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- #21
sorry edited it was a typo... 
Tech Article: How to put 60 series axles under a 40 or 55 series
- Thread starter dieselcruiserhead
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- #22
General front axle cronology:
(Same for all LC in the USA)
68 - and earlier: worthless, discard/recycle.
A) '68ish switched from Ball-and-Claw type CV joints to Birfields. Axles were coarse spline 10splines if I remember correctly. Coarse splines at all points in the axles including where axle meets diff. The side gears from these diffs are interchangable so you can use these 3rd members with a 1970 or later diff. 4.10 gear ratio. These are a PITA axle to build into a stronger because they have a few oddities so I would sell or dump these.. I have a set anyone want them??
B) 1970-later. They were still coarse splined at the end of the birfield where it meets the hub, but made fine spline elsewhere. Diffs for the most part remains the same from here through mid '78 and 1970 and later stuff is fine. Drum brakes, 4.10 gear ratio. Usually had weaker Warn or some sort of afterarket hubs installed at dealer compared to later Aisins but there are a few very rare Aisins. They came with factory flange-plates which are the strongest but keep front axle spinning all the time. This is all coarse spline regardless so 'strength' and this axle should not be associated at least compared to C + D below. this is a great potential builder axle even though it has weaker parts. You use the housing and diff and inner axles only on these models (unless you want drum brakes for some reason) and toss the rest and use parts from a mini truck or later cruiser to get disk brakes and bigger birfields.
C) 1976, switched to disk brake fronts, has "small" knuckle pattern for steering arms, slightly smaller birfields than later 1979 and later models so still slightly weaker. 4.10 gear ratio. Usually had weaker Warn hubs or other aftermarket (but usually Warns) installed at dealer compared to later Aisins but there are a few Aisins. In mid-late '78, there are a few pinions in the diffs that were changed to a stronger fine spline making them stronger versus earlier models. All diffs still interchangable between 1970 and later models.
D) 1979, switched to bigger knuckle pattern, bigger birfield which would remain through 1989-1990 through end of 62 series that is also the same in minitrucks. Used a larger knuckle pattern for steering arms, also the same for mini trucks. Is the strongest. Switched to faster 3.73 axle gear ratio.
E) FJ60 models only: same as D but 2.75" wider.
F) 70 series models, same as D but I think 30 mm wider so about an inch wider?
G) FJ62 models only. Same as E but pinion angle was rotated up about 8 degrees towards T-case making for a "factory cut and turn" (still barely enough for a spring over but usable and better than no cut and turn). Gear ratio was returned to 4.10 but they have fine spline count so stronger. Also, axle is factory trussed, and disk brakes have a little wind scoop for better cooling. Best of this type of axle made, followed closely by FJ60, 70 series, and 1979 and later FJ40/55 axles.
Then axles we redesigned and most previous models (except for 70 series) were discontinued with introduction of 80 series Land Cruisers.
Random interchange info: Mini truck axles have disk brakes and all components bolt onto anything from B or later. Bigger mini truck / 60 / 62 birfs will fit into axles B or C with a little grinding on the inside of the axle. Mini truck disks are not vented however so slightly less powerful. I blieve 60 series disks will bolt onto mini truck disk brake hub and larger calipers will also interchange. Mini truck steering knuckles also share larger knuckle pattern of FJ60s. So steering arms for mini truck pattern also works for D and later LC axles. No parts from C series steering knuckles 'interchange" with B series knuckles (ie you can't simply bolt disks on) without taking ALL steering items and complete knuckle and bolting to B axle. I hope this makes sense. When you remove B knuckles and drum brakes, almost all of it probably goes in the trash unless you want to give to someone who really likes drum front brakes
(Same for all LC in the USA)
68 - and earlier: worthless, discard/recycle.
A) '68ish switched from Ball-and-Claw type CV joints to Birfields. Axles were coarse spline 10splines if I remember correctly. Coarse splines at all points in the axles including where axle meets diff. The side gears from these diffs are interchangable so you can use these 3rd members with a 1970 or later diff. 4.10 gear ratio. These are a PITA axle to build into a stronger because they have a few oddities so I would sell or dump these.. I have a set anyone want them??
B) 1970-later. They were still coarse splined at the end of the birfield where it meets the hub, but made fine spline elsewhere. Diffs for the most part remains the same from here through mid '78 and 1970 and later stuff is fine. Drum brakes, 4.10 gear ratio. Usually had weaker Warn or some sort of afterarket hubs installed at dealer compared to later Aisins but there are a few very rare Aisins. They came with factory flange-plates which are the strongest but keep front axle spinning all the time. This is all coarse spline regardless so 'strength' and this axle should not be associated at least compared to C + D below. this is a great potential builder axle even though it has weaker parts. You use the housing and diff and inner axles only on these models (unless you want drum brakes for some reason) and toss the rest and use parts from a mini truck or later cruiser to get disk brakes and bigger birfields.
C) 1976, switched to disk brake fronts, has "small" knuckle pattern for steering arms, slightly smaller birfields than later 1979 and later models so still slightly weaker. 4.10 gear ratio. Usually had weaker Warn hubs or other aftermarket (but usually Warns) installed at dealer compared to later Aisins but there are a few Aisins. In mid-late '78, there are a few pinions in the diffs that were changed to a stronger fine spline making them stronger versus earlier models. All diffs still interchangable between 1970 and later models.
D) 1979, switched to bigger knuckle pattern, bigger birfield which would remain through 1989-1990 through end of 62 series that is also the same in minitrucks. Used a larger knuckle pattern for steering arms, also the same for mini trucks. Is the strongest. Switched to faster 3.73 axle gear ratio.
E) FJ60 models only: same as D but 2.75" wider.
F) 70 series models, same as D but I think 30 mm wider so about an inch wider?
G) FJ62 models only. Same as E but pinion angle was rotated up about 8 degrees towards T-case making for a "factory cut and turn" (still barely enough for a spring over but usable and better than no cut and turn). Gear ratio was returned to 4.10 but they have fine spline count so stronger. Also, axle is factory trussed, and disk brakes have a little wind scoop for better cooling. Best of this type of axle made, followed closely by FJ60, 70 series, and 1979 and later FJ40/55 axles.
Then axles we redesigned and most previous models (except for 70 series) were discontinued with introduction of 80 series Land Cruisers.
Random interchange info: Mini truck axles have disk brakes and all components bolt onto anything from B or later. Bigger mini truck / 60 / 62 birfs will fit into axles B or C with a little grinding on the inside of the axle. Mini truck disks are not vented however so slightly less powerful. I blieve 60 series disks will bolt onto mini truck disk brake hub and larger calipers will also interchange. Mini truck steering knuckles also share larger knuckle pattern of FJ60s. So steering arms for mini truck pattern also works for D and later LC axles. No parts from C series steering knuckles 'interchange" with B series knuckles (ie you can't simply bolt disks on) without taking ALL steering items and complete knuckle and bolting to B axle. I hope this makes sense. When you remove B knuckles and drum brakes, almost all of it probably goes in the trash unless you want to give to someone who really likes drum front brakes
Last edited:
PabloCruise
SILVER Star
dieselcruiserhead said:
Awesome - thanks Andre. This is exactly the stuff I was wondering about.
Isn't it true the FJ-55's in the US wore ASCO (Aisin) hubs?
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Good post. Andre-are you certain about the FJ62 front housing having a different factory caster angle? If so, on a SOA FJ60, the 60 would be far preferable and might not require a cut and turn. I'm even wondering about a SOA FJ40 using an FJ62 front axle housing. Any thoughts?
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- #25
I did some measuring and even with my long ass NV4500 at the time the FJ62 factory "cut and turn" still wasn't enough to do the job. So yes it would help and probably better than a factory 60 axle but not enough. I can't remember but it is either 8 or 10 degrees pointed towards the t-case, barely enough.. Last time I did it on a 60 I think it was near 12 degrees pinion angle. That said you are probably fine regardless. But again especially for people doing spring overs themselves including the welding and are a reasonably competent welder, I really do not think it is that much more difficult to do a cut and turn when doing the SOA. Even if doing it yourself.. The bitch is tearing down the axle of course but especially if you are doing any sort of birf or locker or gearing change at the time, might as well just do the cut and turn. It is spelled out with photos pretty clearly in the tech section.. hope it helps
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- #26
PabloCruise said:
Good question.. I have seen the Aisin / Ascos on FJ55's more commonly strangely enough but I was under the assumption that most dealers were installing the hubs, not Toyota, so I'm not sure why FJ55's would have aisins versus other models. There are only very minimal differences between FJ40 and FJ55 axles (compensation for sway bars mostly, and a few other very small differences). So I would think most would have had the warns in the mid-late 70s as well. Otherwise, those Warn hubs are actually quite a bit weaker than the aisins. they are also more prone to breakage from hub bolts loosening up because they don't have cone washers like the Aisins. Best, Andre
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
On the Aisins and FJ55s-In the 76-78 era when the Birfield was fine spline, but slightly longer than the standard Birfields used 79-90, the FJ55s came with special "long" Aisin hubs, where the body of the hub is about 1/4 inch longer. I have one of these somewhere in the parts stash and it is an oddity. I was going to use it on my FJ40 but then just converted to FJ60 parts instead.
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- #28
cool
Cruiserdrew said:
wow.
great basic thread on axles. thanks a lot. (really great b/c it's not too longwinded...)
i'm tryin to decide on what axles to use for my soa, want to get rid of the coarse splined stuff in my 72 axles definitly, so the 62 axles seem like a good way to go.
any idea on average cost for a set of 62 axles?
i won't get robbed (i never have enough money to spend too much, ha ha) but i don't want to screw somebody if i buy them way too cheap.
malphrus
great basic thread on axles. thanks a lot. (really great b/c it's not too longwinded...)
i'm tryin to decide on what axles to use for my soa, want to get rid of the coarse splined stuff in my 72 axles definitly, so the 62 axles seem like a good way to go.
any idea on average cost for a set of 62 axles?
i won't get robbed (i never have enough money to spend too much, ha ha) but i don't want to screw somebody if i buy them way too cheap.
malphrus
PabloCruise
SILVER Star
wesintl said:
Wes, are those yours?
Can you throw some measurements up?
How much could you outboard the springs on the FJ60 axle without the tires hitting the leaves at full lock?
I'm thinking about slinging an FJ60 axle under my front end when I do power steering as part of the prep for a Dana 60. I'd like the springs to be wide enough for the D60 so that's just less work later on.
I'm thinking about slinging an FJ60 axle under my front end when I do power steering as part of the prep for a Dana 60. I'd like the springs to be wide enough for the D60 so that's just less work later on.
depends on tires man, and steering stops. I don't hit my springs with 37s and i'm outboarded 1.25" per side. The tires do get close. That is not enough outboard for full width, I would say just get the D60 up front and do it right first time around, or you could get a d44 full width on the cheep for time being.
I don't want to go SOA or full width yet for funding reasons, but I hate having the parts lying in a pile for years without being used. I have the parts to throw the FJ60 front in with power steering and outboarded springs already. The Dana 60s won't be going in for at least a couple more years because I have to build the rear and purchase the front still.
Plus I want to get the power steering and spring outboarding done while I have a samurai guy with a shop willing to trade fab help/shop space for a set of axles
Plus I want to get the power steering and spring outboarding done while I have a samurai guy with a shop willing to trade fab help/shop space for a set of axles
- Thread starter
- #36
72cruiser said:
I probably wouldn't pay much more than $500 or $600 for a set of 62 axles if it were me. In the rear, it is basically the same as a 60 axle (minus the gearing of course).. I paid $200 for my front and thought that was a good deal, I think $250-$300 is pretty good. I have seen them up to $400 for the front alone.... Plus shipping if shipping is expensive.. 62's are starting to rot out pretty commonly so they are not too hard to find IMO...
- Thread starter
- #37
Advent said:
Maybe check on pirate, I don't know much about full width axles. Proffitts sells a neat spring hanger for 1 ton swaps onto cruisers, for what its worth.. Here is a link to it.. http://www.proffittscruisers.com/parts/outboard.html This looks like the easiest setup to me...
Also, because the axles will be so wide you still shouldn't hit leafs, you may rub though depending on wheel height and tire size (big, right?)...
I also never understood why people use hummer rims on full size for the longest time.. Because they have something like 7" of backspacing.. So even 66" wide axles can be brought in quite a bit to get back to normal. I think the rim diameter is 16.5" or something like that...
Stock hummer rims will not clear chevy steering (they hit the cast steering arm)
And the hubs stick out wayy far. My H1 rims are recentered on stock D60 front (67" wide) and I am down to 82" wide in the front with 40" Iroks..
I had to go with Driveflanges because the warn hubs were tasting rocks too often..
And the hubs stick out wayy far. My H1 rims are recentered on stock D60 front (67" wide) and I am down to 82" wide in the front with 40" Iroks..
I had to go with Driveflanges because the warn hubs were tasting rocks too often..
- Thread starter
- #39
good to know Mace
Panzer
SILVER Star
Just so I am clear on this
WMS - WMS (approx, due to mm measurements)
40 axle - 55"
Mini 55"
60/62 58"
80 63"
Is that about right?
While we're at this anyone know of a link that has the spring length and end to eye to end measurements of the various toyota springs?
WMS - WMS (approx, due to mm measurements)
40 axle - 55"
Mini 55"
60/62 58"
80 63"
Is that about right?
While we're at this anyone know of a link that has the spring length and end to eye to end measurements of the various toyota springs?
