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200 Series Ti key shell (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter MrCWineMan
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gaijin
GOLD Star
I don't mean to be "That Guy" but isn't the title of this thread possibly misleading?
What we are talking about is replacing the plastic factory key fob with a 3-D printed plastic key fob that has a thin Titanium "frame" sandwiched in the middle, right? The "key shell" is plastic, not Titanium.
I'm still very interested in this project, but I can see where folks might think they are getting something other than just a different plastic shell with some reinforcement.
Is it just me? (Wouldn't be the first time ...)
HTH
What we are talking about is replacing the plastic factory key fob with a 3-D printed plastic key fob that has a thin Titanium "frame" sandwiched in the middle, right? The "key shell" is plastic, not Titanium.
I'm still very interested in this project, but I can see where folks might think they are getting something other than just a different plastic shell with some reinforcement.
Is it just me? (Wouldn't be the first time ...)
HTH
No, that's a reasonable point. I didn't create the thread, but that's probably about what I would have titled it anyway.
Honestly with all of my key-related products I've had a hard time coming up with a concise and meaningful product title/name that doesn't confuse people. Technically this might be a better title "3D Printed Remote Key Fob Shell with Titanium Reinforcement and Accents". I never use that sort of title though because:
1. It's long. Too long. People forget what they're even reading before they get to the end.
2. I actually think the 3D Printed part of the title is misleading. I use 3D printing methods that are completely different than what most people are familiar with unless you're a 3D printing hobbyist or are a designer/engineer. This is more and more true as home 3D printers flourish. The home stuff is cool, but COMPLETELY different than what I use. Home printers are $1k and under now and utilize an FDM method where a nozzle squirts out molten plastic not unlink how you'd build a cheese castle out of cheez-wiz. I use SLS machines that are around $100k-$500k utilizing a controlled atmosphere heating a bed of powder to just below it's melting point and using a laser to precisely sinter the material to form the part. The quality difference is on par with the price difference. "3D Printing" started out as a neat buzzword, but now I think 3D Printing is actually misleading in a bad way for me because people associate it with the parts made by the neighborhood kid with huge step lines and brittle material. Given that, I try to downplay the "3D Printed" terminology unless it's paired with an explanation so people know what they're getting.
3. The titanium in this part plays a critical role in the function of the item - same goes for the 100 series version. On this 200 series version the titanium serves as the release mechanism for the key, the retainer for the key, the guide for the key, the keyring and finally a design aesthetic. The product wouldn't function without the Ti part, so I don't think it's too misleading to use that as the main descriptor for the product.
Also, if anyone wants a full Ti fob, I'd LOVE to print it up. I wouldn't even increase my margin on the item. I'd just love to have it printed. The beauty of 3D printing today is you can make just about anything out of any material. The cost to 3D print this in 6-4 Ti would probably be around $200-300 through a Chinese vendor. Around double that for a US based printer. That would be for one half the assembly, either front or back. Radio transmission would be very negatively impacted, so it'd be risky. I'd expect it to work if I changed the design to have some large holes, but I don't think more than a couple people might be interested in the product, even if I sold it at cost.
gaijin
GOLD Star
Thanks for the explanation - very helpful. I admit, I was ignorant of the details of your manufacturing process and the use of the term "3-D printed" was unfair - sorry for that. My concern was based on some of the questions in this thread from which one could easily infer that the questioner was under the impression the entire fob was Titanium. This may very well be an unfounded concern, but it is still very helpful to have your explanation.
Still very interested in seeing the final product!
HTH
Markuson
SILVER Star
I WAS under the impression that the FOB shell itself was to be titanium.
So...I'm glad Gaijin brought it up.
So...I'm glad Gaijin brought it up.
No worries on the 3D printed terminology. It should be in the discussion as it's the core of the product. I just want people to know it's not like what they may have seen 3D printed before.
Thanks, I'll make sure to clarify that in the launch thread. I think it'll also be more apparent when I can post pictures/video of a real product.
Whoa. As an engineer nerd, now I wanna take a field trip to CO just to see this setup. I shoulda hand-carried that spare fob out to you. 
We had a MakerBot here for awhile, and it was... disappointing. Got rid of it, we didn't need it as much as we thought and it was a PITA to keep working, if you don' use it almost every day. But what you describe is a whole level above.
Carry on, can't wait to see the product.
We had a MakerBot here for awhile, and it was... disappointing. Got rid of it, we didn't need it as much as we thought and it was a PITA to keep working, if you don' use it almost every day. But what you describe is a whole level above.
Carry on, can't wait to see the product.
Whoa. As an engineer nerd, now I wanna take a field trip to CO just to see this setup. I shoulda hand-carried that spare fob out to you.
We had a MakerBot here for awhile, and it was... disappointing. Got rid of it, we didn't need it as much as we thought and it was a PITA to keep working, if you don' use it almost every day. But what you describe is a whole level above.
Carry on, can't wait to see the product.
Haha, well to clarify, I don't own the printers I use. I've debated buying my own top of the line "consumer-grade" printer ($5-20k), but none have been good enough. Instead I work closely with the big printer services and utilize the higher-quality full blown industrial printers until I can increase volumes enough to justify the $100k entry price for my own at home/my own shop.
This is the printer I've got my eye on. I got a call from HP I need to return, but I suspect it's still not economically justifiable until I increase my volume 5-10 times over. With these industrial printers the cost per print is nearly nothing compared to what you pay third party services, but you've got to fork out the big investment (6 figures and up) to get the machine in your door.
MrCWineMan
SILVER Star
gaijin
GOLD Star
I think @suprarx7nut has done a great job clearing up any possible confusion - anxious to see what the final product looks like.
HTH
HTH
MrCWineMan
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #131
Works for me! Now the real question: can you actually rename a thread?
Markuson
SILVER Star
You can edit thread names. -Just can't delete them.
Here's some pics of prototype #1. Overall it's a great first run, but there are a dozen or so improvements I'll be making for round 2. A few notes:
1. This is all raw white plastic with my fast and cheap print service. Surface finish is poor, the Titanium piece is mocked up with plastic, it's all white, etc... The real thing will be a tighter tolerance print, so ignore the odd mating lines you see.
2. The Titanium is going to be a little thicker. This print gave me a great real-life feel for it and the current design is too thin to instill confidence on a keychain.
3. You may notice the button holes aren't perfectly contoured to the buttons. That's intentional on this first build and will be improved in subsequent runs.
4. Note the size. My design is 5-10% smaller in every dimension.
Round 2 is under the knife in CAD now, I hope to get it printed up again within a week and may have a chance to get a real piece of titanium cut to really prove out the key release, retainer and accent features.
Markuson
SILVER Star
Just a question and possible suggestion: Why not continue to use the key loop for attachment to a keychain, rather than adding another loop? Seems this would reduce the over-all size, and also eliminate concern about loop strength.
Whatchu think?
I can go either way on that. You guys are in the driver's seat here, haha.
There was at least one or two folks on here though, that said their keys had broken so they no longer had a functional key ring on their OEM fob. I suppose that was the driving force behind the key ring on my part. It also allows users to store their physical key elsewhere (as someone mentioned wanting to do).
Removing the key ring portion (or slimming it down) would lower my costs, but not by enough to make a notable difference in final price and wouldn't change the overall height since the key head takes up the same dimension.
Keep in mind though, even WITH the key ring AND the backup key installed, my version is significantly smaller than OEM. My assembly (with key ring) is 7mm shorter than OEM when the OEM has a key in it. The OEM key head is about 7mm, for reference. That means my assembly with the key installed and with the existing key ring is the size of the OEM fob shell if you were to remove the key. That was very wordy, but hopefully that made sense.
What do you folks think? Key ring integrated into my design? Or stick with just the OEM key as the attachment point? I could also make my key ring hole quite small and provide a small little key ring like you see on USB drives for those that want to avoid the OEM key hole.
Markuson
SILVER Star
Others may differ, but I'd rather have the minimum.
The existing loop on the key has been flawless for me, so I'd prefer that.
The existing loop on the key has been flawless for me, so I'd prefer that.
For me, personally, I've had the keyring portion break on one of my fobs by simply dropping my key chain once. Might be an outlier but it happened. I'm for a separate keyring.
Markuson
SILVER Star
