playing with ya. If yall haven't seen it check out this guy who did an ecoboost swap on an f100 and see what he did. His is 2wd but the main internal concept is the same

1966 F100 EcoBoost Engine Swap (EcoBoosted)

1966 F100 EcoBoost Engine Swap & 1966 427 Project I had a couple requests in another post to show my EcoBoost project so thought I would start another thread. I love the 65-66 Ford body style and have since my Dad pulled into the drive way back in October 1965 with a brand new Red/Red 1966...

www.garagejournal.com

 

[White Stripe]

That'll give you 1 forward speed and 6(?) Reverse speeds. You'd also have flip the 3rd back to right side up

Yeah I figured he understood that but yes you are correct. Thats why you modify the diff cover and notch the housing for the ring gear being on the other side.

 

[Hydro556]

@Morgan Evans, quick ? at what rpm does it reach those #s you stated? they're fairly substantial but if you've got to twist it into the stratosphere to get them i'd not like it for wheelin'/ trail runnin'. or is your 60 strictly for sunday afternoon icecream runs? kudos to you for exploring unusual motivation though
oh, one other thing, f150 i believe is driver side drop on the t-case n our 60's are passenger drop.
just some fodder for thinkin'

Torque comes off idle. Amazing engine.
This is pre 17. Our second generation 3.5 is significantly more impressive. I'm a Toyota guy but Ford has shown the way forward.

 

[tmxmotorsports]

With all this hp talk i would just do away with the 60 series axles and tcase
Tommy

 

[kirvesmies]

Torque comes off idle. Amazing engine.
This is pre 17. Our second generation 3.5 is significantly more impressive. I'm a Toyota guy but Ford has shown the way forward.



View attachment 2221926

cool, thanks. ok, am i reading this correctly, upper red line is torque n lower one hp? damn! should've your post instead of just lookin' at pictures. that's impressive for only 3 n 1/2 litres

 

[Hydro556]

cool, thanks. ok, am i reading this correctly, upper red line is torque n lower one hp? damn! should've your post instead of just lookin' at pictures. that's impressive for only 3 n 1/2 litres

Red lines are HP and TQ for the 3.5 ecoboost, green is the smaller 2.7.

Those are 1st Gen engines I believe. 2017 saw the introduction of the 2nd Gen. The wife's 17 F150 has 375 hp and 475 TQ.

It's impressed me. Been reliable over 67k miles too. I don't baby it. Damn thing is fast.

Eta - the Raptor gets the HO version of the same engine. 450 hp and over 500 TQ, can't recall exact number on TQ.

 

[kirvesmies]

 

[Morgan Evans]

Yes the 3.5 EB is the most exciting engine out there right now IMO. The new Ford GT uses basically the same engine as the f150. And the 6r80 is rated to 600ftlbs. Need more adapters!

Could run Chevy axles. Not really much of Toyota at that point. And really getting into even more work.

Atlas will make a custom 31 spline passenger drop to fit the 6r80? This is what $3000?

I like the ideas here....

 

[GeologistFelix]

Seems to me, the most straightforward strategy would be to keep the Ferd trans/t-case, then pick your favorite centered rear axle and driver's side drop front axle for the size of tires you're interested in, and track width, then weld up 60-series perches onto the housings, then get custom driveshafts. Ignoring size issues for things like trying to cram a 6BT into the engine bay of a 60, this is basically how you can put literally any longitudinal engine in any body-on-frame truck.

 

[Morgan Evans]

@GeologistFelix, funny you say this, I am coming to the same conclusion. Keping the Ford powertrain together would be ideal. Next question, what axles work? Rear isn't a problem, front is more of an issue with everthing going IFS?

www.northwestfab.com/BlackBox-c-Land-Cruiser-Edition_p_2401.html Looks like for $2,000 you can keep the split case, gain a lower gear and adapt directly to the 6r80 output.

 

[Cruzerman]

I know I'm old. I know that my thoughts aren't sexy or popular, but I have no desire for that much power in my Cruiser. While having more power than my 2F would be nice, that much power is IMHO ridiculous. It isn't a sports car and will never be a good tow vehicle either. Now a small diesel that would develop low end torque and return good mpg would be more my direction.

That being said, my opinion means nothing. Do what makes sense to you.

 

[GeologistFelix]

@GeologistFelix, funny you say this, I am coming to the same conclusion. Keping the Ford powertrain together would be ideal. Next question, what axles work? Rear isn't a problem, front is more of an issue with everthing going IFS?

www.northwestfab.com/BlackBox-c-Land-Cruiser-Edition_p_2401.html Looks like for $2,000 you can keep the split case, gain a lower gear and adapt directly to the 6r80 output.

No comment on the Blackbox, other than "Thanks for reminding me that I want one," but you're in luck with the front end. Long story short, while the F150 is definitely IFS, it looks like the transfer case that bolts to the 6R80 has pretty much regular outputs -- one centered yoke for the rear axle, and one driver's-drop yoke for the front IFS, but you can really put whatever you want on the other end of that front shaft. The only big question mark is whether you'd need to put a different kind of yoke on there to handle the bigger range of angles that comes with a live front axle instead of an IFS sitting on a fixed crossmember. You might also have some issues with

In terms of things that would work in front...the conventional answer for a 60-sized rig, trying to keep that stock ~60" width, would be something like a Dana 44 if you're only ever going to run, say, 33" tires. I'd expect most people to say a Ford 9" axle for bigger tires, or a Dana 60 if you're doing big enough tires to justify one-ton axles. I'm pretty sure you could get custom Ford 9" front/rear axles ready to weld on the 60 suspension hardware (or whatever else you wanted to use in place of the stock leafs). The Ford 9" is a beefy axle, especially with upgraded shafts, but it also has the advantage of using removable third members like Yota axles, and a ton of aftermarket support for beefier shafts, gearsets, and lockers (I suspect because they're so popular as the rear ends for muscle cars/drag racers).

I feel like, with all of that stuff from the original rig replaced, I bet it would drive like a whole different truck. Whether that's a good thing is entirely up to you, and it sounds like you'd appreciate it.

It's easy to spend other people's money on the internet, so I say go for it!

 

[cruisermatt]

Passenger drop Atlas and center a FZJ80 rear axle or a doubler to Split case and keep 60/80 axles would be the only options I’d consider for small tires (37”- down). I don’t see swapping to drivers side drop or different brand of axle worth saving on a transfer case that probably isn’t ideal for a cruiser anyways