Wits End Order Issues / Joey Romero (7 Viewers)

[quickdraw]

I'm creating a new post following a lengthy discussion in the turbo owners thread about various issues in communication and delivery of turbo kits. Personally, in spite of all of the challenges I would still prefer to have the turbo and I'm happy to wait. I love Joey's gear. However, given what appears to be growing evidence of fraud I have little hope of receiving it.

@NLXTACY - I'm twenty-three months in without communication about a $6,000 item that was promised within a year. There appears to be six-to-ten others just on turbo orders alone, likely more though. Like others, a basic status update and estimate of delivery - two sentences tops (which noting your social media habits should not be an issue) - and I would be fine. I'm happy to be patient. I suspect others would be as well. But your approach is unprofessional and surprising given the amount of money we're talking about here and the longstanding loyalty of the customers that you're subjecting to this nonsense. "I get to choose who I want to have as a customer". and all of your variations of that do not apply here. You've already chosen and have failed. It's time to deliver on your commitment.

Many of your other projects and orders ship, you provide updates enthusiastically, you develop countless new products and custom projects, and your personal and market supply chain issues don't appear to effect those. The lack of communication is the absolute worst thing here and leads me to assume the worst.

Assuming you ignore this like all of the other attempts to reasonably communicate, I will continue my efforts with the BBB (Case #20245438), FTC Fraud Department (Case #161368493) and the Oregon attorney general's office and will solicit support from other customers with issues to bolster the cases. If you are not aware, with my order alone, you are blatantly violating federal consumer protection laws with significant liability.

For those that don't have this information:
Wits End
4445 Table Rock Rd
Central Point, OR 97502

@NLXTACY
joey.romero@gmail.com
joey@absolute-wits-end.com

Joey Romero

Joey Romero is on Facebook. Join Facebook to connect with Joey Romero and others you may know. Facebook gives people the power to share and makes the world more open and connected.

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Wits' End | Medford OR

Wits' End, Medford, Oregon. 1,699 likes · 3 talking about this. Wits’ End develops useful tools and products geared to the Land Cruiser and Toyota truck enthusias

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Wits' End (@wits.end) | Instagram

11K Followers, 3,802 Posts - Lots of non-sucky Land Cruiser goodness

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213-304-9901

In addition to reasonable and polite requests for updates via email, text, phone, instagram and FB messages, I have sent this thread to all of the above so there is no doubt that he is unaware.

Those with possible issues from their comments in these forums:
@webster2001 @landtank @lazy @LandCruiserPhil @Hoorejo @bajaguy949 @NeverFinis @heckler @nukegoat @quickdraw @SucioP @ChargedSHOTaco @Bisonthecruiser @PDXDave67 @PIP @ZIFFFZJ80 @80 Life @ericb1 @FJsapper @onsse @CJK @MK80 @thatcabledude @Chaser503 @doctorres112 @Freestone40 @jsloden @NoRoads @Mbridenour @stewtopia @trdaristo @SKhan @JoeCova @frontbumper @jogarr @ckennedy @Jsvits @Bella1992 @Dark Knight @largeone @neto @69vortec @nodor @FMC80 @Rouleur @REKCUT @LandCruiser65 @CruiserCarl @mattnandie @GILBERTO PEREZ @Dangler @BlackMammoth @Stylo07 @fordyota @wester11 @98100series @user20084603 @mattimooseprime @Scrambled @Sucrose


Existing "Buyer Beware" Threads and reviews:

Wits End Turbo Owners

So far we have... ChargedTaco 2/2020 8/2022 (missing wategate, not rec'd) Lazy 8/2020 PDXDave67 2/2021 I believe people's cooperation in putting this together, even if you have received yours, is helpful to the community. Just respond and I'll add you to the table. This is a great...

forum.ih8mud.com

Wit's End?

Hi - I ordered CV boots and a few other things from Wit's End on Feb 2nd, but the order status still shows "Awaiting Fulfillment". I've emailed Joey, used the Contact Us form, and called the number listed on the website several times, but no response. Is this typical? Is there a better way to...

forum.ih8mud.com

Absolute Witt’s end?!?!?!?

I purchased the quarter panel mount and paid for it several months ago and according to Joey’s website I should’ve received it around Christmas. Now every time I email him my email system tells me that that email address no longer works. His voicemail is full. Is he alive? Is my quarter panel...

forum.ih8mud.com

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/wits-end.1315893/

Negative Wit's End Experience

First off, I know this post may get a lot of criticism from friends and customers of Joey. I have purchased many items from Wit's End and been supportive of the business. I've even stood up for the business on other threads talking about negative experiences. However, my most recent experience...

forum.ih8mud.com

Best way to get ahold of Wits-End?

Interesting. Sounds like either he omitted part of the order (it's a single "item" so it shouldn't have shipped without the Anderson plug and boots) or perhaps you are mistaken on what you ordered and possibly ordered the bare brackets? I'd double check your order, and if it's the former case...

forum.ih8mud.com

Absolute Wits End

Does anyone know how to get a hold of these guys? I placed an order 10 days ago and ive emailed, called, created an account and messaged directly and I cannot get a response. I ordered a leak kit for my 80 and i wanted to be able to install the new parts mid next week. Order says "awaiting...

forum.ih8mud.com

Wits End - they’ve stopped answering emails.

I bought something from Wits End on 18 June, emailed on 24June and was told they expected to have my item ready the following week. Since then I’ve sent 2 emails, neither of which got a response. I can’t find a phone number for this business, anyone here have info on Wits End or if the business...

forum.ih8mud.com

Absolute-wits-end Reviews - 1.0 Stars

2 reviews for Absolute-wits-end, 1.0 stars: 'Bought common Items and waited 30 day and no word or nothing shipped Some might say i didn't wait long enough. NO emails answered. Here what really got me thinking I made a mistake ordering from them was their own words in my receipt that said. Please...

www.sitejabber.com

Google Reviews
Facebook Reviews

I think it's import to collect all of these issues in one spot to prevent problems like this in the future for others. Plenty customers have made large purchase decisions based on the previously deserved but now misguided enthusiastic support of Wit's End.

For those continued supporters of Wit's End, please review these threads. He uses victimhood to garner support and distract from his many notable business failures (acknowledging some legitimate issues that while sympathetic, many business owners deal with and successfully navigate equivalents, including myself). I have been a rabid supporter of Wit's End and Joey for seven years, spent countless thousands of dollars, promoted the company, and even offered to buy him a ****ing building to solve his supposed real estate issue (that amounted to his own carelessness then blamed on his landlord). I'm disappointed I didn't notice all of this sooner but as best I can tell now, no other vendor has had as many serious complaints here that are cleverly dismissed. Regardless, in my opinion, what's occurring is not excusable for a prominent business owner and member of this community.

Happy to update this with other people that have issues or other locations documenting problems. I'm hoping the community can come together to create accountability.

@lazy - Do you want to add your order issues list here?

 

[nodor]

Queue the posts from Joey and his fan boys trying to justify his business practices. They are absolutely delusional.

Joey is a fraud. He makes decent products but as a business he is a fraud. There is no excuse.

 

[ewillis]

Unfortunate to read about all the issues. Regardless, his wife’s contact information should not be listed here. That is out of bounds.

 

[quickdraw]

Unfortunate to read about all the issues. Regardless, his wife’s contact information should not be listed here. That is out of bounds.

With respect, she was responding on behalf of the business with 'Mrs. Wits End' and is posting on behalf of the business. Including committing to provide a response to turbo orders and suggesting they were still going out without any response since. No other contact information is listed aside from her business account. If it were her personal information I would agree.

 

[nodor]

Unfortunate to read about all the issues. Regardless, his wife’s contact information should not be listed here. That is out of bounds.

It should absolutely be posted here if she is responding on his behalf and is functioning as part of his business.

 

[Spike Strip]

From MUD 'Terms of Use':

You are prohibited from posting any Content that is illegal, obscene, defamatory, infringing or otherwise objectionable. We reserve the right, but are not obligated to, moderate any and all Content on the Site according to Our own standards. However, the fact that We do not moderate certain Content is not an endorsement by Us of that Content. We have the right to enforce these Terms in any manner We deem appropriate, but We are not bound by any enforcement measures We may use.

 

[nodor]

From MUD 'Terms of Use':

You are prohibited from posting any Content that is illegal, obscene, defamatory, infringing or otherwise objectionable. We reserve the right, but are not obligated to, moderate any and all Content on the Site according to Our own standards. However, the fact that We do not moderate certain Content is not an endorsement by Us of that Content. We have the right to enforce these Terms in any manner We deem appropriate, but We are not bound by any enforcement measures We may use.

Shall we then go back through and remove all of Joey’s posts “defaming” his own customers?

 

[quickdraw]

From MUD 'Terms of Use':

You are prohibited from posting any Content that is illegal, obscene, defamatory, infringing or otherwise objectionable. We reserve the right, but are not obligated to, moderate any and all Content on the Site according to Our own standards. However, the fact that We do not moderate certain Content is not an endorsement by Us of that Content. We have the right to enforce these Terms in any manner We deem appropriate, but We are not bound by any enforcement measures We may use.

@Spike Strip I'm unclear on the takeaway here. Is this in reference to posting the business contact information, not personal, of the two owners where the main issue is communication? Just want to be on the right side of the rules here.

 

[Feldrian]

Not exactly doxxing anyone here.

 

[Idaho Savage]

Posting contact information for a woman presumably fighting for her life against cancer is one of the lowest and despicable things I've seen in a while.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Posting contact information for a woman presumably fighting for her life against cancer is one of the lowest and despicable things I've seen in a while.

Personal matters are just that - personal. If she's actively representing the business, as the above posts suggest, then she can handle a conversation about said business. Her personal issues, as is her gender, are absolutely irrelevant.

Fraud is fraud.

 

[Idaho Savage]

Personal matters are just that - personal. If she's actively representing the business, as the above posts suggest, then she can handle a conversation about said business. Her personal issues, as is her gender, are absolutely irrelevant.

Fraud is fraud.

Whatever you have to tell yourself, right? I mean, I'm sure that all the stress, pain and loathing of facing down death is just "personal," anyway, not business!

Low, low and lower.

 

[Spike Strip]

@Spike Strip I'm unclear on the takeaway here. Is this in reference to posting the business contact information, not personal, of the two owners where the main issue is communication? Just want to be on the right side of the rules here.

Not speaking specifically here to your posting/issue, but I think posts like this do much better to just state facts and leave as much emotion out of it as possible, though I understand this is a very emotional issue since it involves a lot of money.

You shotgun all this info, and frankly, it seems like you want to direct peeps to harass Wit's End personnel.

Full disclosure here, I know Joey and Ms Wit's End and Joey has been to my house, though that was many many years ago when he was still in Los Angeles. I've purchased a number of items from Wit's End, both here and past the move to BF Oregon. Never an issue.

Hope you can resolve this issue to your satisfaction.

Please remember, Wit's End is a small, Family Business and often operates as such and can be weighed down when family issue arise.

Cheers.

 

[nodor]

Personal matters are just that - personal. If she's actively representing the business, as the above posts suggest, then she can handle a conversation about said business. Her personal issues, as is her gender, are absolutely irrelevant.

Fraud is fraud.

Exactly this. No get out of jail free card here. If you’re implicated you’re implicated.

Whatever you have to tell yourself, right? I mean, I'm sure that all the stress, pain and loathing of facing down death is just "personal," anyway, not business!

Low, low and lower.

Here come the delusional fan boys making their excuses and trying to detract from the fact that both Joey and his wife are implicated in fraud. There are no excuses. We all have personal issues. We still wake up every morning and try to be professionals about our business and not use those issues as excuses for illegal activity.

 

[JoeCova]

Just because someone hasn’t had an issue doesn’t mean they are a fan boy or delusional and those that think so only distract from the original messaging.

 

[nodor]

Just because someone hasn’t had an issue doesn’t mean they are a fan boy or delusional and those that think so only distract from the original messaging.

Excusing blatant fraud just because someone has not had an issue themselves is in fact delusional.

 

[Idaho Savage]

I've never met nor done business with Joey. I just believe in a certain degree of human decency, even on the internet. You could have made your points and circled your wagons just as effectively without involving Mrs. Joey. But definitely carry on, as apparently nothing is personal, even cancer.

 

[EWheeler]

Pressure to make this right needs to come from the community that puts food on their table, because they obviously dont have the ethics to make it right without that pressure. Without spreading the word about fraud, people will continue to fall victim, is that what the collective wants? A few eggs will get broken, but as long as the poor business practice doesnt/hasnt effected you, the victims losses dont matter? Personal health issues are tragic and unfortunate, but that does not excuse taking folks money, and not delivering the product. Thats theft.

I wish good health on everyone and hope all parties are made whole. If that cant happen, dude needs to file BK and find a new career.

 

[nodor]

I've never met nor done business with Joey. I just believe in a certain degree of human decency, even on the internet. You could have made your points and circled your wagons just as effectively without involving Mrs. Joey. But definitely carry on, as apparently nothing is personal, even cancer.

Human decency involves not defrauding customers of thousands of dollars. If personal issues get in the way, you give the money back or at they very least keep some sort of communication going. Personal issues are obviously not the issue with communication here as Joey still routinely posts on social media. If he has time to post on social media he has time to communicate with customers regarding the thousands of dollars he has taken from them and failed to deliver on. That is human decency.

 

[heckler]

You shotgun all this info, and frankly, it seems like you want to direct peeps to harass Wit's End personnel.

I honestly do not think the intention of the thread is to promote harassment of anyone or attack someone's personal life or medical situation.

Just like Quickdraw said:

"Personally, in spite of all of the challenges I would still prefer to have the turbo and I'm happy to wait. I love Joey's gear. However, given what appears to be growing evidence of fraud I have little hope of receiving it.

@NLXTACY - I'm twenty-three months in without communication about a $6,000 item that was promised within a year. There appears to be six-to-ten others just on turbo orders alone, likely more though. Like others, a basic status update and estimate of delivery - two sentences tops (which noting your social media habits should not be an issue) - and I would be fine. I'm happy to be patient."

The thread in the 80 series forum went to hell and starting a thread in the right section seems appropriate to me.