80 Series carbon footprint - I lose (1 Viewer)

[DSRTRDR]

I am reducing carbon footprint by driving existing cars for a long time - driving old cars a few more years is far more carbon-friendly than the manufacture of a new car

and by accumulating multiple such vehicles, I multiply the positive effect: I can only drive one at any given time, so the others stay off the road, preventing air pollution

come to think of it, I should get another cruiser

 

[TWILLY]

The Land Cruiser will someday be electric too.

 

[musthave]

I like this ^^^ approach, where can I get that sticker?

The sticker is this one. I got mine after installing my synergy drive electric motor. But I’m told they’re available on eBay.

 

[JohnPW]

Where did u get this information?

The Wall Street Journal. I can’t find a direct link, but here’s a link to global sorces of greenhouse emissions:

Global Greenhouse Gas Emissions Data | US EPA

Includes information on global greenhouse gas emissions trends, and by type of gas, by source, and by country.

www.epa.gov

The pie chart halfway down shows transportation as 14% of global emissions. Roughly half of that is ships, trains, commercial trucks, etc. The other half (7%) is from cars and light trucks. You can verify via Google if you look hard enough. The green lobby doesn’t write about facts that don’t fit the narrative that drivers of gasoline SUV’s are destroying the planet.

I’m not a climate skeptic and I’m concerned about climate change. Until the grees embrace nuclear energy we are wasting our time. Germany made a huge increase in carbon footprint by shutting down their nuclear plants after the nuclear leak in Japan...a leak that killed three people. Thousands die from the air pollution of coal fired power plants every year, and only a handful have been harmed from nuclear energy in the deveoped ecomies. But I’m getting on a tangent here.

 

[Heckraiser]

Good points about the carbon impact of batteries and “disposable” new vehicles. I would also point out that cars and light trucks represent @ 7% of annual global CO2 emissions. Cars & light trucks in the USA represent @ 3% of global CO2 emissions. If all Americans stopped driving entirely, 97% of CO2 emissions would continue. All the Land Cruisers in the world are a rounding error in global emissions.

This is a good point too. You should ask her:
1) where do you work?
2) do you travel much?
3) what do you eat, where is it grown/caught/raised and how does it get to your plate?
4) how big is your house?
5) what kind of clothes do you wear and how often do you shop for clothes?
6) do you shop online?
7) what do you set your thermostat to?
8) what kind of consumer goods to you own? How often do you buy stuff (furniture, electronics, gadgets, vacuum cleaners, etc)

Likely all of those things matter more than her car.

There really is no argument that the 80 is the best choice for your carbon footprint. It is basically the least efficient thing on the road. Those saying it's better to keep an old vehicle running than buy a new one are absolutely correct, but from a carbon standpoint, that vehicle would look more like a corolla than a land cruiser But you've got to drive the damn thing, so it should be something that fits your lifestyle.

But what you drive is only a fraction of each person's carbon footprint. I know some people who brag about their EV, but live in a huge house, drag their kids around the world on vacations, buy junk for their house constantly, etc. Their carbon footprint is well above average, but they're so proud of their "automotive activism."

Electric vehicles are just plain good in some respects. They are mechanically simple and even a dorky econobox like the bolt has enough oomph to be real fun to drive. My volt gave me zero trouble at 8 years old, despite being a chevy. Once the charging network is up to snuff, I do think a lot more people will start switching over. I know once the charging network is up to snuff, I will be looking into options to converting my land cruiser (or more likely a 60) to electric. Why? Because I like it. I don't I think I'm saving the world. I know there is major carbon cost to making the batteries, and I have no illusions that. I also pay for renewable sources of electricity at my home (Xcel windsource), but I'm still plugged into the same grid as everyone else and have a good level of skepticism about that program as well.

:edit: No doubt EVs are more economical to run. Charging my volt cost about an extra $10/month on my utility bill and I rarely used gas. Wheras I was spending close to $200/month for filling up my old acura previoiusly. The tesla is closer to $40/month, but I put a lot of miles on it (over 2000 mi per month). Also, if you're self employed and write off your mileage, an EV is the ultimate tax hack.

 

[DSRTRDR]

most importantly: have you already enlarged your carbon footprint by having children ?

because the consequences can be exponential . . .

 

[Rifleman]

most importantly: have you already enlarged your carbon footprint by having children ?

because the consequences can be exponential . . .

Why yes i have, and grand children too. And to make it even worse, I've already started infecting my grand children with the Land Cruiser bug! So i guess that'll get me double secret probation from all the snowflakes.

 

[nukegoat]

I am reducing carbon footprint by driving existing cars for a long time - driving old cars a few more years is far more carbon-friendly than the manufacture of a new car

and by accumulating multiple such vehicles, I multiply the positive effect: I can only drive one at any given time, so the others stay off the road, preventing air pollution

come to think of it, I should get another cruiser

I see this argument a lot but this isn't often true - only 10-15% of the lifetime carbon emissions for the average car are from manufacture and delivery. Less for a cruiser that gets such horrible mileage and lasts so long.

Let's say your 80 requires 1000 gallons of gas per year (12,000 miles). That's 20,000 lbs of co2.
A new honda civic takes (random googling) anywhere from 16,000 to 25,000 of co2 to build, but let's say it gets 36mpg (so 333 gallons of gas - 6,666 lbs of co2 per year).

After 2 years, the cruiser has gone through an additional 40,000 lbs of co2. A new civic would have gone through, at worst, 37,000 lbs. So the breakeven isn't that far off.

I'm not hating, just saying that most people making this claim haven't really looked at the numbers, they just read some op-ed that agreed with their viewpoint and they become guilty of confirmation bias

 

[JohnPW]

I see this argument a lot but this isn't often true - only 10-15% of the lifetime carbon emissions for the average car are from manufacture and delivery. Less for a cruiser that gets such horrible mileage and lasts so long.

Let's say your 80 requires 1000 gallons of gas per year (12,000 miles). That's 20,000 lbs of co2.
A new honda civic takes (random googling) anywhere from 16,000 to 25,000 of co2 to build, but let's say it gets 36mpg (so 333 gallons of gas - 6,666 lbs of co2 per year).

After 2 years, the cruiser has gone through an additional 40,000 lbs of co2. A new civic would have gone through, at worst, 37,000 lbs. So the breakeven isn't that far off.

I'm not hating, just saying that most people making this claim haven't really looked at the numbers, they just read some op-ed that agreed with their viewpoint and they become guilty of confirmation bias

Interesting statistics, I had not heard the 10-15% co2 cost for building a car. I assume a hybrid or electric would be higher, I have read the breakeven on co2 for electrics is @ 80k miles although I’m sure that’s a function of the carbon impact of your local electric grid.

Of course as pointed out previously, almost all life choices impact carbon footprint. I live in a smaller house very close to work, kids’ school and weekend activities. I drive a gas guzzling LC 200 but I only put @6000 miles a year on vehicles. I’ll keep the LC forever. I imagine my carbon footprint is lower than plenty of prius drivers living in huge houses and commuting an hour each way.

 

[DSRTRDR]

you can't deny that I can only ever drive one vehicle at the same time, so I am reducing carbon footprint by keeping the others parked instead of driven

 

[IdahoDoug]

Reminds me of the time I parked my ARB bumper-ed Cruiser near a nice looking Volvo. I complimented the owner and admired it. He mentioned that it's not like my SUV and said something disparaging. Then started talking about how I don't have crush zones (it does actually) so he's safe and I'm not despite all the steel. Quickly tiring of what was supposed to be a pleasant compliment to his car turning into an SUV bashfest, I said "Well I guess if we ever hit and I destroy your Volvo I will get out and thank you for carrying a crush zone around for other drivers like me before I drive away." I turned on my heel and went into the same store he was heading to. He pointedly stayed out of my aisle. It's great being able to turn into a Neanderthal once in a while....

 

[pnwcruiser]

My FZJ80 has zero graphene and lithium (as far as I know), so less mining needed. My FZJ80 also does not contribute to the use of SF6 'Dirty secret' gas boosts climate warming sure it's horrible fuel mileage, but I use less fuel per year in it than my neighbor does in their Volt, I don't put many miles on my FZJ80. If you walk to work or maybe ride a bike (still needed to be transported here on a bunker fuel burning cargo ship) you are doing more than me (I use mass transit). I like my FZJ80, I like my '05 4Runner with V8. If I can find a way to convert to hydrogen power and get a source of hydrogen, I'm all over it.

 

[asutherland]

@musthave I found your solution.

Toyota Land Cruiser News and Reviews | Motor1.com

Get the latest on new Toyota Land Cruiser models including first drives, in-depth reviews, concept car photos, new features, recalls and more.

www.motor1.com

 

[Rifleman]

Gee who are you supposed to believe, above you have a link to a story that Toyota is going to keep making the Land Cruiser, and awhile back Motor Trend magazine ran a story that Toyota was going to stop making the Land cruiser at the end of 2022. Below is a quote from the Motor trend story along with a link to a story by Forbes magazine.

Toyota Is Canceling The Land Cruiser In 2022 And It's About Time. The 2020 Land Cruiser Heritage Edition may be the last we see of Toyota's longest-lasting model ... ... And, as of 2022, the Land Cruiser will be “exiting the market,” according to Jonny Lieberman at MotorTrend.Aug 20, 2019

Toyota Is Canceling The Land Cruiser In 2022 And It's About Time

It’s no secret the current generation Toyota Land Cruiser, which has been in production since 2007 and only received a mild refresh in 2016, is an outdated piece of machinery. At $85,000, it’s arguably overpriced as well.

www.forbes.com

 

[bigredmachine]

sounds like shes just a miserable bitc and is pissed that all your cruisers will way out live her self righteous volt several times over.



and that you have friend on the internet that share your same love for low mpg trucks that can go anywhere, any time, any place

 

[Brentbba]

On a serious note, buying a Prius instead of a land cruiser on net will be better for the environment. Let's not get pedantic. Yes batteries are bad for the environment, yes new cars are carbony to produce, but the numbers don't work in the cruisers favor for the most part. Arguments to the contrary are largely based on heresay and misinformation

This is why we should work to improve the economy of our vehicles through wheel skirts

I own a Landcruiser and a Prius!

 

[kw90surf]

My 80 has a hybrid badge too! No one's questioned it yet...

 

[Qball]

Well this is easy, just don’t invite her anymore. Way less carbon footprint because she doesn’t have to waste energy to go to your house anymore, save Mother Earth!!!

 

[gungriffin]

My thought process in this situation would be: To lose yourself in other's insanity is to yourself become insane.

Sounds like she has a lot on her mind. What is on her mind is probably more to do with herself than you. For most people though, it is easier to focus on the issues we perceive in other people than to work on our own crap...

 

[bwesty]

It's laughable that people believe they are helping the environment with their new eco high mpg cars they lease new every two or three years or buy. A lot of the cars made these days are basically throw aways after 5-6 years commuting. People get a new car and that used one isn't worth a damn to fix up. As mentioned prior, there is something to be said for "recycling" a good quality used vehicle.