Thoughts From the 200 Crew On the LC250 Reveal (1 Viewer)

[Bill92]

The new 70 series is a thing of beauty. Hopefully it’ll bring down the cost of the last Gen 76 series. Only 15ish more years until those are importable.

I am going to leave it up to ARB to sell this Prado to me. In its current form I’m unimpressed.

I was never giving up the 200 anyway. I’d rather build a bigger garage than sell another (genuine) LC.

Luckily this isn’t a genuine LC. Just another disposable vehicle. At this point I’d rather drive the current sequoia.

On the other hand, this gives me a reason to make a really interesting (bad) decision and just get a supra. They’ll probably have the same ground clearance.

This.
The Toyota rep at the press conference even said to the guy from Xoverland that the sequoia is the choice for people who want an off road capable SUV a step up in size from the US-LC. Although the Sequoia is slightly bigger than the 300 and may not have the same allure or status, I think it may be pretty darn close in terms of longevity/build quality. But I guess only time will tell.

 

[Bill92]

I personally think the 911 and LC is a great comparison and they likely show up as one of the most shared garages of all enthusiast vehicle pairs. If they don’t, I bet it is one of the most desired!

I'm poor, so instead of a 911 my LC shares the garage with a BMW E30. I can almost fit them in one stall, one driving right underneath the other

 

[desmocruiser]

I'm poor, so instead of a 911 my LC shares the garage with a BMW E30. I can almost fit them in one stall, one driving right underneath the other

Another favorite, the M3’s are now in 911 territory and both past my threshold!

I have bid and missed on a couple 325is, I think these are the next ones to take off!

My father had a convertible back in the early 90’s, enjoyed driving that one when given the opportunity!

 

[manofthewoods]

Nailed it. To me the only non negotiable component of an LC is reliability beyond reasonable expectations.

To add...
I may, or, may not like it but Toyota put out a possible Bronco killer, and maybe even something a normal person could purchase instead of a LR Discovery. For those "normal" people who have some brand loyalty, the 250 gives them the Toyota in a package that competes.
Face it, "we" are but a pesky mosquito to Toyota marketing and sales. They figure "those mosquitoes want a 300? Fine, they'll get a LX, 'cause they ain't going to get a Range Rover"
Just think about how many of the sparkling new Broncos and Discoverys will never be put in 4L

 

[LX Cruiser]

Face it, "we" are but a pesky mosquito to Toyota marketing and sales.

Great post, and absolutely agreed with this part. Sucks to be stuck in the same market as the average American consumer lol

 

[TheComedian]

I mean it is pretty logically that Toyota switches to the 250 for the US Market since the 200 never sold that big over there. It cost alot to hold special tools, training and spare parts for alle the T dealers all over the US for a model that mostly isn’t targeting a more offroad like audience over there and is more in a fight with cars like a Expedition, a Yukon or a Suburban. Nothing to win there. So it is smarter to let the 4Runner (a mostly a model only for the US) disappear and bringing in the smaller LC that is also sold all over the world. The US market is not small but compared to the rest of the world not that extremely interesting for Toyota to sell the 300.
Lets see … 200 sales in the US 21 -> 3.700 (highest ever) while they sold in Australia nearly 11.000 in the first half year. So it isn’t worth the money to hold back capacity for 200s in the US.

But hey there is an easy way for you guys. Just import the 300 if you want one like many other people in other parts of the world also have to do. There is no black magic behind….

 

[JohnPW]

I mean it is pretty logically that Toyota switches to the 250 for the US Market since the 200 never sold that big over there. It cost alot to hold special tools, training and spare parts for alle the T dealers all over the US for a model that mostly isn’t targeting a more offroad like audience over there and is more in a fight with cars like a Expedition, a Yukon or a Suburban. Nothing to win there. So it is smarter to let the 4Runner (a mostly a model only for the US) disappear and bringing in the smaller LC that is also sold all over the world. The US market is not small but compared to the rest of the world not that extremely interesting for Toyota to sell the 300.
Lets see … 200 sales in the US 21 -> 3.700 (highest ever) while they sold in Australia nearly 11.000 in the first half year. So it isn’t worth the money to hold back capacity for 200s in the US.

But hey there is an easy way for you guys. Just import the 300 if you want one like many other people amin other parts of the world also have to do. There is no black magic behind….

Illegal in the USA to import a car less than 25 years old. The US Government would impound and destroy any 300 you import that is driven on public roads.

 

[ToothDr]

The last advertisement I saw in the USA for the Land Cruiser was in a 1989 National Geographic for the 62 series. Let’s hope Toyota does a better job with the 250 series.
The Land Cruiser name plate is mostly unknown to many Americans due to lack of advertising from Toyota over the last 30 Years. If they want to sell these things in greater volume, an aggressive ad campaign is needed. I’m sure Toyota is already working on that.

 

[TheComedian]

Illegal in the USA to import a car less than 25 years old. The US Government would impound and destroy any 300 you import that is driven on public roads.

Oh, I haven't heard that either. But well, there are also disadvantages with an exaggerated protectionism that protects US brands from competition with other brands.

I assumed that this rule only applies to larger pickups and trucks.
Here in Germany, for example, I can import virtually any car that also meets the local rules and before I get a license plate it must be fully tested anyway like any other car every two years.

Sry for you bad luck over there

 

[manofthewoods]

The last advertisement I saw in the USA for the Land Cruiser was in a 1989 National Geographic for the 62 series. Let’s hope Toyota does a better job with the 250 series.
The Land Cruiser name plate is mostly unknown to many Americans due to lack of advertising from Toyota over the last 30 Years. If they want to sell these things in greater volume, an aggressive ad campaign is needed. I’m sure Toyota is already working on that.

I am old enough (easily) to remember 1989. Unlike you however, I was not sophisticated enough to read National Geographic. I read Playboy (for the excellent articles and interviews only). I may have been too distracted by other photos to notice anything about Landcruisers in there

 

[Specialeyes]

The last advertisement I saw in the USA for the Land Cruiser was in a 1989 National Geographic for the 62 series. Let’s hope Toyota does a better job with the 250 series.
The Land Cruiser name plate is mostly unknown to many Americans due to lack of advertising from Toyota over the last 30 Years. If they want to sell these things in greater volume, an aggressive ad campaign is needed. I’m sure Toyota is already working on that.

I have had my LC nearly 2 months and in that time I have had multiple people mistake it for a Sequoia, Highlander, or 4Runner.

 

[ElJayBird]

I think Toyota’s rationale here makes perfect sense. Most people who are willing to pay $100k for an SUV want a Lexus, Merc, or some other luxury badge. So they gave us the 300 with a Lexus badge and the high price tag and the watered down LC for the masses - Toyota did exactly what 99% of Americans want. Perfectly rational market decision IMO.

I won’t buy one but may consider the LX in a few years, or maybe even the new GX. We’ll see how after market support shapes up. But I’m in my 200 for at least the next 5 years or so. I mean, I just did a $10k refresh on it so gotta get my money’s worth! LOL

 

[JohnPW]

Oh, I haven't heard that either. But well, there are also disadvantages with an exaggerated protectionism that protects US brands from competition with other brands.

I assumed that this rule only applies to larger pickups and trucks.
Here in Germany, for example, I can import virtually any car that also meets the local rules and before I get a license plate it must be fully tested anyway like any other car every two years.

Sry for you bad luck over there

Plenty of imported cars here, in fact the majority of cars are built by overseas manufacturers (many of those in US factories). But they all have to go through a very expensive process to prove compliance with US emissions and crash safety regulations. If a car company doesn’t plan to sell a particular model in the US (like the 300 series Land Cruiser), then they don’t spend the money to prove US compliance. No USA crash safety compliance means no importation for use on US roads, arbitrarily for 25 years.

The issue is not that the vehicle wouldn’t pass US regulations, it’s that the process is so cumbersome and expensive. The LX600 is sold here so the LC300 would meet requirements, but if Toyota hasn’t paid to prove it, it’s pretty much impossible for a US resident to import one.

 

[Brown98LC]

You know what's sad?
The 1958 proves they could have sold
Relatively stripped down 200s or even 300s in the US.

The new Prado isn't really that much smaller than the 300 actually almost the same size.

I'm not in the US but it annoys me honestly, gonna cringe so hard when people start putting the 250 after the 200 in US LC history videos.

The 250 LC will be excellent i don't doubt it.
A 2024 "1958" lc300 would have been better.

Realistically though the 250 will probably sell better because the 300 wouldn't have looked as "retro".

 

[Brown98LC]

---

One thing they can do in future to switch over any US 200 owners who don't want o get a 250 Prado/LC is possibly introduce an overtrail trim LX 600, it would be expensive but it would attract those who never had an issue with previous LC price and would be a nice off road flagship of Lexus sitting above the GX 550 as well as becoming kind of like an off road halo product for Toyota/Lexus in the US market.

They would also sell a lot of them in the Middle East so offering it for the select few who want in the US wouldn't be an issue, even if they end up selling little.

They already offer a triple locked version of the LX 600 in Japan anyway so the base for such a trim level is already available.
if done properly, that could end up being a very nice product honestly.

 

[Redbull]

Reading through this thread makes someone think Toyota made a RAV4 built in America and badged it Landcruiser.

A Prado is a Landcruiser Prado and they last a long freaking time all over the world and they’re known as Landcruisers. Like I said before if you wanted a real full fat Landcruiser maybe you should have bought a new 200

 

[jefo13]

I look forward to the j250 builds from @Eric Sarjeant

 

[TeCKis300]

This.
The Toyota rep at the press conference even said to the guy from Xoverland that the sequoia is the choice for people who want an off road capable SUV a step up in size from the US-LC. Although the Sequoia is slightly bigger than the 300 and may not have the same allure or status, I think it may be pretty darn close in terms of longevity/build quality. But I guess only time will tell.

The Sequoia is MASSIVE and would be borderline as an adventure trail rig. Great size for overlanding. For reference, it has a 122" wheelbase which is more inline with full size pickups. Relative to the 4Runner (109.8") and LC250/Land Cruiser series (112.2").

Then again, people shoehorn the Gladiator down trails with a 137.3″ wheelbase. Larger vehicles need relatively larger tires to get them on par with something smaller for technical wheeling.

 

[BarcoBeach]

I have to admit the Land Cruiser 250 left me a little underwhelmed. My 200 serves many roles, one important one is towing. For the most part I like the styling (not the rear) but no v6 option, no split gate (didn’t even add the power rear window) confuses me. Don’t get me wrong, the price point and mpg I get because they will pull more sales and add younger buyers into the mix, which could come long term customers. What I fail to understand is the purpose of this model. I don’t believe it will out preform the lc200 in an overlanding role. While it is smaller and with a disconnecting sway bar it might perform better on the trail, but with the turbos I don’t know without long term reviews. The MPG is nice how much will it lose when weight, larger tires etc are added onto it is a big question.

Toyota calls it a land cruiser so to me that is what it is. Disclaimer, my 200 shares a garage with a BMW 1M which I’ve been told many times isn’t a real M. Back to the new lc250, I hope they sell a ton of them and maybe we will get a special edition with the gx550 engine. Like with Porsche adding SUVs and sedans to their lineup, it allowed them to keep making the amazing 911s. It is no secret they financially saved Porsche.

As a Toyota fan it pains me to say this but I was looking for an off road SUV around this price point, I’d pick my wife’s Bronco or the diesel Wrangler over this. I love my LC200.

For the people who really like it, I hope you get one and enjoy the heck out it. If you look back at it and it makes you feel the way my 200 makes me feel that is all that matters.

 

[2021 LC200]

Searched for LX and LC200 sales numbers in the US, copied below. While more LX570's were sold, there is less between them then I expected. Why we did not get the 300 series TTV6 gasoline in the US and maybe a lower trim version remains very disappointing to me. The argument US buyers did not like enough the LC200 and where mostly buying LX570's seems a bit of an overstatement. I understand there have been years with big deltas, also many years with little difference.

The other confusing part as noted by others; What will Toyota do for the next generation 4Runner? With the introduction of the 250 series LC Prado in the US they have clearly run into 4Runner territory. Seems the only thing they can do is downgrade the new 4Runner from the existing model. That will no doubt be very pleasing for the big group of 4Runner owners.

This approach is pretty unique and basically just happened for Land Cruiser 200 owners in the US. Car manufacturers typically have improved their cars (capacity/capability/tech) to attract current owners to trade in and spend a bit more again. Tempting them into the next step forward. Then introduced new lines at the bottom end to attract new buyers. Like BMW 3, 5 and 7 series have grown over the years slightly, so they introduced the 2 series.

From the same source as the LC200 information, with what appears to be a more realistic number of LX570's sold in 2021.

Lexus​ LX​
2021	3.563
2020	4.512
2019	4.718
2018	4.753
2017	6.004
2016	5.707
2015	3.884
2014	4.052
2013	4.625
2012	5.005
2011	3.167
2010	3.983
2009	3.616
2008	7.915
2007	2.468
2006	5.595
2005	8.555
2004	9.846
2003	9.193
2002	9.231
2001	9.355
2000	14.732
1999	15.734
1998	11.004
1997	6.785
1996	7.528
1995	0

​

Toyota​ Land Cruiser​
2021	3.711
2020	3.147
2019	3.536
2018	3.235
2017	3.100
2016	3.705
2015	2.687
2014	3.158
2013	3.082
2012	2.895
2011	1.662
2010	1.807
2009	2.261
2008	3.801
2007	3.251
2006	3.376
2005	4.870
2004	6.778
2003	6.671
2002	6.752
2001	7.591
2000	15.509
1999	18.602
1998	14.327
1997	11.502
1996	12.816
1995	14.240
1994	10.980
1993	8.886
1992	7.865
1991	8.507
1990	6.194
1989	5.091
1988	6.024
1987	5.008
1986	4.475
1985	4.740
1984	4.037
1983	4.805
1982	3.088
1981	2.027
1980	3.058
1979	5.716
1978	8.858
1977	9.924
1976	9.236
1975	9.050
1974	8.204
1973	11.218