"best" 2F

[Poser]

Clifford racing also said they used *lighter* lifters in their rebuilds...

Of 2F engines?

 

[4x4Poet]

Yep, 2F engines. Clifford even sent me pics of ported 2F heads with larger than stock SS valves installed. Also pics of an assembled 2F with polished 2F aluminum valve cover. I must say, it was beautiful.

Clifford also sent me copies of catalog entries for hypereutectic pistons and other parts they can put in F/2Fs. They also sent copies of their machining abilities. One thing Clifford uses that many 2F builders don't is a torque plate for honing the cylinders.

 

[Texican]

Of 2F engines?

I'm just tossing info out here, I do know lots of race teams sleeve the lifter bores and run smaller diameter lifters in race engines
less weight=more HP
However in this case I would think it would be to get a cheaper lifter than the expensive Toyota one.....

 

[calico kid]

I have a rebuilt 75 2f with new flat top pistons with open chamber head pistons have a 75 marked on them i do not know if the head has been shaved will this set up work.

 

[FJ40Jim]

The 75 on the piston is prolly the oversize, .75mm.
It will run, but poorly. CR will be about 6.5:1, unless the head is milled a bunch to get up to 8:1.

You could get an 81-newer head to drop on there. With no milling, that will give 8.43:1.

 

[Mark W]

I've got a '40 here that became mine through series of trades. Right after I took possesion of it, one of the POs proudly told me that it was a "real hotrod" with "flat top pistons to make it faster". What a moron. Sure enough it has flat tops in a '78 (open chamber head. This explains why it is such a gutless wonder compared to a properly set up 2F.

I'm preparing to yank it out in favor of a full on 2F I have languishing in on of my project rigs. From past experience, I know that I'll have more (MUCH MORE) pulling power in 2nd gear than this engine can manage in 1st.

Eventually I'll go through this engine and make it right.


Mark...

 

[stumpy]

anybody try to get a smaller ring gap on a 2F? i was discussing that option with a local 350 builder and he suggested i look into ring options. seems like narrowing the gap might help boost power just a bit. anybody try it? i have seen 16 thou on top and 10 thou on the second ring to get a few more horses out of a 350... any thoughts on such for a 2F block/3FE head combo?

great thread. good place to find lots of 2F info without having to search so hard.

 

[4x4Poet]

anybody try to get a smaller ring gap on a 2F? i was discussing that option with a local 350 builder and he suggested i look into ring options. seems like narrowing the gap might help boost power just a bit. anybody try it? i have seen 16 thou on top and 10 thou on the second ring to get a few more horses out of a 350....

That has me wondering if gapless rings will work on 2F pistons. Childs & Albert and Total Seal make them, but I doubt that they have a 2F app listed. Both companies have ring dimensions that could be used to match their rings to 2F grooves. But that's assuming they have both the right thickness rings for the various 2F pistons and the right bore size rings for 2Fs or what 2Fs are overbored to.

Some C&A ZGS rings on a 2F would be great.

 

[FJ40Jim]

Didn't MAF or somebody list gapless rings for 2F?

If rings are ordered for the standard overbores (.5, 1.0, 1.5mm), when installed, they will measure out at the very top of the acceptable range. To get to minimum ring gap, order 1mm pistons and 1.5mm rings, then file to fit to get to the lower limit of allowed ring gap.

 

[PabloCruise]

Any opinions on whether the 3FE computer will handle a Mark W camshaft w/ headers?

 

[60/40GUY]

Didn't MAF or somebody list gapless rings for 2F?


I believe it was TPI. I'm not sure if they still do.

 

[stumpy]

Any opinions on whether the 3FE computer will handle a Mark W camshaft w/ headers?

it should. it is a closed loop system, so while it will likely run rough until it 'learns' the map adjustments, it should be able to handle it without TOO much issue. of course my motor will be a good guinea pig for this one, so keep your eyes peeled for my report later in the year. i am going to do a 262 cam, headers, and a 2F block. should be pushing the computer pretty hard. we shall see...


anybody advance a cam in a 2F? somewhere i remember seeing that the 3FE cam is basically a 2F profile advanced about 4-6 cam degrees. is this the case? i probably dont need to push my motor any harder with a cam advance, just wondering if anyone has seen any improvement with that sort of change...

 

[stumpy]

But the biggest advantage of the 3F for higher rpm is not the shorter stroke but the lighter rod and piston combo. The 3F rod is a LOT shorter, as is the piston. The equates to a lot less weight. It's the weight as well as the stroke that creates the stress at higher speeds.

mark-


that said, would it make sense to put 3FE pistons in a 2F block? with the stamped rods and lightened pistons, it seems like the 2F would benefit even if it doesnt turn as high as the 3FE does. seems like it would just rev quciker. with the late model 2F pistons being flat the same as 3FE, i would guess the 2F and 3FE pistons would have the same part number... cruiserdan?

are the toyota pistons hypereutectic? anybody know?

 

[Mark W]

3FE rods and pistons would end up about 2 inches or so below the deck of the 2F block. Compression ratio of about 4-5 to 1 probably. No worky.

Mark...

 

[stumpy]

ack. didnt make that clear.

i meant 3FE pistons on 2F rods. just sub in the lighter, shorter pistons. are they shorter in the wrist pin to piston 'deck' height? i was imagining the 3FE pistons having just a shorter skirt, but otherwise the same dimensions as a 2F piston.


just got an e-mail back from the www.totalseal.com guys. interesting site. they need to know the groove depths and widths. i can provide bore size once i know what i am going to end up with.

anybody able to fill in groove depths and widths? i cant find them anywhere!

 

[theSherpa]

UPS them an old piston?

 

[stumpy]

that answer isnt FREE! might have to. still not sure if a zero gap ring is a good idea though...

 

[Mace]

that answer isnt FREE! might have to. still not sure if a zero gap ring is a good idea though...

Why not?

There something about blowby that you like?

 

[Mark W]

ack. didnt make that clear.

i meant 3FE pistons on 2F rods. just sub in the lighter, shorter pistons. are they shorter in the wrist pin to piston 'deck' height?

Yep. Significantly.


Mark...

 

[Mace]

Yep. Significantly.


Mark...

So you could do a "stroker" 2F if you wanted to with an offset ground crank