Normal Turning Radius? (2 Viewers)

[jamesurq]

69 fj40 - saginaw power steering setup
LOUSY turning circle.
Worse than my Suburban was..

Is that typical?
Is there a test that can be recommended to see if there's something physically wrong with the system that might be causing it?

Thanks!

 

[GRM]

What wheels/tires & wheel spacers are you running?

 

[jamesurq]

Stock steelies with 33x10.5's No spacers.

 

[Mace]

Jack it up and see if you can get lock to lock based on the steering stops.

 

[brian]

how many turns of the steering wheel from lock to lock?
how long is the pitman arm?

 

[shawnfj40]

pictures help. I have seen/done many things with the steering on 40's. lets take a look

 

[Howard705]

ONe direction or both? if ne needs drag link adjusted to get travel both directions. Sounds like pittman too short. See if stops (bolts) on knuckles make contact at lock both directions.

 

[jamesurq]

Thanks for the initial suggestions. I'll take a look tonight and report back.


Sent from my iPhone

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

I can't speak to what's "normal" but I've always felt my turn radius was pretty wide for a truck this small. That said, I have a non-stock, power steering setup (Saginaw).

When I first got the truck, the steering had been set up improperly. The steering box has a total of 4 turns, lock to lock. I had 2.5 turns to the right, and 1.5 to the left. As a result, I made 2 lane wide U-turns going left, and would bottom out against the steering lock on the right. Even centered, the turning radius is wide, but I can successfully navigate a "standard" U-turn now.

In short, as others have said, make sure you have an EVEN number of turns from center, in both directions, and that you are contacting the steering stops in both directions as well.

 

[jamesurq]

Ok here we go. 2.5 turns to the left. 1.5 to the right.

Sent from my iPhone

 

[jamesurq]

Sent from my iPhone

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Yep, this is the exact thing that happened to my truck. Same Saginaw PS conversion as well...I wonder why this is common?

This isn't part of your turn radius problem, but: your steering box is too far forward on the frame - most likely, there's a spud shaft running through the crossmember. This was apparently a pretty common way to do things in the 70's and 80's, but it puts undue stress on both the frame horn, and the rear seal of the steering box. This makes leaks from the steering box pretty common. Just something you might want to address at some point. You can mount the box flush with the crossmember (or even recessed into it a bit). This allows you to get rid of the spud shaft, along with the unwanted pressure on the frame and steering box. Of course, this also means cutting out your mounting plates and re-welding...so it's up to you...

As for the steering - this is more easily solved, usually. The way I did it was:

1. Center the truck's WHEELS (not the steering wheel). Your steering wheel will probably be crooked, or at least still not evenly divided left to right.
2. Disconnect the drag link from the pitman arm. The steering wheel and box are now disconnected from the steering.
3. Center the steering - so you have 2 turns to the left and right. Again, steering wheel might be crooked, but make sure the box is centered - the pitman arm should point straight back, close to parallel with the frame horn.
4. At this point, I disconnected the steering shaft from the steering box, centered the steering wheel, and reconnected the shaft to the box.

At this point, the pitman arm, steering box, and steering wheel should be centered - two turns left, two turns right, pitman arm straight back

5. Loosen the clamps on the drag link, and adjust the length of the drag link so that it can re-attach to the pitman arm. Basically, change the length of the drag link by screwing the ends in/out to reconnect it. DO NOT move the pitman arm.

6. Bolt everything back up (Pitman arm, drag link, tie rod clamps, etc.) to restore steering.
7. Now, you should have the wheels straight, and even turns in both directions. At this point you want to "max out" the steering to one side. Then, adjust the steering stops so that the contact just a TOUCH before the box maxes out. This will prevent the box from destroying itself by stopping the motion of the wheels before the box maxes out. You'll adjust the front stop on one side, and the rear on the other.
Then, max out the steering the other way, and adjust the opposite stops.

You can tweak steering wheel alignment afterward by further adjusting the drag link. You'll probably also want to get the alignment checked, but if you don't mess with the tie rod, it may not be necessary.

There's probably an easier way to do it - but this way worked for me! To simplify, it's: Center the steering box, Center the Steering wheel, then adjust the steering drag link to compensate for the new distance between tie rod and pitman arm.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

FYI: Here's my thread:

The Clustertruck Rides Again - Refurbishing a 1975 Chevota

Power Steering was pg. 5-8

Messing with the steering assembly to fix the off-centered wheel starts on pg. 27. Unfortunately I didn't go into a ton of detail.

 

[jamesurq]

Thanks a ton for that explanation!


Sent from my iPhone

 

[roadstr6]

It looks like your setup is what is limiting your turning radius and not the stops themselves. From what I can see you aren't hitting the stops like it is now. Maybe need a longer pitman arm?

 

[Augusts96]

Wow, thanks a lot for the explanation RWBeringer4x4! Time to get stuck into my s***house turning circle

 

[Augusts96]

Any tips for getting the drag link off the pitman arm without any extravagant tools? Bastard just wont come loose and I'm on a tight budget

 

[bikersmurf]

Loosen the nut, hit both sides of the pitman arm where the TRE goes through at the same time. A couple wacks and it should come free. I've also rested a 10 lb hammer on one side and hit the other side with a large ball peene hammer. If it doesn't come free soke it in some penitrating oil over night and try it again. It is more about a sharp sound hit than a hard hit.

 

[bikersmurf]

A scout II pitman arm is about 10.5" long and it could fix a lot of your problems without re welding you box mounts.

 

[Augusts96]

EDIT:

All good so far, however even with the steering linkage disconnected I am only getting 1.5 turns left and 1.5 turns right from the center. Could this be because I have a different steering setup and I am actually working on an HJ45 troopy?

It was converted to P/S by a previous owner which I'm not a fan of and am considering swapping someone with the old steering setup. Currently have the P/S belt out.