Outsane
Supporting Vendor
Delta rear pan hard lift was dramatic change same suspension. Also the bushings fell apart after a few years.
truck felt unstable after being lifted
- Thread starter euro400
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77mustard40
SILVER Star
2” Ironman coils and springs here with Landtank 2.5” plates and the Delta lift bracket in the rear. I was all over the road after installing the springs and shocks, the caster plates solved that but it still had a wiggle in the rear entering and exiting corners, Delta lift bracket solved that. This was probably the lowest cost suspension upgrade I could do and so far I’m pleased. Wheeled it pretty hard at Roundup last week and didn't have any issues with the arms hitting the steering linkage.
- Thread starter
- #43
Is studying the alignment printout a way to verify the bushings were installed correctly?
mudgudgeon
Resident galah
If your shop needs you to spoon feed them this info, they are not the right shop.
mudgudgeon
Resident galah
I highly doubt that figure. You would have absolutely zero rubber around the centre sleeve in the bushing and I still don't think you'd achieve 4⁰ with bushings.
Wear on them would be terrible too!
mudgudgeon
Resident galah
Yes. Ask them for a print out and post it here
SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
The bushings just don’t cut it. I was always chasing sheep with my bushings, once I changed to castor plates it was much better
There is no reason to do the caster plates and delta vs control arms. They will both correct caster.
Here is what you should do....
1. Forget about the caster plates than call delta vs and order their arms based on your lift. This will give you correct caster. The delta arms are the ultimate solution for caster. With the delta arms you won't need the lame icon bushings either.
2. Rear panhard bracket.
3. All new suspension bushings. Ie, panhard bushings front and rear, Also the delta arms will come with all new Toyota bushings installed.
4. New sway bar bushings and drop links.
5. Drive it and if it still does not seem adequate than start worrying about the front panhard and adjustable upper and lower rear arms.
The Nuclear Option, but absolutely 100% correct.
SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
Still have yet to do the rear panhard tower and I'm 4" high. I did put an adjustable bar in, does the bracket really make that big of a difference?
It's mostly placebo IMO.
Negative caster sounds fun. Not sure if it was mentioned already, but have you checked your rear control arm bushings, particularly the uppers? If they're original bushings good chance their cracked which can give the axle more room to sway about. The rear suspension on the trucks is truly awful with lots of oversteer once you lift them. No amount of adjustable arms will fix that.
SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
Your caster is on the bottom limit of whats acceptable per the FSM, I prefer it at 3-4 degrees. IMO Caster is the primary contributor to a rig that wonders, becomes exhausting to correct, and provides the driver with a nervous high-speed driving experience. This is because caster is the adjustment that determines how much "return to center" force the wheel has.
Return to center is an action that happens when you turn your steering wheel to the left or right lock then let go of it and start accelerating, a properly set up vehicle will begin to straighten the wheel on its own. A vehicle with not enough caster or negative caster will either barely attempt to or just flat out fail to return to center. When you are driving at high speeds the correct "return to center" pull is what gives the vehicle straight-line stability, if it's not there or lacking it will wander all over the road like you are chasing sheep.
Return to center is an action that happens when you turn your steering wheel to the left or right lock then let go of it and start accelerating, a properly set up vehicle will begin to straighten the wheel on its own. A vehicle with not enough caster or negative caster will either barely attempt to or just flat out fail to return to center. When you are driving at high speeds the correct "return to center" pull is what gives the vehicle straight-line stability, if it's not there or lacking it will wander all over the road like you are chasing sheep.
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SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
Also what size tires are you running? Larger tires respond better to slightly more toe-in.
- Thread starter
- #55
LT305/70R-18 BFGOODRICH ALL-TERRAIN T/A KO2 E
Here is what you should do....
1. Forget about the caster plates than call delta vs and order their arms based on your lift. This will give you correct caster. The delta arms are the ultimate solution for caster. With the delta arms you won't need the lame icon bushings either.
2. Rear panhard bracket.
3. All new suspension bushings. Ie, panhard bushings front and rear, Also the delta arms will come with all new Toyota bushings installed.
4. New sway bar bushings and drop links.
5. Drive it and if it still does not seem adequate than start worrying about the front panhard and adjustable upper and lower rear arms.
Op... he is talking about the blue circled items Upper items primarily. Also indicated it on a real picture i also stole from the internets tube.. Not sure if either image helps you picture it. The general wisdom for these rigs, is that any rubber bushing used to hold an axle in place, past 20 years old, is probably needing changing soon, and now that you have lifted it, rubber that was formed over the ages is now being pushed in a slightly different direction and it isn't as pliable as it was before. hopefully this helps you visualize what people are talking about.
mudgudgeon
Resident galah
Seriously, forget Luigi and his exotic Italians. Find another shop.
You have negative caster. This is horrible, and for the most part, it's responsible for what you're not happy with.
You should have around positive 2⁰ to 4⁰ of caster.
If you have negative caster after fitting correction bushes, your only options are aftermarket radius arms such s Delta, or drop brackets.
Rear camber is not adjustable on these vehicles.
The camber reading here is either a measuring error, or a bent rear axle housing, I'd say measuring error.
SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
Oooooo GOOD CATCH, I totally missed the negative symbol in there and just focused on the value. @mudgudgeon is 100000% correct that CASTER is your issue. If your alignment shop didn't immediately point this out as a major issue you need a new alignment shop, seriously no joke, if they didn't bring it up it means they don't know s***. NO modern cars use negative caster.
OR castor correction plates + Remove the castor bushings and replace with OEM bushings
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- Thread starter
- #60
Thank you. These pictures help me visualize much better. It doesn't mean I've got it 100%... I am not mechanically inclined lol
