The 2H/12H-T/1HZ/1HD-T/1HD-FT Gturbo Alternative Tech Thread (12 Viewers)

[loucaojr]

HI!

And what about this one? MAMBA TOYOTA 1HD-T Landcruiser turbocharger w/ 1HD-FTE CT15B Core & Turbine Hsg | eBay

How would it compare with the TD05-18G?

Cheers

 

[dare]

HI!

And what about this one? MAMBA TOYOTA 1HD-T Landcruiser turbocharger w/ 1HD-FTE CT15B Core & Turbine Hsg | eBay

How would it compare with the TD05-18G?

Cheers

Smaller compressor and slightly smaller turbine than the td05h-18g, the compressor is smaller than a 16g also. The turbine is a super old school paddle wheel. The TD05 is a newer, more efficient design.

For pretty much the same money a 6cm td05h-16g would spool much the same but is newer tech and can support more power more efficiently.

 

[mudgudgeon]

HI!

And what about this one? MAMBA TOYOTA 1HD-T Landcruiser turbocharger w/ 1HD-FTE CT15B Core & Turbine Hsg | eBay

How would it compare with the TD05-18G?

Cheers

Yeah basically a HDFTE turbo.
It's turbine is not super old school, but is definitely old school.
Pic 8 shows HDT CT26 turbine on the left with very square blade shape, newer style HDFTE CT20b CT15B curved blade shape on the right.

 

[dare]

Yeah basically a HDFTE turbo.
It's turbine is not super old school, but is definitely old school.
Pic 8 shows HDT CT26 turbine on the left with very square blade shape, newer style HDFTE CT20b CT15B curved blade shape on the right.

Looks like a super old school paddle wheel to me.

I was going to make a thread about this the other day. Some people claim the FTE turbo has a modern turbine but the pictures of them I've seen apart and replacement turbines I've seen for sale show a paddle wheel. Anyone got pics of their curved FTE turbines?

Pardon our interruption...

 

[mudgudgeon]

Looks like a super old school paddle wheel to me.

I was going to make a thread about this the other day. Some people claim the FTE turbo has a modern turbine but the pictures of them I've seen apart and replacement turbines I've seen for sale show a paddle wheel. Anyone got pics of their curved FTE turbines?

Pardon our interruption...

I'm not saying it's a modern turbine, just more modern than the super old school HDT style paddle wheel.

I've had both side be side on the bench and the difference between the super old school HDT, and the slightly less old school HDFTE turbine is obvious enough

 

[davegonz]

Here's a pic of mine when I rebuilt it.

 

[Dougal]

Looks like a super old school paddle wheel to me.

I was going to make a thread about this the other day. Some people claim the FTE turbo has a modern turbine but the pictures of them I've seen apart and replacement turbines I've seen for sale show a paddle wheel. Anyone got pics of their curved FTE turbines?

I believe all the FTE's got paddle wheels. Reason was to keep turbine drive pressures high enough to drive EGR flow.

I have seen a nicely curved CT20B turbine wheel from another application. It was not FTE and I didn't have accurate diameters.

 

[gte343z]

I believe all the FTE's got paddle wheels. Reason was to keep turbine drive pressures high enough to drive EGR flow.

I have seen a nicely curved CT20B turbine wheel from another application. It was not FTE and I didn't have accurate diameters.

Only curved one that I have seen was a replacement for the ceramic ct20, but it has a larger journal and shaft OD than the ct26 small. It is also a 9 blade low back pressure turbine wheel.

Pardon Our Interruption...

 

[Wildnlost]

Only curved one that I have seen was a replacement for the ceramic ct20, but it has a larger journal and shaft OD than the ct26 small. It is also a 9 blade low back pressure turbine wheel.

Pardon Our Interruption...

I changed out the Nine blade wheel that came in my td05-18g for a 12blade unit. The nine blade does not build any drive pressure until tge revs are up. It reduces drive pressure at all revs and I believe it is for the tuner crowd. Spool was significantly improved with the 12 blade wheel. Feels way more responsive.

 

[KiwiDingo]

I changed out the Nine blade wheel that came in my td05-18g for a 12blade unit. The nine blade does not build any drive pressure until tge revs are up. It reduces drive pressure at all revs and I believe it is for the tuner crowd. Spool was significantly improved with the 12 blade wheel. Feels way more responsive.

How much did your EMP increase after you swapped the turbine over?

 

[Dougal]

I changed out the Nine blade wheel that came in my td05-18g for a 12blade unit. The nine blade does not build any drive pressure until tge revs are up. It reduces drive pressure at all revs and I believe it is for the tuner crowd. Spool was significantly improved with the 12 blade wheel. Feels way more responsive.

Yeah 9 blades are for ricers on small engines that rev to the moon.

 

[mudgudgeon]

I believe all the FTE's got paddle wheels. Reason was to keep turbine drive pressures high enough to drive EGR flow.

I have seen a nicely curved CT20B turbine wheel from another application. It was not FTE and I didn't have accurate diameters.

Standard HD-T on the left, standard HDFTE on the right.

 

[KiwiDingo]

Interesting read from the guys at Eclipse Turbos @Eclipse . Reinforces that fact I don't care to much about boost pressure. I'm much more interested in monitoring EMP and getting the lowest EMP:IMP possible which goes hand in hand with optimal gate setup.


What they posted on Facebook below;

We ran some tests on this aftermarket Landcruiser turbocharger before removing and installing an Eclipse. From the attached graph, this is horrible!

High turbine back pressure is not good. No consideration in regards to turbine back pressure has gone into the design of this turbocharger. High pressure will restrict flow holding heat in the cylinders and given the right conditions, contributes to catastrophic failure due to excessive loads on the thrust bearing along with shaft over speed. If you want to know where the “choof choof” noise (compressor surge) comes from when lifting off the accelerator, this is the cause. During surge, the bearing experiences high hammering load effects even on deceleration surge. Exhaust valves will also be held open at these pressures, which is detrimental to both engine reliability and performance.

Ideally turbine backpressure of 1:1 is optimal, meaning the same pressure in the intake manifold as the exhaust manifold. But this is rarely seen. Industry standard threshold is a 1.4:1 ratio or less (42psi turbine/30psi compressor etc). Low turbine back pressure is just one of our criteria at Eclipse Turbo Systems when designing our range of turbochargers, but an important one. We design all wheels and volutes in house and test extensively before approval, and moving into the production stage. This Eclipse turbocharger recorded 1.25:1 EMP/IMP as compared to 2.7:1 EMP/IMP previously on the same vehicle.

We encourage customers to consider this important aspect before making a turbocharger purchase. If you’re not sure what your current turbocharger’s turbine back pressure is, ask the manufacturer or test it. If your turbocharger experiences “choofing” or “deceleration surge” there is a high probability it is experiencing the associated high turbine back pressure causing damage to the turbocharger.

 

[Dougal]

Interesting read from the guys at Eclipse Turbos. Reinforces that fact I don't care to much about boost pressure. I'm much more interested in monitoring EMP and getting the lowest EMP:IMP possible which goes hand in hand with optimal gate setup.

It's all bollocks though. Bollocks intended to sell turbos with oversize turbines that don't produce enough boost.

Turbo surge on pedal release has nothing to do with turbine drive pressure. It doesn't float exhaust valves either. Further. The ratio of drive pressure to boost is not static. It varies with EGT, varies with RPM and ambient conditions.

Tune with an AFR gauge. If you drop boost to gain performance you will likely melt or crack pistons.

Also. Where did they get an 80psi pressure trace from? The oil pump? An exhaust has to be blocked to give that much pressure. Worst I've personally recorded was 60psi and that was an experiment to see how bad it could be.

 

[KiwiDingo]

It's all bollocks though. Bollocks intended to sell turbos with oversize turbines that don't produce enough boost.

I now have one of these turbos and making boost has never been an issue.

Turbo surge on pedal release has nothing to do with turbine drive pressure. It doesn't float exhaust valves either.

ummm.... I've personally tested this and can assure you it definitely was the cause of my constant surge on pedal release.

Tune with an AFR gauge. If you drop boost to gain performance you will likely melt or crack pistons.

Exactly why you should tune by EGT instead of only focusing on AFR.

 

[Dougal]

I now have one of these turbos and making boost has never been an issue.

ummm.... I've personally tested this and can assure you it definitely was the cause of my constant surge on pedal release.

How did you determine that?

Exactly why you should tune by EGT instead of only focusing on AFR.

Nope. Because EGT doesn't measure in-cylinder temperatures and many people put short EGT probes in cold locations.

AFR is better always. It also separates the turbos that can from the turbos that can't.

 

[KiwiDingo]

It's actually pretty easy if you know how to setup the gate to change EMP while still keeping the boost pressure exactly the same. Can get some pretty serious off throttle surge with it setup to make crazy EMP but when setup the other way with lower EMP I can't get it to surge at all. That's all the evidence I need.

Lol I couldn't really care less about the AFR. I still measure it to see how it's effected by setup changes but I put more weighting on the EGT for overall tune.

 

[Dougal]

It's actually pretty easy if you know how to setup the gate to change EMP while still keeping the boost pressure exactly the same.

That's bollocks though. You cannot drop drive pressure (which determines drive power) and maintain compressor power.

 

[KiwiDingo]

You most certainly can! I guess I have the magic touch It's pretty simple really once you realise how it all works.

 

[Dougal]

You most certainly can! I guess I have the magic touch It's pretty simple really once you realise how it all works.

I assure you I know how it works. Each turbine has a fixed line of power vs expansion ratio and inlet. You cannot wastegate (which reduces the expansion ratio and turbine flow) without reducing turbine power output.

Lots of people have claimed they can. They were all wrong.