And since we are talking about pistons here is the GEN2 piston. It does appear to have a little less dish but it's not a massive difference.
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- #122
Very interested, just don't quite understand what you would like. Perhaps pm me as this post is starting to go off in another direction.
When I get back and begin posting again that may change.
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- #123
They look like they actually might have more dish volume as they have dropped the squish pads. Know anyone who has these that we could measure. You can actually cc pretty accurately using a syringe or even a graduated measuring cup.
I have a burrette but it's easy to get close without.
I will see if I can get one of the Aussie guys to CC them and yeah you can get very close with a piece of Lexan with a hole drilled in it and a small syringe.
I was going to have you do the same to the combustion chamber. Flip the head over level it and then put the Lexan over the combustion chamber and fill it. Just need to have the valves closed and a spark plug installed.
I was going to have you do the same to the combustion chamber. Flip the head over level it and then put the Lexan over the combustion chamber and fill it. Just need to have the valves closed and a spark plug installed.
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- #125
Sorry Scott. I understand now. I already cc'd the combustion chamber, piston dish and intake ports. I don't have the measurements with me but I recall chamber was 74, dish was 12 I think, can't remember ports.
I used a burrette and stand but didn't bother with the cover so may be up to 2 cc out. When I'm building I will be more accurate.
I used a burrette and stand but didn't bother with the cover so may be up to 2 cc out. When I'm building I will be more accurate.
Cool thanks!
Using the numbers you have so far surprisingly the compression ratio is only 8.69:1
Bore = 100mm
Stroke = 95mm
Headgasket bore = 103mm
Headgasket thickness = 1.34mm/0.053"
Combustion chamber = 74cc
Piston dish = 12cc
So coming up to 10-10.5:1 might give you some pretty surprising result.
Using the numbers you have so far surprisingly the compression ratio is only 8.69:1
Bore = 100mm
Stroke = 95mm
Headgasket bore = 103mm
Headgasket thickness = 1.34mm/0.053"
Combustion chamber = 74cc
Piston dish = 12cc
So coming up to 10-10.5:1 might give you some pretty surprising result.
What was the reported stock compression ratio?
9:1 so we are pretty close given that there might be a little fudge factor CC'ing the chamber/pistons but I really doubt it given Hazards shown he is pretty precise.
I have brought this up a few times on the Turbo 1FZ FB group, but we have manufacturers mostly overseas and some stateside that are making performance parts for the 1FZ. Like Pistons, cams, etc. But not a single manufacture differentiates between GEN1 and GEN2 and I am saying that if you take the exact same piston and drop it into a GEN1 and GEN2 engine you will end up with a very different compression ratio.
SO when we are buying these aftermarket parts. Are they designed for the guys in the Middle East that have been hoping up the 1FZ for years and if so are they for the GEN1 or GEN2 head? For 99% of the population it won't really matter, but for guys like Hazard that are building with a very specific goal in mind it is something to be aware of.
I have brought this up a few times on the Turbo 1FZ FB group, but we have manufacturers mostly overseas and some stateside that are making performance parts for the 1FZ. Like Pistons, cams, etc. But not a single manufacture differentiates between GEN1 and GEN2 and I am saying that if you take the exact same piston and drop it into a GEN1 and GEN2 engine you will end up with a very different compression ratio.
SO when we are buying these aftermarket parts. Are they designed for the guys in the Middle East that have been hoping up the 1FZ for years and if so are they for the GEN1 or GEN2 head? For 99% of the population it won't really matter, but for guys like Hazard that are building with a very specific goal in mind it is something to be aware of.
Seems like a perfect turbo compression ratio.
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- #130
I agree, when I get back, I will get all my measurements and calculate exact compression of each cyl. I haven't made up my mind fully but as I am probably going NA I will likely design at 10:1, which would still withstand some boost if I choose to. Problem I have at moment is if I do go 110 the supplier (PPM Australia) will only supply complete rotating assembly, and I want to design my own pistons and rods as they are the crux to making this combo work. They say they have designed a workable package but the. numbers they give (stock except 110 stroke and 37CD, which is still 2mm too high)me don't add up. If they won't talk or deal I will go 107 with Crower and get my own piston and rods designed
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Care to share what the entire rotating assembly out of Oz would be? Shipping?
- Thread starter
- #132
About $10,000 Canadian dollars, crank, rods, pistons pins rings. $350 Canadian shipping. Cheaper than Crower, for the most part, and pretty sure it's a much higher quality product and probably a lot more experience in building these engines for big power as they service the sand drag guys from UAE. However, harder to get support probably if package is not up to snuff.
Pure Performance Motorsport Home page
Have you built the engine in a compression ratio calculator program like Performance Trends has ? It'll give you static and dynamic compression ratios as well as cranking compression estimates(if cam specs & intake lobe centerline are input). It's been years since I've used my program and I'm wondering what the latest and greatest is. Had great results with an SBC years ago and the cranking compression #s were spot on.
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- #134
I did a lot of work with the demo version of Performance Trends pro version. But that was before teardown and all the specs I generates. I may buy the program later but it's quite expensive. I really should buy it first as it makes working out dynamic compression ratio a snap over manual, and that really should be done before deciding on static ratio.They do have great software for lots of engine stuff, including a mileage performance program, engine building logbook etc.
If you bought the program and no longer use, do you want to sell it? What version?
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Couldn't seem to find anyone on the internet that has used that stroker kit. I like the idea, but I don't want to be a pioneer... They go off and often have horrible endings.
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- #136
I don't mind being Guinevere pig. As long as planned well should really be no issues. Just a little concerned about working with someone at distance. I'll figure out what I am going to do soon.
- Thread starter
- #137
Also need a junker head.
I had the Pro version. Originally bought in 2002 and it's proprietary to your computer so I've had to call them and get the code a few times when I got new laptops. Not sure if I could 'sell' it but I'll get it on my new laptop and run #s for you if you want.
I'm looking at putting together another 1FZ-FE that's built to be boosted. Maybe 8:1 with a Camtech cam advanced a little to shift the power down low. Even considering a 105 series cylinder head with crank trigger ignition, but I'm not sure how that'd work with an additional pulley(over stock) up front on the damper. It's all about the intake closing point and I'd like to be able to run 87 octane & be able to set my own ignition curve too.
I'm looking at putting together another 1FZ-FE that's built to be boosted. Maybe 8:1 with a Camtech cam advanced a little to shift the power down low. Even considering a 105 series cylinder head with crank trigger ignition, but I'm not sure how that'd work with an additional pulley(over stock) up front on the damper. It's all about the intake closing point and I'd like to be able to run 87 octane & be able to set my own ignition curve too.
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- Thread starter
- #139
Back from playing with my Toy in Baja.
Installed a new ScanTool gauge and got a bit of info:
I averaged 21 litres/hundred K's for the trip. Not too bad considering a fair bit of 4x4 and 90% bad rolling roads. Might actually be a bit better as I did not calibrate speed for the larger tires.
Water temp was steady at 193 degrees even in 30 degree weather.
Inlet air temperature 110-115 degrees
Ignition timing was anywhere from 4-36 degrees.
Truck seems to have reasonable pep when driving but if I go on loose sand and get stuck and put it in 4x4 I cannot even spin the tires and have to put it in low range. Does that sound normal, as I have never driven one with a fresh motor?
A few trip picks.
And now back to work on project.
Installed a new ScanTool gauge and got a bit of info:
I averaged 21 litres/hundred K's for the trip. Not too bad considering a fair bit of 4x4 and 90% bad rolling roads. Might actually be a bit better as I did not calibrate speed for the larger tires.
Water temp was steady at 193 degrees even in 30 degree weather.
Inlet air temperature 110-115 degrees
Ignition timing was anywhere from 4-36 degrees.
Truck seems to have reasonable pep when driving but if I go on loose sand and get stuck and put it in 4x4 I cannot even spin the tires and have to put it in low range. Does that sound normal, as I have never driven one with a fresh motor?
A few trip picks.
And now back to work on project.
- Thread starter
- #140
Before I left I cc'ed some volumes, only did one of each as I will do all when matching during build. Might be out a bit as I didn't use a cover, but probably by not more than a cc or so.
Combustion chamber 72 cc
Piston dish 13 cc
Individual intake port from valve to port divider 36 cc each
Intake port above divider (services both valves) 40 cc
Total intake port 112 cc
Individual exhaust port from valve to port divider 22 cc each
Exhaust port above divider (services both valves) 52.5 cc
Total exhaust port 96.5 cc
Interesting stuff, I guess they are after speeding velocity until divider and then improving flow., for better low end. Anyone ever flow tested a stock head? If so send me results please.
With these numbers, and 0.053 gasket at 101mm. and 0.005 below deck piston (an average of all my measurements), I get a static compression ratio of 8.7/1.
If we input stock cam specs ( IVC @ 9 deg ABDC) the dynamic (actual compression ratio) is 8.5/1.
If I use a stage 1 (mildest) aftermarket cam spec (IVC @ 39.5 ABDC)the Dynamic compression of 7.5/1.
Not sure my compression ratio yet but definitely more than this, although I must be able to run 87 octane for Baja so may have to adjust timing with octane rating or have water/meth injection.
Combustion chamber 72 cc
Piston dish 13 cc
Individual intake port from valve to port divider 36 cc each
Intake port above divider (services both valves) 40 cc
Total intake port 112 cc
Individual exhaust port from valve to port divider 22 cc each
Exhaust port above divider (services both valves) 52.5 cc
Total exhaust port 96.5 cc
Interesting stuff, I guess they are after speeding velocity until divider and then improving flow., for better low end. Anyone ever flow tested a stock head? If so send me results please.
With these numbers, and 0.053 gasket at 101mm. and 0.005 below deck piston (an average of all my measurements), I get a static compression ratio of 8.7/1.
If we input stock cam specs ( IVC @ 9 deg ABDC) the dynamic (actual compression ratio) is 8.5/1.
If I use a stage 1 (mildest) aftermarket cam spec (IVC @ 39.5 ABDC)the Dynamic compression of 7.5/1.
Not sure my compression ratio yet but definitely more than this, although I must be able to run 87 octane for Baja so may have to adjust timing with octane rating or have water/meth injection.
