Its also the lowest quality, very harsh ride
Builds mcgaskins' 2016 build thread - Ruby (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter mcgaskins
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Its also the lowest quality, very harsh ride
I don't know anything about their product, other than the GVM increase. I have the actual spring rates posted somewhere around here as well. My interest was in using the numbers as a proxy for what would seem an equivalent weight capacity upgrade for other suspension systems... basically just to answer the question of how much additional weight you could safely carry with heavier springs.
Tommy Dwyer
SILVER Star
Looking forward to the transformation. What size Ridge Grapplers are you running on the stock wheels.
He’s running LT285/70R18 E 127/124Q
Tommy Dwyer
SILVER Star
Thanks, that’s what I thought I read WAY back in the thread......but I’m old, and couldn’t remember for certain
Edited to correct liquid amount (It said 1.5 gallons...should have said 19.5!).
About weight and handling...
Having adequately heavy rear springs helps a lot, but there’s another thing that I noticed plays a huge role—even more significant than I expected. That is center of gravity and weight placement.
We all know that heaviest weights are best kept low in the vehicle, but I recently observed just how important it really is with a specific, recent comparison.
I have up to 19.5 gallons of liquid on my bumper swing-outs. But...I also have a 24 gallon 2nd fuel tank that is up-armored and heavy even when not full. It is AMAZING the difference this 16 gallons make compared to the much heavier tank/24 gallons. When I fuel both tanks for 48.6 gallons of fuel...I feel the weight in acceleration, but I REALLY feel the handling difference when I fill my swingout jerry cans on my much higher basket...and put my spare on the back. This combined, high-point-weight really does change the handling more than simple over-all weight.
To me this illustrates a hidden value of a sub-tank for its lowest-possible-COG factor. It not only means handling suffers less, but also that I’m sooo much less tippy that if I were toting that fuel elsewhere.
A related aside—
For these reasons, I am not so sure I even want a roof rack any more. I’m convinced the high weight it just too detrimental to COG for my driving and wheeling style and a roof rack will just mean temptation to throw high weight up there. If I do get a roof rack, it will be as low-profile as I can find...and mostly just to facilitate an awning at some point.
This also means a roof-top tent is pretty much out of the question for me unless I know I’m on my way to Alaska or South America where navigating tippy rocks is less likely, and bears are worth sleeping above.
All that to say... To the handling question, it’s really not bad at all in my opinion but COG is super important. Probably more important than some might guess.
I feel pretty sure I would have rolled at Cruise Moab, Steel Bender trail if I had a heavy tent up top. I think Ken Romer and TonyP can vouch for that.The last drop is just that tippy.
There is a huge difference between dynamic weight like water and gas and static weight like a tent. I had about 300lbs of tent, roof rack and awning on my FJ and I would fling it around at dumb speeds (like enough to rip both beads free on my passenger side tires from the cornering force) and it made surprisingly little difference. When I would throw 4 x 5 gallon Jerry cans on the roof rack basket in front of my tent HOLY CRAP! Just driving down the highway felt sketchy as you’d lean into a corner and then all that weight would transfer and it was not a safe feeling. I 110% agree on your assessment of the aux fuel tank. Is it exponentially more expensive than throwing some Jerry cans on your bumper or rack? Yes. Is it worth it? ABSOLUTELY!
mcgaskins
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #92
Time for an update. I finished up the install of the front bumper, winch, snorkel and spacers a few hours before I left for Cruise Moab. I did a tire rotation and got a fresh balance on the tires at Discount before hitting the road, and I have to say the improvement overall with all the changes was noticeable right off the bat.
SPACERS:
Likely the biggest difference in feel was adding the 0.75" Bora spacers which immediately made the truck feel more stable on the road, and the tiny bit of wheel rubbing at full lock on the KDSS is now gone. The spacers combined with the fresh balance made the drive much more enjoyable, and my wife commented on it right away as well. I've generally shied away from spacers in the past, but these from Bora are perfectly machined, use high quality lugs and threads, and are solid and beautiful. I have not experienced any negative repercussions from the spacers after several hundred miles of highway at high speeds and low speed trail use. I wish I would have added them sooner!
SNORKEL:
I went with the TJM Airtech because IMO it's the lowest profile and best looking snorkel that one can (relatively) easily acquire in the US. I know ARB has released a new snorkel for the 3URFE which is great, but I still prefer the aesthetics of the TJM. The install was not nearly as scary as I expected fortunately, and cutting the fender was surprisingly the easiest part. The hardest part was mating up the new intake tube to the airbox which does not appear to be a perfect fit for our US spec trucks. Fortunately, my buddy Greg who is a master of all things mechanical had already done the same snorkel on his 200, so he was able to help figure out how, where and what to trim to get them to line up well. We of course added copious amounts of silicone to all of the fittings, and I have to say I am very pleased with how it turned out.
Snorkels have received a lot of negative attention over the last couple years, and I guess I understand the hate when people put them on for looks only and never wheel. For those of us who wheel however, it's a very valuable addition and cheap insurance to avoid incredibly costly mistakes. The factory location for the air intake is essentially directly above the passenger front wheel which appears to be pretty precarious ESPECIALLY if you've changed your front bumper and/or trimmed the fender liner for larger tires. On Ruby's maiden voyage after putting on the snorkel, another 200 hydrolocked his engine in the same river crossing where we didn't have any trouble, so the ~$500 snorkel theoretically avoided ~$15k in damage (not to mention the hassle of dealing with the repair). My wife immediately stopped making fun of me for adding the snorkel right after that happened
BUMPER/WINCH:
I saved my favorite mod for last. I started this thread and documented the search and install for the bumper here: Rhino 4x4 Front Bumper
I won't rehash everything in that thread, but the highlights are:
- Crash tested and certified; airbag compliant
- OEM looks, especially when color matched
- Retains all safety features, parking sensors and headlight washers
- High quality steel approximately 1/8" wings and 1/4" center
- Excellent winch mounting and easy access
- Amazing clearance while still being a true full width bumper
Granted I was at Cruise Moab where people are more likely to notice mods, but I received dozens and dozens of compliments on the bumper and color match. I wheeled it on some trails where clearance is necessary to avoid scraping, and I'm pleased to say the bumper never touched anything on steep descents, steep ascents, and rock crawling.
The bumper is also very aerodynamic, so it did not create the kind of turbulence I was used to with my ARB on my 14 LC which also helped with gas mileage. On the freeway portions of the trip, we were getting around 15 mpg when averaging 82 mph or 16.5 mpg when going 65 mph, and the bumper did not create any new noises, squeaks, or rattles even when off road on washboard.
I didn't have to use the winch (Comeup Seal Gen2 9.5 RS), but it appears to be very high quality. Access is easy with the Rhino bumper too which is nice, and the winch came with both wired and wireless remote controls (Slee - Winches).
WHAT'S LEFT:
As @tbisaacs mentioned, I've somewhat deviated from the original intention of going with a "light" build, but I feel like everything I've added is quite useful and only added the parts as they've become necessary. The sliders, drawers, fridge, electronics, Maxtrax, etc. are what I'd call standard stuff I'd do on any truck. The rear bumper I added when I had damaged the factory one, and the front one was still in great shape so I wanted to remove it while that was still the case
The full stock bumper is removed, fog lights and all, for the Rhino meaning I can go back to stock or sell the factory bumper which is really nice. I also chose the most slim and stock looking parts to keep the look understated overall, so while this isn't quite the mild build I had envisioned the spirit is still intact.I have very few things to add, so it's mostly down to just dialing things in. Nothing is really necessary, but I'd like to re-aim the headlights and fog lights, dial in one more click on the BP51s, maybe change tires to go slightly taller. I love the 285/70/18 Ridge Grapplers, but a 285/75/18 would fit great now with the extra clearance the front bumper affords. If I can sell the existing tires for a decent price, I will likely change to the 285s, but I would say the truck is basically complete as it sits. This is my third 200, and I will say it is definitely the best I've owned. I/we have been incredibly happy with it, and I can't imagine anything else I'd do to it would make it much if any better for our use.
fireball
SILVER Star
Thanks for sharing!
Snorkel looks pretty good, especially on your and other darker colored trucks. Not sure I can bring myself to add one to my silver truck though
Did you get the spacers here? Wheel Adapters, Wheel Spacers, Hub Rings for your car! | Motorsport Tech
And did you have any issues with them? Slee claims that any thinner spacer is going to have issues with the vehicle studs sticking through the spacer causing fitment issues with the wheels. I am selfishly asking b/c I want to run .75" spacers on my Rock Warriors.
Snorkel looks pretty good, especially on your and other darker colored trucks. Not sure I can bring myself to add one to my silver truck though
Did you get the spacers here? Wheel Adapters, Wheel Spacers, Hub Rings for your car! | Motorsport Tech
And did you have any issues with them? Slee claims that any thinner spacer is going to have issues with the vehicle studs sticking through the spacer causing fitment issues with the wheels. I am selfishly asking b/c I want to run .75" spacers on my Rock Warriors.
mcgaskins
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #94
Thanks for sharing!
Snorkel looks pretty good, especially on your and other darker colored trucks. Not sure I can bring myself to add one to my silver truck though
Did you get the spacers here? Wheel Adapters, Wheel Spacers, Hub Rings for your car! | Motorsport Tech
And did you have any issues with them? Slee claims that any thinner spacer is going to have issues with the vehicle studs sticking through the spacer causing fitment issues with the wheels. I am selfishly asking b/c I want to run .75" spacers on my Rock Warriors.
Thanks! Yes that's the place I ordered it from. It was a little slow, but I also ordered during a Black Friday sale. It's a small made-to-order shop, and I didn't mind the wait. They asked for my VIN and pics of my truck to ensure they'd make the right spacers, and they are a perfect fit. As for the stud length, the 16+ stock wheels have little pockets on the backside of the mounting surface that the studs fit into perfectly. There was no interference at all, otherwise I would not have put them on. Some people would say to cut down the original studs, but I'm not comfortable with that. Fortunately the spacers were as easy as could be to just bolt on and go, but I can't recall if Rock Warriors have the same pockets for the studs.
mrburlingame
SILVER Star
Congrats @mcgaskins. Your rig is incredible and love the attention to detail with your front bumper set up. Thanks for sharing all of your thoughts that went into your overall build decisions. Working on my build and this has been super helpful. Looking forward to meeting you at LCDC.
mcgaskins
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #100
Looking for a tire expert to help with something I find a bit confusing. I have 285/70/18 Ridge Grapplers now and the only thing I’d change about them is a little more sidewall height. Fortunately they are available one size up at 285/75/18, but the specs show they’re actually narrower in the larger size. @gaijin any thoughts as to why this might be?
