FJ40 Mods to Help Flat Towing?

[1973Guppie]

hmmmmm, good point coolerman, and I was wondering what the difference would be that the fj40 was not running and does not have vacuum booster power.

I researched the ready brake on a couple chat boards, nothing but good comments, so I may try it.

Noah

 

[Poser]

Poser, can I borrow your pink flamingos?

Careful what you wish for Noah.....

 

[teamextreme]

Make sure that the towbar slopes downhill from the Cruiser to the hitchball, so that when braking, the cruiser tries to climb up on the towtruck.

Excellent advise on everything Jim, but on this one be careful. If it's going to be "downhill" make sure it is only slightly so. Mine was about 8" lower at the truck hitch and I ended up rear-ending myself during a panic stop. Not fun. The towbar catapulted the Cruiser into my tailgate, front tires off the ground. I would recommend pretty close to flat, maybe just slighty downhill.

As far as loading is concerned you mentioned getting more weight on the "tongue". I think you're confusing trailer towing with flat towing. There is no tongue weight when you flat tow, so weight distribution is not an issue. Total weight, sure, get as much into the vehicle with brakes as you can, but I don't think distribution will matter that much.

I've flat towed for thousands of miles and most of Jim's suggestions pretty well cover it. I also disconnect the rear shaft unless it's a short haul across town or something. Had a t-case lock up and catch fire on the highway once when I didn't pull the shaft. I also have my rig wired for towing which makes things really nice. I have a 4-wire flat plug on the front grille and a switch inside that converts the Cruiser tail lights to towing lights.

One of the best pieces of advice for flat towing would be to use the right tow rig. You've already got that covered if you're using a Tundra. I would highly recommend only using a full size to tow with. Anything else is too light and too dangerous. I know from experience. I towed with my Dakota for years probably should never have done it. I had 3 different "incidents" that wouldn't have happened with a full size. I now have a 1500 Ram and the difference is unbelievable. Far more control and stopping ability.

A cool trick I'm planning on copying from a buddy with a CJ is to mount a pinion flange above the rear axle that rides on a bearing. This way you have a nice secure way to mount the shaft and you can also hop out at camp, throw it into 4wd and you can drive without any issues with the rear shaft. Makes it nice if it's late, dark, or whatever and you don't want to mess with re-connecting the shaft, but you have to get your rig uncoupled. Securing the shaft can also be an issue. I lost half of a brand new shaft once when the wire I secured it with cut through because I looped it through the bolt holes. Now I always loop it through the u-joint where there are no sharp edges.

 

[1973Guppie]

thanks for the comments, they help.

another question for everyone, what causes the tow vehicle to "sway" when flat towing? Is this a function of the towed vehicle not having some type of braking system or is it because the towed vehicle is getting pushed around by wind and/or other large vehicles (semi's) coming by on either side? I ask this because I am considering purchasing the unit I posted up on from ebay above, it is a supplemental brake system that seems like it would help greatly when braking in an emergency situation or when I get "sway" during high winds, etc. From the research I have read, it seems that having the towed vehicle equipped with supplemental brakes it would make quite a difference. Anyone with more experience than me, I appreciate your comments.

got my tow lights today, so I am legal now, , plan to take the "train" out on the freeway tomm and see how it rides. Will post up with some feedback and pics. Hope to get it up to about 60mph to see how things feel. Then I will decide on whether to get the supplemental braking system.


Noah

 

[D'Animal]

Do you have this rig lifted at all?

Is it a stock suspension?

If you have a lift on it and have not done a Cut and Turn it will not flat tow. (Period).

Anybody who wants to prove me wrong? I have a 1976 FJ40 with a 3.5" SOR lift on it and an AGR Rock Ram assist power steering. I have a StowMaster Tow Bar and it will not tow.

Come on down and show me what I'm doing wrong. I have done everything in this thread plus a whole lot more.


Dan

 

[1973Guppie]

Yes it is lifted, yes it has SOA with a cut and turn, so far tracks and tows fine, just trying to do this safely up front and ask alot of questions. sorry to hear you are having issues, hope that you are able to work them out get it towing right, let me know if I can help at all.

Noah

 

[bsevans]

In most states any vehicle being towed that weighs more than 3000 pounds requires the use of an aux trailer brake system. See this site for state by state laws governing the towing of a vehicle.
State Laws

 

[D'Animal]

Yes it is lifted, yes it has SOA with a cut and turn, so far tracks and tows fine, just trying to do this safely up front and ask alot of questions. sorry to hear you are having issues, hope that you are able to work them out get it towing right, let me know if I can help at all.

Noah

I just need to do a C&T.

 

[pontiota]

I just thought I'd put in my two cents

I flat tow mine everywhere behind my motor home and Chevy pickup, the cruiser probably has as more tow miles than driving miles, and without any problems going even going 70 to 75 across Nevada to Moab, I have done a couple of 600 mile trips flat towing.

I never remove the drivelines (not that there is anything wrong with pulling them) the cruiser tranfercase gets well lubed due to the drive gear being submerged in oil. I do put the tcase in neutral and transmission in neutral also. My thinking here is just incase the t-case bumped into gear. I do check it at every stop.

I do have a lot of positive caster built into the front end when ths spring over was done so it tracks very well. I think this is where people run into problems.

I would recommend a breaking system. I do not have one myself and the Motorhome has no problem with it but when I use the pickup I often bite my nails when people start getting to close. I plan on getting one myself one of these days.

 

[1973Guppie]

thanks for the input, will look into the braking system and post up on how it works out.....

 

[Ratt]

Exactly. On a stock Cruiser, to put the t-case in neutral, the shifter is put into 4WD, then slipped into the neutral gate between Hi & Low.

This has two undesirable effects.
First, it locks the frt & rear driveshafts together. Now , even though the shifter seems to be in neutral, both frt & rear driveshafts and all the front axle guts & birfields are spinning at 70 MPH. That could be a bad thing if any of those pieces have been modified or are worn.

Second, the hi & low output gears are both uncoupled from the spinning output shaft. At 70 MPH, a Cruiser might have a driveshaft speed of 3000RPM. driving normally, the high speed gear is locked to the shaft, and the low speed gear is spinning on the shaft at approximately 1/2 speed. All the gears in the t-case are spinning, throwing oil everywhere. In neutral, instead of a maximum speed differential of 1500RPM on the low gear, both gears are being held still on a shaft that is spinning at 3000RPM!
And there is no oil splash lubrication if the gears aren't turning.

This is not nearly as big a concern if a hybrid t-case is built using the roller bearing gears & output shaft from an FJ62 T-case, installed into a 86-87 FJ60 t-case.

The simple solution is to remove 4 nuts & bolts from the rear differential flange, then strap the d-shaft up against the frame rail. that means no excessive speed on the plain bearings in the t-case, and no spinning of frt driveshaft & axle.

Um, if the main tranny is in neutral, and the TC is in neutral, I would think the only thing spinning would be the output shaft on the main tranny? Isn't the layshaft the hookup to the TC?

 

[D'Animal]

Um, if the main tranny is in neutral, and the TC is in neutral, I would think the only thing spinning would be the output shaft on the main tranny? Isn't the layshaft the hookup to the TC?

Which transmisison transfer case combo are you talking about? An FJ40/FJ60 or a differnt combination?

On the FJ40/FJ60 if everything is in neutral. The rear pinion will be truning the rear drive shaft. The rear driveshaft will turn the rear output shaft to the transfercase. Nothing else inside will be turning since it is neutral.

The front pinion and driveshaft will not turn unless the hubs are locked.

Some other manufaturers Chevey, Ford, Jeep, have a transfer case that dissengauges from the transmission. The transfer case is still in 4x4 and the drive shaft are locked together, they are just not coupled to the transmission.

This is the way I understand it, If I'm wrong I'm sure my MUD brothers will correct me.

 

[Fast Eddy]

In most states any vehicle being towed that weighs more than 3000 pounds requires the use of an aux trailer brake system. See this site for state by state laws governing the towing of a vehicle.
State Laws

That chart is wrong in terms of CA, so I assume it's wrong for at least some other states as well. It is in their interest to make you think you need their braking system.

 

[teamextreme]

That chart is wrong in terms of CA, so I assume it's wrong for at least some other states as well. It is in their interest to make you think you need their braking system.

Also, at least in CO, there's a difference between a trailer and a towed vehicle, where a trailer above 3k does need brakes there's nothing I'm aware that requires it for a towed vehicle.

 

[bsevans]

That chart is wrong in terms of CA, so I assume it's wrong for at least some other states as well. It is in their interest to make you think you need their braking system.

Really, here is another one.
Towing Laws

 

[pontiota]

I also would have to agree with Fast Eddy and team extreme the sites that are listed are both tring to sell a product. I have looked into this and have never found anthing on flat towing a vehicle that says you need "trailer" brakes.
I not saying that you shouldn't have them just that I have never found anywhere that says they are required in CA.
I guess if it was required tow trucks would have to carry a towbuddy with them.
This is right from th CA driver hand book.

Motor Homes Towing Cars or Other Vehicles
Towing small cars behind motor homes has become popular as a
way of providing transportation after the motor home is parked at a
camp site. Towing a car differs from towing travel trailers or fifthwheel
trailers. Very little hitch weight is involved when the car is towed
on all four wheels and only minimal hitch weight is involved when the
car is towed on a dolly.
If you wish to tow a vehicle behind your motor home, you need to
consider whether or not your motor home can handle the extra weight
under all conditions (i.e., climbing steep hills or mountains). Your vehicle
must have sufficient power to climb grades without holding up traffic
and its braking power must be sufficient to stop the combined weight
of the motor home plus the car and/or tow dolly effectively. Motor
home chassis manufacturers provide limits on gross combined weight
(motor home plus car).\

Trailer Brakes
In California, brakes are required on any trailer coach or camp
trailer having a gross weight of 1500 lbs. or more. Usually the braking
capacity on tow vehicles is good, however, it may not be good enough
to safely stop the several hundred to several thousand additional pounds
that your trailer weighs. Most conventional and fifth-wheel trailers have
electric brakes, activated by a controller in the tow vehicle. The
controller automatically coordinates the tow vehicle and trailer braking
so the two systems work together when the brake pedal is applied.
The controller can also be helpful in stabilizing a trailer that sways
because of bad road conditions. Manually applying the trailer brakes
by using the hand lever on the controller will restabilize a trailer that is
likely to sway.
Folding camping trailers and boat trailers are usually fitted with surge
brake systems which operate separately from the tow vehicle’s brakes.
Surge brakes are applied by a mechanism attached to the receiver/
ball connection. As the tow vehicle slows, the forward motion of the
trailer compresses the mechanism which in turn applies the trailer
brakes.

 

[Fast Eddy]

Really, here is another one.
Towing Laws

That's the same crap. Here's the only CA law that's applicable. I looked and there's no such law in here. The CA law only talks about how fast you can slow the whole rig from 20mph, no specific equipment requirements.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vc/vc.htm

 

[1973Guppie]

did some research on the dmv webpage, FYI, CA law does require that any trailer above 1500 pounds must have brakes, breakaway system and safety chains. How much roughly does a 73 cruiser with softop, rollbar, tools, 35 inch tires, rear rack, winch, etc. weigh? I have no idea, probably over that amount though.

What I am confused on though is the lights. I purchased some magnetic tow lights and can't get them to work correctly. I wired them up to the tundra using the 4 plug connector according to the directions but the problems is that everything works correctly BUT when I do the turn signals BOTH the magnetic tow lights flash, like hazard lights would. Are there some magnetic auxilary tow lights that don't isolate LEFT and RIGHT turn signals? To me it looks like the lights are wired in series, meaning the cord to them just runs through one and attaches to the other. Just wondering if it is the lights I bought or I am wiring them wrong? Bought some el cheapo set from ebay. The tundra also has a round connector on the back with marked pins in it for R and L turn signals, brake, etc. I am wondering if I get the right connector and wire the tow lights to this it would work correctly and give me L and R turn signals. Any help appreciated. Gonna make some calls tomm and try to figure it out. Ordered the ready brake today, so once installed I will do a writeup on it.

Noah

 

[1973Guppie]

well a search answered my own question, weighs more than I thought:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=122054&highlight=weight+fj40

 

[Fast Eddy]

FYI, CA law does require that any trailer above 1500 pounds must have brakes, breakaway system and safety chains.

That's a trailer, not a "towed motor vehicle"; different laws apply.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc26458.htm

Paraphrasing, Sub. A, "Brakes are required...", Sub. C, "Sub A does not apply to any of the following combinations of vehicles, if the combination of vehicles meets the stopping distance requirements of Section 26454 ... 3) Towed Motor Vehicles ..."

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc26454.htm

26454: ..." be capable of stopping from an initial speed of 20 miles per hour" ... Type 5, All other combinations of vehicles ... 50'

So if you can stop your junk within 50' at 20mph, you don't need trailer brakes for the towed vehicle.