Warn 8274 winch solenoid

[flyer91]

Well, this might add more confusion, but here it is anyways .....

I tried to find the data for the Superwinch sealed solenoid pack, and failing that ..... I looked to see what Superwinch model the pack was used on, and found this info for the Talon series Superwinch winches on Summit's site:

"Superwinch's Talon series winches will help you pull out of a variety of situations. Whether you're on the race track or off-road, Superwinch has you covered. Superwinch manufactures these winch assemblies with a sealed vehicle recover winch assembly. All seals on the entire winch meet IP67 standards, from the outermost end of the high performance motor and groundbreaking solenoid to the 2-stage planetary and 2-stage spur gearbox. The sealed 5.2 and 6.0 hp motors deliver a quick but safe line speed at a low 75 amp draw. A heat sink styled motor cap maintains low temperatures under the heaviest loads. The solenoid will keep water, mud, snow, and dust out and has a patented venting feature that allows the contacts to resist water and release contact-damaging internal condensation. They come available in standard cable or synthetic winch line models."

This was for their 18,000 lb pull unit spec's as follows:

Winch Style Electric
Pull Rating (lbs)18,000 lbs.
Volts 12 V
Winch Fairlead Type Hawse
Remote Included Yes
Remote15 ft. hand-held remote switch
Free-SpoolingYes
Brake Yes
Power Out Yes
Drive Gear Planetary
Winch Line Included Yes
Winch Line Type Synthetic
Winch Line Diameter (in) 1/2 in.
Winch Line Material Steel
Winch Line Length (ft) 90 ft.
No Load Line Speed 25.00 fpm
Conforms to J706 Standards Yes
Mounting Hole Quantity 4 holes
Mounting Pattern Length (in) 10.000 in.
Mounting Pattern Width (in) 4.500 in.
Weight 147.000 lbs.
Motor Horsepower 6.00 hp
Gear Reduction Ratio 346:1
Quantity Sold individually.
Notes Standard solenoid mounting.

The key information being; a 6HP motor that pulls 18,000lbs with only 75 amps (as listed in the descriptive text). (???)

If you trust the Warn load charts info .... the Warn 9.5XP pulls 8000lb at 425 amps, so ........ if I get a solenoid pack I will either get an Albright (after reading some long use reports with an 8274 using the Warn 9.5XP 6HP motor) or the Warn pack 'if' I can find any data for it, or similar long term hard use reports.

In the meantime, I'll probably just stick with 4 of the bolt-in golf cart solenoids from Amazon, rated for 100 amps continuous duty each.

 

[flyer91]

Any brave souls wanna try this '150 Amp' contactor @$30 delivered via USPS priority mail?

If so ..... here ya go Surplus Center - 12 VDC 150 AMP MOTOR REVERSING CONTACTOR



12 VDC MOTOR REVERSING CONTACTOR




SPECIFICATIONS

• Coil Voltage 12 VDC
• Contact Ratings 150 amps
• Shift time on/off 50 msec.
• Duty 6 minutes @ max output
• Max duty cycle 20%

• Coil terminals 1/4" spade
• Motor & battery terminals 6mm studs
• Mount 2 holes on 2-3/4" centers
• Size 2-5/8" x 1-3/4" x 2-5/8"
• Shpg. 1 lb.

This "Global Economy" (read: cheap Chinese knock-offs) makes finding the right 'quality' part more difficult all the time ..........

 

[crushers]

ummm, some of that Chinese knock-offs are actually really good quality.

 

[flyer91]

I certainly would not dispute that at all, but WRT the subject here ...... what crystal ball can a fellow use to determine which one(s) deserve the title of "Quality" from the 3 different Albright look-alike contactors I pictured and priced in my posts here?

Admittedly I'm making a (fairly safe) assumption that there are Chinese clones in this mix, and I guess @ $30 bucks for the last one, a person could buy 2 and if one failed during a pull you could have a back-up.
But the only one that has any real data for it seems to be the Albright, all the others are a WAG.

I just re-read this and I didn't mean for it to sound hostile. I'm really serious about the question.

 

[1911]

.... (after reading some long use reports with an 8274 using the Warn 9.5XP 6HP motor)

I've been running that setup, with the Superwinch $90 contactor from Summit racing for a little more than a year now, but I've only had to use it a few times so I can't claim any hard or long use to report. I'm happy with it so far.

 

[Sully73FJ40]

I watched a video of the summit Albright that 1911 and myself have. The video shows it submerged in water for a period of time with it wired to a winch. While submerged in the fish tank it continues to operate flawlessly.

 

[Sully73FJ40]

Everything is coming from china now that is electronic. Look at the ipads and some of the warn motors. We are deep in red state crap. I highly doubt summit would be selling a knock off and using the name Albright with it if it wasn't from Albright. Hell warn is pretty much Chinese these days.

 

[flyer91]

I can't see where Summit is claiming it's made by Albright.
Was there a link that shows that?
According to one poster in this thread, when he contacted Albright about this particular contactor, Albright said it was not made by them but appeared to be a knock off of their product.

Actually ..... I really don't need for it to be an Albright product, but would feel more comfortable if I saw a data sheet and/or some testimonials from people using it on a Warn 8274 with the 6hp 9.5xp motor, under hard use for a significant number of pulls.

In lieu of that I suppose I could always just get 2 and have a back up at less than the price of a undisputed real Albright.
Come to think of it ........that's probably what I'll do.
Not as cheap as 2 of the $30 knock-offs, but a heck of a lot more reassuring!

 

[crushers]

<shrug>
warn is still claimed to be warn with a chinese motor.

repackaging has been around since the beginning of greed (capitalism).

IF summit is claiming it is made by Albright then MAYBE Albright is getting it from China and repackaging it to sell to summit????

(look at the big 3, they claim AMERICAN but use parts from Mexico, Brazil, China, Japan) it is all about apearences.

 

[acpete]

I think I'll give warn a call on monday and see what they have to say. They have always been honest and helpful in my experience.

 

[flyer91]

Once again guys ........ where is Summit claiming that their Superwinch contactor is an Albright product?

I agree they would be out of character to do that if it wasn't truly an Albright, but I suspect that all the posts here and on Pirate (etc.) claiming that the Superwinch contactor is an Albright and/or 'is' being advertised anywhere as being an Albright product, has now (IMHO) actually just become the accepted lore, as I can't find anyone but users claiming this.

The point is .... since spec's for the Superwinch, Warn or the other el-chepo I posted above can't be found, claims that 'any' of them have the same documented spec's or even similar performance of an Albright are (so far) not substantiated by any of the searches I've done.

IMHO: It's not a Chinese, Indian, Turkey, Taiwan ..... thing, it's simply just a getting the facts correct thing, so a person knows exactly what they're getting and what expectations they can assume regarding what it's performance should be.

But ..... if that data can't be had for each version, then I think it's safe enough that if a consensus of users, that are using the device in the same manner (same winch with the same motor) over an acceptabe period of time/number of pulls ...... can be had, that can determine their performance empirically, and I'm a happy camper!


In any case ......... for people wanting to duplicate what Warn uses in the 9.5XP controller ........ they use 4 solenoids of two different types.
A tall one and a short one for each direction.
Both are available through Amazon (from Damlow) for $15.99 each.

The taller one is a WARN 68379 Winch Solenoid Amazon.com: WARN 68379 Winch Solenoid: Damlow Prices

The shorter one is Warn 28396 winch solenoid Amazon.com: WARN SOLENOID for most Warn 8-9 500lb winches such as XD9000 / XD9000i / 9.5ti: Damlow Prices

Although the above link doesn't list the 9.5XP in that ad on Amazon, I looked up the parts lists for the XD9000 'and' the 9.5XP to be sure this is the proper short solenoid for both ...... and it is.

So ........ if a person wanted to stay with solenoids instead of a contactor (heck .... cheaper to have back-ups) and was using any of the newer Warn winches, an old 8274 with stock motor, or retrofitting an 8247 to a newer and more powerful motor, and wanted to be assured that they were using the correct genuine Warn solenoids .... to do that, you would use 2 of each of these solenoids configured as in this diagram http://www.warn.com/truck/ReplacementParts/Self-RecoveryRPL/srrpl9.5xp.pdf.
You can blow it up to see the mounting better if needed.

 

[lulo]

.
The best solenoid Quality-Price...


... ALBRIGHT !!!
.

 

[flyer91]

I've finally found a place that advertises the Superwinch contactor as being an Albright.
It's here Superwinch -- EE -- Expedition Exchange Incorporated
Out of the two names listed under "contacts" for Expedition Exchange (HO Chung or John Lee) l've emailed Mr. Lee to get some clarification of that claim, and hopefully ...... a source for some spec's/performance data.
But, I suspect the adage "every picture tells a story" is applicable here ...........

I've also emailed Superwinch, and asked if Albright makes their contactor, and if so ........ does it meet the specifications of an Albright DC88P.
I also asked if not an Albright DC88P equivalent, would they reply with the specifications for their contactor, or provide a source of same.

It'll be interesting to see what replies I receive .......... if I receive any replies.
I'll post anything I get ..........

 

[acpete]

I sent Warn an email so hopefully they might have some insight on the specs.

I've have a few questions for you about your contact solenoids. I own a M8000 and it is about 15 years old. It has sat for the last 7 years. I just took it apart, replaced the seals and re-greased it. Also had it re-powder coated. It looks like new. I did telephone Warn tech(s) during this rebuild and found them to be very helpful.

So my solenoid or switch is now bad. Can't get it to work. I bypassed the two and the motor will spin out and in. The solenoid is so old I'm thinking about just replacing it. The switch I have is only a three wire switch. I know I will need a new switch #83665 if I purchase part #83664.

I see part #83664 is the new replacement solenoid for the M8000. Is this a contact solenoid? Is there any data, spec, or tech information? What country is this manufactured in? I have heard rumors that it may be manufactured by Albright Company for Warn, any truth to this?

I was also looking at part #34971. Is there any data, spec, or tech information? What country is this manufactured in? I have heard rumors that it may be manufactured by Albright Company for Warn, any truth to this? Does it meet the specifications of an Albright DC88P.

Should I be cautious about purchasing Warn parts thruogh online sites, such as Amazon and this listing.. Amazon.com: WARN 34971 Contractor, 12V, SW, W/FACTOR Y Bracket: Automotive

Just exploring options here. I looked at some online forums for some ideas and knowledge and there seems to be a lot of speculation about various parts that can be adapted to function as replacement contact solenoids. Here is one interesting thread on https://forum.ih8mud.com/winching-recovery/464180-warn-8274-winch-solenoid.html

Looking forward to hearing from you,

Andrew​

 

[flyer91]

Hi Andrew (acpete),

As indicated I also sent a similar email to info@Superwinch.com from the Superwinch Superwinch LLC web site at Superwinch, LLC - Winch * Shop Winches.

This is what I asked:

Hi,
is the Superwinch 90-14452 contactor made by Albright, and if so is it the same specifications as the Albright DC88P?

If not, do you have the 'detail' specifications for it (like those that are available for the Albright DC88P)?

Thank you and best regards,

Gary

This AM I received this reply:

----- Original Message -----
From: Jason Stanton
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 8:03 AM
Subject: RE: Contactor #90-14452 questions ......



Gary
The 90-14452 Superwinch solenoid is available to order from the Superwinch web site.
This solenoid is the Albright.
Jason

Although I didn't get any 'direct' answer to the question of it having the same spec's as the Albright DC88P, at least the Superwinch has been documented 'by' a Superwinch rep, to in fact be an Albright.
But ..... because of as alia176's post #31 here, with the reply form Albright clearly indicating it's not a DC88P, I've asked Jason for some clarification to his response to me.

Also ...... I can't explain the two different housings for the contactor in the images at the Expedition Exchange, but my guess is that there was a change in the contactor housings for some manufacturing reason, which would help explain the differences in their appearance.

 

[flyer91]

I haven't heard back from anyone with actual specifications for the Superwinch contactor, and I don't mean to keep beating on this, but I did find some other info that might be of use to people wanting to upgrade to the 9.5XP 6 HP motor on a 8274.

As I had posted before, the solenoids used in the 9.5XP (and other Warn 9000lb winches) use 2 each WARN 68379 solenoids and 2 each Warn 28396 available through Amazon for $16 ea from Damlow Prices (see above post number 51).

Here is the wiring diagram for those that want to do this:
View attachment Warn 9.5XP solenoid wiring diagram.pdf

I'm probably more inclined to use these solenoids with my 8274 9.5XP motor combo because it's the exact solenoids Warns uses on the 9.5XP, and because I can buy back-ups for $16 each and keep them in the truck.

 

[flyer91]

I heard back from Jason at Superwinch this AM.
Here is his response for my request of a clarification to his initial response:

"Gary,
In my haste to get an answer out, I misspoke. I intended to say our 90-14452 is our “Albright”, that is, our performance model. I apologize for the confusion.

We believe and our testing shows our solenoids are the best on the market. That said, we don’t recommend them for anything but a Superwinch. We keep our internals and benchmark testing private, as it’s a competitive advantage for us. I am sure you can appreciate this position. There is documented reason why our solenoids are covered by the best warranty in the winch industry (3 years).

I can comment only that our solenoids are proprietary, are engineered by and manufactured for Superwinch. I cannot comment on who produces these components.

Sorry again for any confusion.

Jason"


So ....... it appears that the official word from Superwinch (as of today) is that it is not an actual Albright, but instead is apparently ........... "Albrightine"
And (unfortunately) it's specifications are a trade secrete.

This jives with alia176's post #31, where Albright said the Superwinch contactor was not theirs.

I'll let somebody else try to see if the warranty applies when not used on a Superwinch.

 

[Sully73FJ40]

Will Albright give you a 3 year warranty on their solenoids? 1911 and several others are using the superwinch model. I have these sitting here at home and watched a couple videos of these solenoids submerged in a tank and still operating correctly even after days of brig submerged.

 

[flyer91]

I don't know if Albright's warranty is 3 years , but I would guess that (according to Jason's response) ...... neither is Superwinch's if used on a non-Superwinch product.
So by default ......... it's probably safe to assume Albright's warranty is longer than Superwinches no warranty when used on an 8274.

I do think it's kinda funny that Superwinch calls their contactor "the Albright " of their product line.
That's like Ford saying the Lincoln is the Cadillac of Fords ..........

I wish there were reports of the Superwinch being used in harsh real life conditions ...... and for significant number of pulls.
I rarely do any winching in a fish tank ...........

 

[Sully73FJ40]

How would they know it was hooked to a superwinch and not a 8274? While I agree that no one is using a fish tank, I believe a completely submerged solenoid hooked to a winch that is in return attempting to do its job and succeeds at it, is a good sign. Now how the solenoid will hold up to salt in the winter time is a different story but I'm sure it will be okay if either mounted under the hood or under the solenoid cover that is sealed up. While yea it isn't correct of superwinch to classify their contractor as "the Albright", it is most likely made by the same manufacturing company somewhere in China or Thailand and packaged slightly different. You should do a test between the real Albright and the superwinch "Albright". It would be Interesting to know exactly how different they are if there is even a difference.