Builds PLC build

[FF LC FREAK]

Thanks!

The auto was good. It's just a different experience wheeling an auto. It's going to take some getting used to. It wasn't that hot yesterday, but I never saw the tranny temp get over 200* even after a long, slow climb up a moderately steep grade.

 

[mr jits]

Looks great Kyle!
How are your engine temps?

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Looks great Kyle!
How are your engine temps?

Engine temps have never exceeded 204*. I'm happy with that so far.

 

[mr jits]

Engine temps have never exceeded 204*. I'm happy with that so far.

I think the highest temp I've seen so far is around 210 going up to Archers from Lyda camp in 95 degree weather. As soon as we stopped climbing, the fan brought the temps back down to 180.

 

[FF LC FREAK]

I think the highest temp I've seen so far is around 210 going up to Archers from Lyda camp in 95 degree weather. As soon as we stopped climbing, the fan brought the temps back down to 180.

I think I have a 190* thermostat. Mine usually runs between 195 and 199. It actually runs a couple of degrees cooler now that I've fixed the brakes. I had to shorten the push rod between the master and booster. I haven't touched the brakes in about 4 years when I changed out my master cylinder. I have no idea why now I needed to shorten that push rod. The only thing I can think of is that there is now more heat under the hood, thereby expanding the brake fluid enough to start engaging the booster. It must have been right on the cusp of engaging before. On the bright side, it drives better when the front brakes aren't dragging.

I did recently finish up 99% of my wiring. Also, I got my air compressor re-installed, so I can engage my lockers again. The only wiring I still need to take care of is the TCC lock up switch. I've just been running with it open (wires tucked under the dash), and it seems the torque converter locks up just fine. However, I do want to build a bracket and install the brake/tcc switch that I have to see if it makes a difference.

Now for a couple of questions maybe you guys can help me with.

#1 The rear drive shaft binds at full droop. I figure I have a few options. Probably easiest is to install some limit straps on the axle to keep it from binding. I don't think I can extend the wheel base enough without doing some sort of comp cut to keep the drive shaft from binding. Maybe another drive shaft? I've heard mini truck driveshafts have higher operating angles. Anything else I'm missing?

Here's a picture of full droop sitting on a lift.

If I clearanced all the metal off the yoke, it might spin. Obviously, I'm not going to do that.

#2 My stance is ass low/nose high. I'd like to actually go lower since I have 35s, so I think I'll remove one leaf from the front spring pack. Anyone see any issues with that? I'm about 1.5" higher in the front than the rear. I'm guessing/hoping it will be pretty close to level by removing one of the leaves. Anyone with experience removing leaves from stock 40 series spring packs on SOA? My current shackles are 3" eye to eye up front and 3.5" eye to eye in the rear. I did consider putting a longer shackle out back, but like I said, I would like to go lower.

 

[Diesel Cruiserman]

Double cardan on the top at tcase and you look to have to much angle at the rear diff, should be around 1 to 2 degrees..

 

[mr jits]

I think I have a 190* thermostat. Mine usually runs between 195 and 199. It actually runs a couple of degrees cooler now that I've fixed the brakes. I had to shorten the push rod between the master and booster. I haven't touched the brakes in about 4 years when I changed out my master cylinder. I have no idea why now I needed to shorten that push rod. The only thing I can think of is that there is now more heat under the hood, thereby expanding the brake fluid enough to start engaging the booster. It must have been right on the cusp of engaging before. On the bright side, it drives better when the front brakes aren't dragging.

I did recently finish up 99% of my wiring. Also, I got my air compressor re-installed, so I can engage my lockers again. The only wiring I still need to take care of is the TCC lock up switch. I've just been running with it open (wires tucked under the dash), and it seems the torque converter locks up just fine. However, I do want to build a bracket and install the brake/tcc switch that I have to see if it makes a difference.

Now for a couple of questions maybe you guys can help me with.

#1 The rear drive shaft binds at full droop. I figure I have a few options. Probably easiest is to install some limit straps on the axle to keep it from binding. I don't think I can extend the wheel base enough without doing some sort of comp cut to keep the drive shaft from binding. Maybe another drive shaft? I've heard mini truck driveshafts have higher operating angles. Anything else I'm missing?

Here's a picture of full droop sitting on a lift.

If I clearanced all the metal off the yoke, it might spin. Obviously, I'm not going to do that.

#2 My stance is ass low/nose high. I'd like to actually go lower since I have 35s, so I think I'll remove one leaf from the front spring pack. Anyone see any issues with that? I'm about 1.5" higher in the front than the rear. I'm guessing/hoping it will be pretty close to level by removing one of the leaves. Anyone with experience removing leaves from stock 40 series spring packs on SOA? My current shackles are 3" eye to eye up front and 3.5" eye to eye in the rear. I did consider putting a longer shackle out back, but like I said, I would like to go lower.

You don't have power running to the TCC switch? For street driving, you'll absolutely want power in that circuit as the torque converter lock up functions opposite a normal circuit. When the brake pedal is pressed, the pcm should see 0 volts, and 12 volts when the pedal is released. It's very easily wired with a relay: Jaguar Specialties
I removed the third leaf from the top in my spring packs. Dropped about an inch in height.

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Double cardan on the top at tcase and you look to have to much angle at the rear diff, should be around 1 to 2 degrees..

With a single cardan drive shaft, your flanges should be parallel. That's what I'm at right now. My drive train is angled down about 3* and my rear differential is pointed up about 3*. Parallel. Essentially, this / / for the flanges as seen in the picture above.

Beyond this, I'm only going by what I've read online. I have no practical experience with dc driveshafts. But according to multiple sources online, such as Tom Woods' website - Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts - Driveline 101 , double cardan drive shafts do not have as great an operating angle as single cardan driveshafts. The following is a quote from the link I just posted.

"Many people mistakenly believe that a double cardan or C.V. type drive shaft will allow for greater operating angles than a conventional 2 joint or single cardan drive shaft. This is not true. Some types of C.V.'s will actually incur a binding interference at less of an angle than a standard two joint drive line, again depending on the individual components used. Additionally the C.V. itself is longer than more conventional components and will create a greater operating angle on the driveline, especially on very short shafts."

Again, I have no practical experience in this, so I'm only going by what I've read online. If you have practical experience with this, I'm all for learning something new. Seriously, please educate me. I'm not trying to be a smart ass.

You don't have power running to the TCC switch? For street driving, you'll absolutely want power in that circuit as the torque converter lock up functions opposite a normal circuit. When the brake pedal is pressed, the pcm should see 0 volts, and 12 volts when the pedal is released. It's very easily wired with a relay: Jaguar Specialties
I removed the third leaf from the top in my spring packs. Dropped about an inch in height.

Yes, exactly. I'm driving around with it unhooked. Essentially, the computer sees that the brakes are being applied all the time. If you supply 12 volts to that wire, it tells the computer that the brakes are NOT applied and should keep the torque converter LOCKED. That is why I don't have it hooked it up currently. I tried running it with a simple switch (SPST) at first that I would turn on when driving on the highway. I noticed NO difference in the way it locked up the torque converter. As soon as I apply the brakes and start slowing down, the torque converter releases. I use Torque Pro on my phone to monitor tranny functions, and I can see when the torque converter locks and unlocks. When I had the manual switch, I noticed no difference in the way the PCM/tranny reacted.

This is what my phone shows at idle (I just did a quick start up to take the screen shot):

When the TCC drops to 0, or close to 0, the torque converter is locked. When it is over ~30-50 RPMs (according to those that know far more than me), that means the torque converter is unlocked. Obviously, when it is at idle, it should roughly match the idle RPMs.
However, with that said, I have this switch -

Autozone part #DR497. The guys that reworked my harness and flashed the PCM recommended it. I just need to make a bracket to attach it to the brake pedal. You can run your brake lights off one side (left side in the picture above, to be exact), and the other side controls the TCC. When the button is depressed (i.e. pedal pressed), it opens one circuit (TCC) and closes the other (supplies 12 volts to the brake light circuit) I've just been too lazy/busy to make a bracket to hook it up.

 

[mr jits]

I think it took maybe ten minutes to wire mine with a relay. No custom modification other than a splice was necessary

 

[Diesel Cruiserman]

Pictures are hard to measure, you say you are around 3 degrees at operating angle.. from the picture it looks like they are out of phase? No expert just watching and weighing in to help.

 

[White Stripe]

So are u using fj40 ujoints right now or are they from something else?

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Sorry, I've been out of town for a few days.

Pictures are hard to measure, you say you are around 3 degrees at operating angle.. from the picture it looks like they are out of phase? No expert just watching and weighing in to help.

Good video! I've seen it before, but it was a long time ago (years). It's a good reminder. I made sure when I welded in my rear spring perches to get the pinion and t/c flange parallel when at ride height. I also verified tonight it was in phase. I think the problem is the angle the picture was taken. However, I did remove the yoke and u-joint to clearance them a slight bit about 2 weeks ago before realizing I couldn't clearance enough to make a difference. Since then, I've had a slight vibration above 50 mph that I didn't have before. I just assumed it was from the amount I clearanced throwing off the driveshaft balance. It just struck me tonight after reading your post that I might have put the yoke on 180* off from where it was balanced. I'll have to check that. Sometimes I amaze myself at my stupidity. I marked the driveshaft before I took it apart. Then I painted it while it was apart. It's hard to see marks when you paint over them. I put it back together and didn't really think about it again until tonight.

So are u using fj40 ujoints right now or are they from something else?

Yes, right now I just have the stock FJ40 u-joints/yokes. I have heard that the mini truck driveshaft yokes offer a better range in operating angles. Anyone know for sure before I lay out some money?


I took Mr Jits' advice and threw a relay into the brake circuit. It was way easier than fabbing a bracket to mount the one I had to the brake pedal. Honestly, I can't tell much of a difference in how it drives and shifts. It may release the torque converter a bit faster when hitting the brakes, but otherwise I can't tell much difference. Regardless, I'm glad the system see's the correct electrical input now.

I also pulled a leaf from the front spring packs yesterday. The good news is that it sits almost perfectly level now. Not the best pic, but you get the idea. And everyone loves pics.

The bad news is that my 2" drop pitman arm slightly rubs the front spring pack before I hit the bump stop. The 2" drop was perfect with a 4" lift. But with an SOA and high steer arms, it is too much. The relay rod actually sits slightly lower than the tie rod now. I'm going to try a flat pitman arm. I took some measurements because I was worried I wouldn't have enough clearance the way my Scout box is mounted. It looks like I'll still have about 1/2" between the castle nut and frame with a flat pitman arm. As usual, one thing leads to another.

I still need to make the skid plate and re-do the anti-wrap bar. I also have to swap the military wrap on the rear springs. Finally, a little bit of body work to avoid having the rear tires do it for me, and I'll be able to wheel this again. I'm tempted to add an inch to the wheelbase because I have the holes in the spring perches to move the axle back 1". Since I have to do body work anyway (I was hoping I wouldn't have to when I set everything up), an inch might help my driveshaft angles a bit. I'm also going to have to order some front shocks and re-do all my bump stops. Anyone have a favorite bump stop they want to recommend? Considering how long my list of things to complete was 3 months ago, I'm happy with this small list.

I've been driving it around town, but it's killing me not being able to take it off road. My original goal was to have it wheelable by July 1st. Obviously that didn't happen. My next goal is to have it done for Cruisin' The Woods at the end of September.

 

[mr jits]

Sorry, I've been out of town for a few days.




Good video! I've seen it before, but it was a long time ago (years). It's a good reminder. I made sure when I welded in my rear spring perches to get the pinion and t/c flange parallel when at ride height. I also verified tonight it was in phase. I think the problem is the angle the picture was taken. However, I did remove the yoke and u-joint to clearance them a slight bit about 2 weeks ago before realizing I couldn't clearance enough to make a difference. Since then, I've had a slight vibration above 50 mph that I didn't have before. I just assumed it was from the amount I clearanced throwing off the driveshaft balance. It just struck me tonight after reading your post that I might have put the yoke on 180* off from where it was balanced. I'll have to check that. Sometimes I amaze myself at my stupidity. I marked the driveshaft before I took it apart. Then I painted it while it was apart. It's hard to see marks when you paint over them. I put it back together and didn't really think about it again until tonight.



Yes, right now I just have the stock FJ40 u-joints/yokes. I have heard that the mini truck driveshaft yokes offer a better range in operating angles. Anyone know for sure before I lay out some money?


I took Mr Jits' advice and threw a relay into the brake circuit. It was way easier than fabbing a bracket to mount the one I had to the brake pedal. Honestly, I can't tell much of a difference in how it drives and shifts. It may release the torque converter a bit faster when hitting the brakes, but otherwise I can't tell much difference. Regardless, I'm glad the system see's the correct electrical input now.

I also pulled a leaf from the front spring packs yesterday. The good news is that it sits almost perfectly level now. Not the best pic, but you get the idea. And everyone loves pics.

The bad news is that my 2" drop pitman arm slightly rubs the front spring pack before I hit the bump stop. The 2" drop was perfect with a 4" lift. But with an SOA and high steer arms, it is too much. The relay rod actually sits slightly lower than the tie rod now. I'm going to try a flat pitman arm. I took some measurements because I was worried I wouldn't have enough clearance the way my Scout box is mounted. It looks like I'll still have about 1/2" between the castle nut and frame with a flat pitman arm. As usual, one thing leads to another.

I still need to make the skid plate and re-do the anti-wrap bar. I also have to swap the military wrap on the rear springs. Finally, a little bit of body work to avoid having the rear tires do it for me, and I'll be able to wheel this again. I'm tempted to add an inch to the wheelbase because I have the holes in the spring perches to move the axle back 1". Since I have to do body work anyway (I was hoping I wouldn't have to when I set everything up), an inch might help my driveshaft angles a bit. I'm also going to have to order some front shocks and re-do all my bump stops. Anyone have a favorite bump stop they want to recommend? Considering how long my list of things to complete was 3 months ago, I'm happy with this small list.

I've been driving it around town, but it's killing me not being able to take it off road. My original goal was to have it wheelable by July 1st. Obviously that didn't happen. My next goal is to have it done for Cruisin' The Woods at the end of September.

I noted the same as you in regards to transmission lockup. I put the relay in only to clear the CEL, it didn't have any noticeable effect on the way the truck drove (from what I could tell).

 

[White Stripe]

Sorry, I've been out of town for a few days.




Good video! I've seen it before, but it was a long time ago (years). It's a good reminder. I made sure when I welded in my rear spring perches to get the pinion and t/c flange parallel when at ride height. I also verified tonight it was in phase. I think the problem is the angle the picture was taken. However, I did remove the yoke and u-joint to clearance them a slight bit about 2 weeks ago before realizing I couldn't clearance enough to make a difference. Since then, I've had a slight vibration above 50 mph that I didn't have before. I just assumed it was from the amount I clearanced throwing off the driveshaft balance. It just struck me tonight after reading your post that I might have put the yoke on 180* off from where it was balanced. I'll have to check that. Sometimes I amaze myself at my stupidity. I marked the driveshaft before I took it apart. Then I painted it while it was apart. It's hard to see marks when you paint over them. I put it back together and didn't really think about it again until tonight.



Yes, right now I just have the stock FJ40 u-joints/yokes. I have heard that the mini truck driveshaft yokes offer a better range in operating angles. Anyone know for sure before I lay out some money?


I took Mr Jits' advice and threw a relay into the brake circuit. It was way easier than fabbing a bracket to mount the one I had to the brake pedal. Honestly, I can't tell much of a difference in how it drives and shifts. It may release the torque converter a bit faster when hitting the brakes, but otherwise I can't tell much difference. Regardless, I'm glad the system see's the correct electrical input now.

I also pulled a leaf from the front spring packs yesterday. The good news is that it sits almost perfectly level now. Not the best pic, but you get the idea. And everyone loves pics.

The bad news is that my 2" drop pitman arm slightly rubs the front spring pack before I hit the bump stop. The 2" drop was perfect with a 4" lift. But with an SOA and high steer arms, it is too much. The relay rod actually sits slightly lower than the tie rod now. I'm going to try a flat pitman arm. I took some measurements because I was worried I wouldn't have enough clearance the way my Scout box is mounted. It looks like I'll still have about 1/2" between the castle nut and frame with a flat pitman arm. As usual, one thing leads to another.

I still need to make the skid plate and re-do the anti-wrap bar. I also have to swap the military wrap on the rear springs. Finally, a little bit of body work to avoid having the rear tires do it for me, and I'll be able to wheel this again. I'm tempted to add an inch to the wheelbase because I have the holes in the spring perches to move the axle back 1". Since I have to do body work anyway (I was hoping I wouldn't have to when I set everything up), an inch might help my driveshaft angles a bit. I'm also going to have to order some front shocks and re-do all my bump stops. Anyone have a favorite bump stop they want to recommend? Considering how long my list of things to complete was 3 months ago, I'm happy with this small list.

I've been driving it around town, but it's killing me not being able to take it off road. My original goal was to have it wheelable by July 1st. Obviously that didn't happen. My next goal is to have it done for Cruisin' The Woods at the end of September.

I use a shortened gx470 driveshaft, the ujoints flex to 45 degrees. I think cruiser ujoints only flex to 30 at most. I think 96 and up tacoma and 4runners also use the same high angle ujoints.

 

[FF LC FREAK]

I use a shortened gx470 driveshaft, the ujoints flex to 45 degrees. I think cruiser ujoints only flex to 30 at most. I think 96 and up tacoma and 4runners also use the same high angle ujoints.

Sweet! Thanks! I'll look into this.

 

[74fj40]

Much like white stripe, I’m also using a gx slip yoke, but matched with an fj60 double Cardon shaft

 

[Mace]

This brings me to my first question. When I flipped my rear springs, I didn't re-drill and flip the second leaf (military wrap). I understand what it is for. However, most modern springs, let alone aftermarket springs, don't have a military wrap at all. How important is this? Am I really playing with fire by not flipping the military wrap to the fixed end, or is it more "just a good idea"?

As been said, just do the spring flip. It's VERY important on stock FJ40 springs. I'll try to dig up the pic of one of my rear springs that gave up while backing out of a hole..

I also burned in the antiwrap bar. I might redo it though. After reading through the link S4 posted, the bar has more of an upward angle than I'd like. I did lower the shackle mount from the previous post, but it is still not coming off the bottom of the cross member. I think I might need to drop it to the bottom to get the link horizontal. Driving it around, I can definitely feel that it tightened up the rear suspension.

Sounds like you found out why a flat angle on the traction bar is important. When you throw an anti wrap bar into your leaf sprung vehicle it transfers energy differently than without. A arms angled up tend to lift the rear end of the truck, and can make you hop like mad on obstacles (huge antisquat numbers).

#1 The rear drive shaft binds at full droop. I figure I have a few options. Probably easiest is to install some limit straps on the axle to keep it from binding. I don't think I can extend the wheel base enough without doing some sort of comp cut to keep the drive shaft from binding. Maybe another drive shaft? I've heard mini truck driveshafts have higher operating angles. Anything else I'm missing?

Here's a picture of full droop sitting on a lift.

If I clearanced all the metal off the yoke, it might spin. Obviously, I'm not going to do that.

#2 My stance is ass low/nose high. I'd like to actually go lower since I have 35s, so I think I'll remove one leaf from the front spring pack. Anyone see any issues with that? I'm about 1.5" higher in the front than the rear. I'm guessing/hoping it will be pretty close to level by removing one of the leaves. Anyone with experience removing leaves from stock 40 series spring packs on SOA? My current shackles are 3" eye to eye up front and 3.5" eye to eye in the rear. I did consider putting a longer shackle out back, but like I said, I would like to go lower.

You already solved the front end issue (although sometimes it has been necessary to put a bump stop on the frame near the pittman arm to stop the leaf spring from binding on the pittman end of the drag link). Just an idea.

On the Driveshaft.
If you put a DC joint on the rear drivesahft you should angle the pinion up towards the tcase. That will provide plenty of articulation without binding. Also, one of hte reasons you are noticing bind is because you flipped the springs. The pinion can actually rotate down during articulation because the short section of leaf spring is located behind the axle instead of in front of it.
Decker's did this drawing a while ago and it sums it up fairly nicely..

 

[FF LC FREAK]

Small update.

After my last post, I was able to flip the yoke on my rear driveshaft 180*. No more vibration. I should have thought of that sooner, but oh well. It was a small win. I did pick up a GX470 driveshaft recently. I still need to get it cut to the right length and balanced. The yokes have way more of an operating angle than the stock fj40 yokes. Using my calibrated eye, it looks like it will work perfectly.

I've put about 350 miles on this over the last month or so - unfortunately all on pavement. I've gotta get to the mall in something, right? Anyway, I kept getting a P0154 trouble code. It's an O2 sensor code for no activity on bank 2 sensor 1. I tried swapping O2 sensors left to right and swapping in new O2 sensors. The code would still come back after about 5 or so miles of driving. I tested both sides (driver and passenger) with my multimeter and got similar results. Being stumped, I contacted the guy that rebuilt my harness and flashed the PCM to ask if he had any ideas. He told me to bring it in and he'd get it figured out. I finally had time yesterday to swing by. He started probing wires and quickly figured out what it was. He had accidently pinned the wires into the wrong holes at the connector for the PCM. He swapped the Bank 2 front and rear O2 sensor wires at the connector and now everything works as it should. No more codes. I don't have rear O2 sensors, but the wires are still there. He owned up to the mistake and was very apologetic. As far as I'm concerned, mistakes happen. I guess the bottom line is, it pays to do business locally when possible. It would have taken me a long time to figure that one out on my own.

My house projects are just about complete, so I can start focusing on this project again. I have the aforementioned driveshaft to install. I have new front shocks, a new pitman arm, some DOM for the anti-wrap bar, and steel for a skid plate all sitting in my garage waiting for me.

 

[FF LC FREAK]

I finally got the military wrap flipped on my rear springs. Afterwards, I drove up a loading ramp to see what kind of flex I could get. It's definitely better than the 4" lift I used to have! The rear tire rubs pretty good, so I do want to get that taken care of.

Over the Labor Day weekend, my wife and I took our dogs camping. I drove probably a hundred miles on logging/forest service roads. Everything worked great. No complaints. I've also been daily driving it for the past couple of weeks just to work out all the kinks. So far, there really haven't been any kinks to work out. It just plain works.

 

[FF LC FREAK]

So, I've been busting my butt trying to get everything ready for Cruisin the Woods. I made a new tranny cross member to make space for a skid plate. It's okay, I didn't like the original design anyway. This was version 2.1

However, I didn't like that I gave up ground clearance. I used .25"x1" flat bar to support the cradle. I made it in two pieces so I wouldn't have to drop the exhaust to get it in and out. After installing it and looking at how far down it came, I chopped off the bottom and just put a flat piece across for support. It saved me an inch. And for some of us, even one inch matters. Version 2.2 will work for now. It's nice and solid.

Oh, I also made a heat shield for the exhaust. Yes, that's my fuel pump and transmission shift linkage right above the exhaust.


Next up was a skid plate. It's all .25" flat bar. I had planned on having one solid piece cut for the bottom. The local metal yard usually needs a day or two for custom cuts. I called in last Wednesday and gave them my dimensions. I went by Friday to pick it up and they didn't have it. I needed to make it this weekend to have everything ready in time for CTW, so I told them to cancel the order. In their defense, they are usually pretty good. So I bought some .25"x6" flat bar (widest they had) and welded it together for the bottom. It turned out ok, but I would have rather had the solid piece for the bottom. I tucked it up as close to the exhaust and tranny cross member as I could.

You might be able to slide a piece of paper under there...

However, I'm not thrilled with my ground clearance. When I installed the engine, I chose not to chop up the body. This means that the transfer case sits pretty low. As of right now, my transfer case is just about touching the body (~1/8" or so). I have 17 inches of ground clearance to the skid plate. That kind of sucks for 35" tires. Down the road, I may put on a body lift so I can raise the transfer case a bit. It wouldn't be hard to modify the skid plate. But for now, it'll have to work.

Finally this weekend, I started in again on the anti-wrap bar. I cut off the old brackets because I just couldn't get them to work like I wanted them to. I am going with the advice given on here earlier when I asked about this. I moved the brackets in towards the center and made the top bar perfectly level. I hope to have it done by Wednesday. It may even have paint on it by CTW. My photography skills are lacking (as evidenced by my previous photos), but take my word for it, that bar is horizontal. Or at least it will be when I have bushings installed. I spent quality time with my bubble level getting everything tacked in just right.

4 days until CTW...