Bolt on turbo kit (16 Viewers)

[Greyota]

Before you start pulling the turbo off and sending it in for inspection...

Do you have an oil restrictor installed in the path of the oil feed? If not, you need one.

Get a set of the NGK copper plugs I listed above. Those plugs really aren't ideal for the setup.

Check your base timing with a timing light with the proper procedure.

I would start there before anything else, and see how things are running. I'm willing to guess your timing is advanced leading to higher temps, if that's the case, retard the timing back to stock specs. And you may have oil pressure thats slightly too high causing it to get past the turbo seals. Easy fix with a restrictor. Also, how are your crank case vents routed, do you have any photos of the hose routing?

I have the same setup, so I’m very interested in this conversation. What do you consider “too high” for oil pressure?

I have a digital oil pressure gauge and see anywhere from 13psi to 75-ish psi. The only thing that I’m aware of in the oil feed line is the stock sending unit (it gets replaced with a new one as part of the kit).

 

[CJK]

Do you have an oil restrictor installed in the path of the oil feed? If not, you need one.

I mean technically there is a restrictor. Feed hose is most restricted coming out of engine block with a 1/8" NPT.

 

[Wompom]

Before you start pulling the turbo off and sending it in for inspection...

Do you have an oil restrictor installed in the path of the oil feed? If not, you need one.

Get a set of the NGK copper plugs I listed above. Those plugs really aren't ideal for the setup.

Check your base timing with a timing light with the proper procedure.

I would start there before anything else, and see how things are running. I'm willing to guess your timing is advanced leading to higher temps, if that's the case, retard the timing back to stock specs. And you may have oil pressure thats slightly too high causing it to get past the turbo seals. Easy fix with a restrictor. Also, how are your crank case vents routed, do you have any photolys of the hose routing?

I do not have an oil restrictor in place, nor do I think anyone running the WE kit does. Maybe someone else can correct me if i'm missing something here. @scottryana any ideas? I seem to be the only one having the issue.
I'm surprised that the copper plugs would be better. Changing plugs every oil change is less than ideal IMO, but if thats really what it takes.
Whole front end is torn apart for a big service. I'm going to run a compresion/leakdown test and have a better borescope before I go any further.

 

[AussieHJCruza]

I can't find the document at the moment, but the 1FZ Safari kit specified an NGK copper plug, from memory 2 heat ranges cooler than stock.

 

[landtank]

I’ve been recommending NGK BKR7e plugs for years. Copper plugs cool more on the intake stroke which helps with detonation and they are 2 heat ranges cooler.

All the guys running my scaled injector system should be running them and they should last 20,000 miles.

 

[ChargedSHOTaco]

I have the same setup, so I’m very interested in this conversation. What do you consider “too high” for oil pressure?

I have a digital oil pressure gauge and see anywhere from 13psi to 75-ish psi. The only thing that I’m aware of in the oil feed line is the stock sending unit (it gets replaced with a new one as part of the kit).

Would you mind taking the oil pressure at the peace pipe? If it is seeing 75psi there, that might be too much.
Ideal is typically 30-40psi.

 

[Wompom]

Would you mind taking the oil pressure at the peace pipe? If it is seeing 75psi there, that might be too much.
Ideal is typically 30-40psi.

I have an oil pressure gauge on a sandwich plate at the filter and regularly see 70psi under load and 8-15 at idle.

 

[ChargedSHOTaco]

I have an oil pressure gauge on a sandwich plate at the filter and regularly see 70psi under load and 8-15 at idle.

Sandwich plate at the oil filter?
If the pressure at the end of the turbo oil supply hose is also 75psi, then maybe oil being pushed past the bearings.
I'd definitely double check with Borg Warner before deciding to change anything.

 

[Greyota]

Would you mind taking the oil pressure at the peace pipe? If it is seeing 75psi there, that might be too much.
Ideal is typically 30-40psi.

That’s where I’m taking the Oil Pressure readings, at the peace pipe where the OEM oil sender is also connected. It goes straight from the peace pipe to the turbo oil inlet connection.

I just did some driving, and under boost with the OD off, I saw low 90’s psi.

I also have a sandwich plate at the oil filter, but I pull oil temperature from that spot.

 

[ChargedSHOTaco]

That’s where I’m taking the Oil Pressure readings, at the peace pipe where the OEM oil sender is also connected. It goes straight from the peace pipe to the turbo oil inlet connection.

I just did some driving, and under boost with the OD off, I saw low 90’s psi.

I also have a sandwich plate at the oil filter, but I pull oil temperature from that spot.

Good info. I'll dig around to see what Borg Warner recommends for the S300X turbo.

 

[NKP Garage]

For journal bearing turbos like the one on the kit, you want around 15-20 psi at idle ranges for oil pressure to the turbo. And 65-70psi max oil pressure at WOT. If your pressure is higher than that, run a 1.5mm restrictor.

 

[NKP Garage]

The NKG BKR7E-6097 copper plugs are 2 or 2.5 steps colder than stock 1FZFE plugs (if I remember correctly). They are also much more forgiving to detonation than platinum or iridium plugs. Just change them out every oil change.

Once you get your timing, running, and all that good stuff nailed down solid for several thousand miles, you can switch to a proper high end iridium plug at the same heat range. But for the the first few thousand shake down miles keep with the NGK BKR7E 6097 plugs.

 

[NKP Garage]

Correction. I forgot the part number changed. The NGK plugs you want to run are the BKR7E 4644 (not 6097, 6097 was superseded by 4644).

 

[NKP Garage]

Once you get everything running spot on, if you feel the need to switch to a high end spark plug that you don't have to change at every oil change interval, move to the NGK BPR7EIX 4055. That is the Iridium plug with the equivalent heat range to the BKR7 6097/4644. BUT, don't move to those until you're running well on the copper plugs first under all conditions. There used to be a Champion brand iridium plug that I would have recommended over these NGK's, but I think it has been discontinued.

 

[alia176]

@Wompom

I am curious if that "stuff" that's flaking off inside the turbine housing, can you pick them off with a sharp hook tool or something? I'm curious if that's a layer of deposit of some sort and can easily be scraped off. Sounds like the current assumption being moisture somehow got into your exhaust stream and perhaps became a layer of deposit. I'm assuming you have the turbo on the bench right now!!!

 

[Wompom]

@Wompom

I am curious if that "stuff" that's flaking off inside the turbine housing, can you pick them off with a sharp hook tool or something? I'm curious if that's a layer of deposit of some sort and can easily be scraped off. Sounds like the current assumption being moisture somehow got into your exhaust stream and perhaps became a layer of deposit. I'm assuming you have the turbo on the bench right now!!!

correct. It does chip away with a dental pick but it also feels metallic. I’m going to take the exhaust housing off today and look at the interior more.

 

[-Spike-]

correct. It does chip away with a dental pick but it also feels metallic. I’m going to take the exhaust housing off today and look at the interior more.

Magnetic?

 

[DHwreckage]

correct. It does chip away with a dental pick but it also feels metallic. I’m going to take the exhaust housing off today and look at the interior more.

just curious, since you said they were new when installing the turbo, how many miles are on those pistons? Also since you took the exhaust side off I'm guessing you also looked at the intake side? you see any signs of oil coming in through the intake?

As to your original post I would think with a HG failure you would see at least 1 piston that's been steam cleaned where the leak is occurring. You live in Seattle so the condensation could just be b/c of the cooler wetter climate, the exhaust housing cooling quicker causing more condensation to form.....water is a by-product of combustion. But in the off chance its not just your typical condensation you could check the exhaust housing and manifold for cracks.

 

[Ol Yeller]

I’ve got no skin in the 80 turbo game but I’d like to comment the level of Mud support here is what makes this place amazing.

 

[Wompom]

Magnetic?

It is ferrous and stuck to a magnet.

just curious, since you said they were new when installing the turbo, how many miles are on those pistons? Also since you took the exhaust side off I'm guessing you also looked at the intake side? you see any signs of oil coming in through the intake?

As to your original post I would think with a HG failure you would see at least 1 piston that's been steam cleaned where the leak is occurring. You live in Seattle so the condensation could just be b/c of the cooler wetter climate, the exhaust housing cooling quicker causing more condensation to form.....water is a by-product of combustion. But in the off chance its not just your typical condensation you could check the exhaust housing and manifold for cracks.

The pistons are original (prob 200k on them now) but looked great when I did the rebuild so I reused them.
I don't see any signs of HG failure, though am going to do a leakdown test this weekend.
Turbo is fully apart. I found some light chipping on the cold side leading vane edges. Hot side was fine. The sheetmetal housingi that sits against the casting of the exhaust body was pretty crusty and dirty. There was some oil on the intake side but it seems like its been coming from the crank breather that ties in just preturbo. the oil evidence starts at that input to the piping, not before anywhere.
I did find what I can only think is a crack in cylinder two.

waiting to see what a better borescope and leakdown tell me before I pull the head.