200 Series LC vs G550 (5 Viewers)

[TheComedian]

Friend has a G.
It depends…. The portal axles give the G with right tires a benefit above the 200 and he can get definitly further.
Problem is that the G550 like the Wrangler a bigger wheelbase than the 200 by like 4cm even if he builds bigger. That makes some things easier and others harder.
Con of the G is that he need way way more maintenance and doesn’t like the abuse you can do to a 200.
You can do way less „yeay let‘s try and find out“ without worrying that you have to get towed. The 200 is definitely more beefy.

With interior, comfort, infotainment, systems and other bling bling the G definitely wins. It is a top tier Mercedes and you feel that while the 200 even in bling bling versions feel more… ahm… Land Cruiser.

Try both.

 

[greynolds]

Friend has a G.
It depends…. The portal axles give the G with right tires a benefit above the 200 and he can get definitly further.

At least here in the US, the factory version of the G with portal axles (the 4x4 Squared) was CRAZY expensive and is also very rare as they brought very few of them over here as a special edition (in crazy colors). IIRC, the MSRP was around $350k. They had a few odd "features" to comply with US regulations, such as a weird extra lower bumper to be at the required height, no trailer hitch because it would be too high, etc. You could modify a 200 series LC to be FAR more capable for quite a bit less than $350k.

 

[Madtiger]

You can do way less „yeay let‘s try and find out“ without worrying that you have to get towed. The 200 is definitely more beefy.

Not sure i agree with these two sentences. The frame and components in G-wagen are very stout. They have all 4 breathers (axles, tranny, transfer case) up high under the hood. Everything underneath is solid forged steel. Not sure about the newer G550 (2019+) but the previous gen…all the crossmembers are welded thru-and-thru BOTH sides of the frame. The whole body and frame are dipped in wax for corrosion resistance. I think that the steel panels of the body are thicker than LC100 (not sure about LC200).

 

[JetBlack]

Not sure i agree with these two sentences. The frame and components in G-wagen are very stout. They have all 4 breathers (axles, tranny, transfer case) up high under the hood. Everything underneath is solid forged steel. Not sure about the newer G550 (2019+) but the previous gen…all the crossmembers are welded thru-and-thru BOTH sides of the frame. The whole body and frame are dipped in wax for corrosion resistance. I think that the steel panels of the body are thicker than LC100 (not sure about LC200).

The (old-generation) G does feel more substantial physically and mechanically (which may be an illusion) but everything electronic seems rather fragile compared to the 200. That includes all the transmission's electronic parts, starting with the gear shifter. I also couldn't shake off the feeling that an AMG-derived turbo engine is not something I'd really trust 100% on a tough trail far away from dealerships and tow trucks.

 

[Madtiger]

The (old-generation) G does feel more substantial physically and mechanically (which may be an illusion) but everything electronic seems rather fragile compared to the 200. That includes all the transmission's electronic parts, starting with the gear shifter. I also couldn't shake off the feeling that an AMG-derived turbo engine is not something I'd really trust 100% on a tough trail far away from dealerships and tow trucks.

It would surprise me that MB would make the current G weaker in terms of frame and suspension components. But yes, the electronics in MB are just unreliable.

 

[coleAK]

It would surprise me that MB would make the current G weaker in terms of frame and suspension components. But yes, the electronics in MB are just unreliable.

I’ve owned and been around a bunch of MBs over the years. One of my good friends is a MB master tech. His thoughts are that In general their high end cars (s class, newer g, SL,…) tend to be overly complex and have in general too much tech and lower end cars (C class,…) corners are cut to be built to a price point, both ends have unreliable and finicky electronics. But their middle range (E class,…) are very reliable. I have a 2004 e320 4matic they we have had since new, zero issues. The w210 and w211’s have had little to no electrical problems overall.

My 2003 G500 was very electrically simple, had great leather but the seats were mechanical, even the rear windows were roll up.

Also as to the discussion around the stoutness. My g, the frame, axles, drivetrain was a brick, at least as stout as my 200.

To the AMG discussion. When I was active on the G forums almost all the major problems (engine, transmission,…) were around the AMG rigs.

 

[BadReligion]

I’ve owned and been around a bunch of MBs over the years. One of my good friends is a MB master tech. His thoughts are that In general their high end cars (s class, newer g, SL,…) tend to be overly complex and have in general too much tech and lower end cars (C class,…) corners are cut to be built to a price point, both ends have unreliable and finicky electronics. But their middle range (E class,…) are very reliable. I have a 2004 e320 4matic they we have had since new, zero issues. The w210 and w211’s have had little to no electrical problems overall.

My 2003 G500 was very electrically simple, had great leather but the seats were mechanical, even the rear windows were roll up.

Also as to the discussion around the stoutness. My g, the frame, axles, drivetrain was a brick, at least as stout as my 200.

To the AMG discussion. When I was active on the G forums almost all the major problems (engine, transmission,…) were around the AMG rigs.

I would agree on the stoutness of the frame, axles, drivetrain on the G. Crawling underneath it, everything is well placed, out of the way, and as beefy if not more so than the 200. Corrosion protection is much better on the G as well. They use some type of woolwax that at 6 years is still there and there is no sign of even slight surface corrosion, compared to some very minor surface oxidation starting under the 200.

The diff lock system on the newer (2013+) G wagons is overly complex and requires a decent amount of maintenance. It uses an electriconically switched air valve to control vacuum, which in turn locks the center diff. Then once the center diff is locked, the vacuum is used to activate hydraulic amplifiers that then use hydraulic pressure to lock the front and rear diffs. Lots of areas of failure and the hydraulic fluid needs to be flushed almost yearly.

One other issue on the G63 is overheating on the trails. I was doing some light snow wheeling the other day when temps were in the 20s, and in 4low going uphill under 10mph, oil temps were pushing 220*. Meanwhile, you can cruise at 90 mph on a 100* summer day with the AC on and oil temps stay below 200*. The electric cooling fan has a tough time keeping up at low speeds.

Also, the bumper mounted intercoolers are pretty low and prone to trail damage. The G550 does not have this problem and there are actually some good looking and functional steel front winch bumpers available, but not for the G63. The "side exit" exhaust pipes specific to the 63 also reduce ground clearance. For any serious wheeling, the G550 would be the way to go, but the G63 still is pretty impressive, if you are careful with the above issues.

 

[stonepa]

I’ve owned and been around a bunch of MBs over the years. One of my good friends is a MB master tech. His thoughts are that In general their high end cars (s class, newer g, SL,…) tend to be overly complex and have in general too much tech and lower end cars (C class,…) corners are cut to be built to a price point, both ends have unreliable and finicky electronics. But their middle range (E class,…) are very reliable. I have a 2004 e320 4matic they we have had since new, zero issues. The w210 and w211’s have had little to no electrical problems overall.

My 2003 G500 was very electrically simple, had great leather but the seats were mechanical, even the rear windows were roll up.

Also as to the discussion around the stoutness. My g, the frame, axles, drivetrain was a brick, at least as stout as my 200.

To the AMG discussion. When I was active on the G forums almost all the major problems (engine, transmission,…) were around the AMG rigs.

Given a lot of the discussions here, i am starting to believe my dislike of the G may have been caused by my buying a new G65 rather than something like a lower spec G500. One owner G500s with good service histories come available around here often, and for Corolla money. I may need to pick one up for giggles. May change my opinion.

 

[Madtiger]

Given a lot of the discussions here, i am starting to believe my dislike of the G may have been caused by my buying a new G65 rather than something like a lower spec G500. One owner G500s with good service histories come available around here often, and for Corolla money. I may need to pick one up for giggles. May change my opinion.

Do NOT get a 2002 or 2003 G500.

 

[MooseOnTheLoose]

I thought about this as well except I never wanted anything mercedes. As for the GX550/lc250, I am not a huge fan of having a daily turbo vehicle. You have to warm up and let them cool down before shutting the engine off. (Turbo cooking). The oil intervals are sub 5k miles due to the extra pressure and heat the oil is now exposed too. Absolutely have to have Premium unlike the 5.7 (I don't care what lexus says). 2016 LX570 > 2016 LC due to price and what you get > GX550 > LC250. The split tailgate is still way better than a full hatch. IMHO. The new engines don't have as many merits as the v8 predecessor. Only real reason I'd get the gx550 trail++xyz is just for the updated style. But not for nearly 80k.

 

[JetBlack]

I thought about this as well except I never wanted anything mercedes. As for the GX550/lc250, I am not a huge fan of having a daily turbo vehicle. You have to warm up and let them cool down before shutting the engine off. (Turbo cooking). The oil intervals are sub 5k miles due to the extra pressure and heat the oil is now exposed too. Absolutely have to have Premium unlike the 5.7 (I don't care what lexus says). 2016 LX570 > 2016 LC due to price and what you get > GX550 > LC250. The split tailgate is still way better than a full hatch. IMHO. The new engines don't have as many merits as the v8 predecessor. Only real reason I'd get the gx550 trail++xyz is just for the updated style. But not for nearly 80k.

I thought turbo cooking is no longer a prominent problem for like 20 years now?

 

[Madtiger]

Good read on the improvements made to 2019+ G-wagen.

The new Mercedes-Benz G-Class

The new Mercedes-Benz G-Class presents itself in top form.

media.mbusa.com

Pretty much the current G should be better than the old in every way. Stronger frame. More rigid body. Better off-road performance in every way. Better on-road.

BUT, weird that they highlight STRUT TOWER BRACE several times as contributor to frame strength. I understand the concept of strut tower brace but they write as if it is like a frame crossmember. Not sure I like that idea that a little thing under the hood is so important to the frame.

 

[stonepa]

Good read on the improvements made to 2019+ G-wagen.

The new Mercedes-Benz G-Class

The new Mercedes-Benz G-Class presents itself in top form.

media.mbusa.com

Pretty much the current G should be better than the old in every way. Stronger frame. More rigid body. Better off-road performance in every way. Better on-road.

BUT, weird that they highlight STRUT TOWER BRACE several times as contributor to frame strength. I understand the concept of strut tower brace but they write as if it is like a frame crossmember. Not sure I like that idea that a little thing under the hood is so important to the frame.

Maybe due to the IFS?

 

[MooseOnTheLoose]

I thought turbo cooking is no longer a prominent problem for like 20 years now?

It's still mechanical. Unless there is an auxiliary oil pump pushing oil through the lines and valleys after the vehicle is shut off.. it is still a problem to this day. Nothing in that matter has changed to this day. Oil sitting in hot places, is oil sitting in hot places.

 

[Madtiger]

Maybe due to the IFS?

Yeah I see this in sports cars to increase rigidity for hard cornering. Our LC has IFS…and our frame is not dependent on something like this!

But in G, it seems to be a vital component for front end frame strength. That is wild. The G is not a sports car that needs this for hard cornering. This is labeled basically as a cross member of the frame it seems.

 

[JetBlack]

It's still mechanical. Unless there is an auxiliary oil pump pushing oil through the lines and valleys after the vehicle is shut off.. it is still a problem to this day. Nothing in that matter has changed to this day. Oil sitting in hot places, is oil sitting in hot places.

I'm not a mechanic of any kind, so all my knowledge here is anecdotal, but I've been told that machining tolerances have been improved by an order of magnitude in the past 20 years or so. Which is the reason for 15K oil change intervals and which is why nobody cares about proper break-in periods for new cars anymore.

 

[MooseOnTheLoose]

I'm not a mechanic of any kind, so all my knowledge here is anecdotal, but I've been told that machining tolerances have been improved by an order of magnitude in the past 20 years or so. Which is the reason for 15K oil change intervals and which is why nobody cares about proper break-in periods for new cars anymore.

Car care nut yourube channel can put it in better words than I'd be willing to type.

 

[hoser]

I would've purchased a G-Wagen a long time ago but there isn't much support in the US. Very few people are wheeling them and hardly any aftermarket parts. Bumpers, sliders, skids, etc would have to but custom. This guy wheels it though....

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[JetBlack]

I would've purchased a G-Wagen a long time ago but there isn't much support in the US.

To be fair, J200s aren't exactly crowding the trails either...

 

[hoser]

@JetBlack But there are at least 5 times the number of aftermarket parts for the 200. I first wanted a SWB G-Wagen. I decided on the 73/74 Series instead. The 73/74 is even more rare on the trails than a G-wagen but there is still a lot of support. They never even sold the 70 series in the US yet there is more support for them than a G-wagen.