I couldn't either, just now. There was a separate thread about that, too. The sound was eerie
Ed
Ed
"best" 2F (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Mace
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Am I wasting time and money trying to build up a 2FE? I really like staying Toyota, and 200-250rwhp would be plenty for me, but if that is not gonna happen on a reasonable budget then what are some reasonable numbers?
Personally (and I did!) I'd build a 2f with F head.
218 at the rear wheels.
I'm currently planning to put a computerised ignition controller and coil packs in - I keep burning out the HEI coils.
Once I've done that I think I might squeeze a few more out of it...
218 at the rear wheels.
I'm currently planning to put a computerised ignition controller and coil packs in - I keep burning out the HEI coils.
Once I've done that I think I might squeeze a few more out of it...
my64fj40 said:Cool thread
Couldn't get the video to work though
Working on it - the guy hosting it has problems - I'll see if I can post it up somewhere else...
alkaline747trio said:
no, you arent wasting time per se, it really depends on your end goal. yes, if you are dead-set on 250 hp, you might as well blow your money on a V8. but remember, even the 80 series trucks with the 1FZ only get 212 hp, and a 40 weighs about 2/3 an 80, so you will be doing nicely at 200 hp. if you have the late model 2F, at least getting 175 hp is easy enough. you just need to know what your ultimate goal is.
i like staying toyota and am building a 2FE for the challenge. but i dont race my 40, and i know the rest of the drivetrain (BRAKES) is not really matched for racing it. so, i accept that i am not going to get 200+ hp out of my block and thats ok.
HTH
by the way, a good machine shop can get you oversized pistons without issue. so can MAF or SOR. largest i have seen is 40 over, others may have seen bigger.
Pin_Head said:
Why would I throw a rod in a well built 2FE?
stumpy said:
I'm not dead set on 250, but over 200 would be nice. So I guess my ultimate goal is to get over 200rwhp and not break the bank getting there, so whenever the money ends, the extras would end.
I don't want to race my truck, but loaded with gear, large tires, etc. 155hp isn't cutting it.
alkaline747trio said:
I'm currently having a 2F+3FE motor built. Balanced, cam, bored throttle body, head work, 9:1 compression, usual stuff. I'm not expecting anything near 200hp because it's still a long-stroke 2F block. HP is a function of RPM and torque, and this motor will never see over 5k RPM. OTOH, I do expect it to be a torque monster.
Well, that usual stuff sounds like what I was planning on doing, but maybe doing a 30 over bore if it isn't cost restrictive. Let me know how your's turns out, and if you can get it dyno'd that will give me an idea of what I might should expect.
Just curious, but would having the valves worked have much bang for the buck?
Just curious, but would having the valves worked have much bang for the buck?
I think boring is boring. They'll take it to whatever you want. And pistons and rings are no more expensive for .030 over than for .010 over. In my case, I went .030 over and it was $18 a hole. Most machine shops will want the pistons in-hand before boring the cylinders.
GL
Ed
GL
Ed
How far over can I go and it still be worth it?
alkaline747trio said:
I was assuming that the point of getting 250 hp was that you would actually use it. There is no secret about how to get more HP: Burn more fuel. To do that in a normally aspirated 2F, that HP is going to come at high RPMs that the engine is not designed to operate at for long. The 2F has some design flaws associated with 1950s engineering that limits its utility as a high performance engine. The oiling is marginal, it is an over square design with a long stroke and high rotating mass and it has only 4 main bearings on a long crank. None of these would be what you would choose to make 200-250 hp out of a displacement of 4.3L. It is a reasonable design for a low RPM tractor motor, which is what it is.
The point is that there are plenty of motors to choose that are designed to make 250 hp right out of the box that would cost about the same and would be more reliable.
Pin_Head said:
Yes I would use it, but oiling mods would be done if necessary. Also, with good balancing, 4 bearings should be enough. You're correct, trying for 200+ on this motor is a whole bunch of effort, and lots of engineering and thinking are required to keep it together. But just assuming that because this motor is pumping out 200+ that it is going to throw a rod is just a lack of faith in Toyota and the builder.
I've come to realize that 250 is pretty far out there for a NA long stroke straight six tractor motor, but 200+ isn't. And with a late model block, 3FE head, and fuel injection make a good start for a pretty stout engine.
You also say that there are other motors designed to make 250+ out of the box that would cost about the same as this build MAY be true for most, but with a solid running 2F for under $200 bucks, and already having the 3FE installed I'm a few steps ahead of the majority. Also, to do a V8 swap you have to also add in the cost of adapters and engine mounts and other custom fab'd items that aren't required for me.
Why not just run the 3FE and maybe put a turbo on it? It is a better design with shorter stroke and lower rotating mass.
I doubt that you will see a big improvement in hp just by putting a 3FE head on a 2F. Boring it out .040 is a spit in the bucket displacement wise. Where is the hp gain going to come from that isn't imaginary?
I doubt that you will see a big improvement in hp just by putting a 3FE head on a 2F. Boring it out .040 is a spit in the bucket displacement wise. Where is the hp gain going to come from that isn't imaginary?
Camshaft, port/polish, balanced crank, higher compression? I will be gaining more torque right where I need it the most, 1500 to 2500rpms, and the larger displacement will help overall hp.
Turbo a 3FE? I wouldn't turbo anything that had the intake and exhaust on the same side, already enough heat there, why add more?
Turbo a 3FE? I wouldn't turbo anything that had the intake and exhaust on the same side, already enough heat there, why add more?
Hijack, kinda....
Why doesn't anyone supercharge a 2F? Seems like it would be simpler and deliver boost at a lower rpm. Keep in mind I have nothing that is boosted in any way, so go easy on me
I know there have been huge improvements in turbo chargers, but the blower would begin to deliver at lower rpm, where the 2F likes to run.
School me, if you please.
Ed
Why doesn't anyone supercharge a 2F? Seems like it would be simpler and deliver boost at a lower rpm. Keep in mind I have nothing that is boosted in any way, so go easy on me
I know there have been huge improvements in turbo chargers, but the blower would begin to deliver at lower rpm, where the 2F likes to run.
School me, if you please.
Ed
Couldn't tell ya, but why don't you make one and sell it for us all!
To run a supercharger would be pretty damn involved. There is plenty of room for a centrifugal, but the drive system would be really hard to figure out. There is not a lot of room in front of the engine, and there are accesories all around the front of the motor. You might be able to remove the smog pump and put one there, but it would be tough.
Be realistic about what you want, youre gonna lay out a bunch of cash to build a super 2f, and when youre still slower than almost everyone else i bet its gonna hurt a little bit.
Be realistic about what you want, youre gonna lay out a bunch of cash to build a super 2f, and when youre still slower than almost everyone else i bet its gonna hurt a little bit.
Out of curiosity, could the crank be ground to accept a say SBC rod? If you really wanted to spend some money, maybe you could grind the crank to a more common OD, go to someplace like JE pistons and get some short, custom sized slugs, and throw it all together. Nitride the crank and get it oiling well and that would be ready to run high enough to get the horsepower numbers decent.
