interesting. Here’s a pic. There’s always a chance I’m backing off the wrong thing (NMT 2.5-3 turns) but if so they must not need backed off because I’m on my 4th corner.
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
interesting. Here’s a pic. There’s always a chance I’m backing off the wrong thing (NMT 2.5-3 turns) but if so they must not need backed off because I’m on my 4th corner.
I tend to agree. An easy out or other device should work to extract the old keys and then just replace them with bolts. That mech is also using anti-seize on stuff most people use loctite on, so you have to take these “tutorials” more as a quick look at how involved something will be and whether or not you’re up for it.
edit: hmmm, except for the fact that you’re not supposed to take them out.
Last edited:
And the fact they are not just a threaded bolt
Yeah, maybe the part on my LC is available to replace them if you can without losing pressure on the whole system.
RET2
SILVER Star
Do yourself a big favor, please search as there was a parts blow up of the valve assembly, it's not as simple as one would think. There are beveled mating surfaces that seal fluid movement.
gaijin
GOLD Star
Here's a diagram I posted a while ago of what the shutter valves in the stabilizer control of the KDSS system look like:
NOTE: The KDSS system is a hydraulic system that operates at somewhere around 700psi. If the shutter valves are loosened more than 3.5mm and any pressure is lost, your only recourse is to have a Toyota dealer recharge the system with a Special Service Tool (SST).
FURTHER NOTE: The SST required to recharge the KDSS system is NOT available at every dealer. There are only a few in the entire dealership network. If required, a dealer must request the SST and wait for an available one to be delivered.
Bottom line: DO NOT LOOSEN THE SHUTTER VALVES MORE THAN 3.5mm
HTH
RET2
SILVER Star
Big thanks @gaijin !!Here's a diagram I posted a while ago of what the shutter valves in the stabilizer control of the KDSS system look like:
NOTE: The KDSS system is a hydraulic system that operates at somewhere around 700psi. If the shutter valves are loosened more than 3.5mm and any pressure is lost, your only recourse is to have a Toyota dealer recharge the system with a Special Service Tool (SST).
FURTHER NOTE: The SST required to recharge the KDSS system is NOT available at every dealer. There are only a few in the entire dealership network. If required, a dealer must request the SST and wait for an available one to be delivered.
Bottom line: DO NOT LOOSEN THE SHUTTER VALVES MORE THAN 3.5mm
HTH
Appreciate it. Mine aren't damaged though. I think all of this probably explains why the shop in that video just welded nuts onto the keys. Risky, a little, minimal pain if it works, yep.
Well bad news for me. My suspension / alignment shop mechanic attempted to turn my valves with a standard 5mm hex key and said they wouldn't budge. He threw in the towel and stated that he didn't want to be responsible for stripping them or breaking off the wrench inside.
Looks like I will take it up to my trusty local mechanic and see if wants to take a crack it! Sucks because I have a brand new suspension kit and UPC's and nothing I can do about it.
Looks like I will take it up to my trusty local mechanic and see if wants to take a crack it! Sucks because I have a brand new suspension kit and UPC's and nothing I can do about it.
RET2
SILVER Star
It might help to try cleaning out the hex opening with a dental pic to insure full depth seating and use a new quality key. It took one member 2 weeks of soaking with a well known penetrating oil before he was successful. Good luck
I just took a dental pic to mine. It felt like it was breaking some crust free but who knows. It was covered in penetrating oil and I didn't wipe it off. I figured I would just leave covered in oil while I was scraping around the valve. I am dropping it tomorrow morning for my mechanic to try and get them to turn. I wish I would have done this before I ordered my suspension parts. Let this be a warning to all who plan on adding a lift. Check you KDSS valves before you make any purchases. It's actually hard to believe that backing out these valves 2.5-3 turns actually does anything to relieve pressure in the system? Not to beat a dead horse but why did Toyota design such a stubborn system with cheap parts. Crazy to think that I could be trading my 200 in for a 2016 model over 2 little screws? WTF Just doesn't make sense. Toyota should totally recall this. I would think there be a way to attach a device to the above shown "bleeder plug" to hold pressure on the system so we can totally remove this valves and replace them with new stainless bolt with bolt heads. Wish me luck. This may be my last shot at a 2" suspension lift. 
Last edited:
bloc
SILVER Star
The bleeder plug is only to remove air from a high point in the system. The threads aren’t designed to seal anything once the fitting is loosened, only let air and fluid flow out. Fluid and pressure are added at the quick disconnect fittings on the outside of the drivers side frame rail.
Even if you could hold pressure at the bleeder plug everything would come blasting out as the shutter valves are loosened past their sealing surfaces.
I agree this system wasn’t properly tested by toyota. If they had it would be glaringly obvious they needed to use different materials to avoid problems. That said it is well documented here what needs to be done to keep the system from having problems.. though this is often too little too late for vehicles bought used. Yet another reason I’m militant about avoiding corrosion when people post here asking “is this too much rust?” on a potential purchase. It is cancer. Avoid at all costs.
Even if you could hold pressure at the bleeder plug everything would come blasting out as the shutter valves are loosened past their sealing surfaces.
I agree this system wasn’t properly tested by toyota. If they had it would be glaringly obvious they needed to use different materials to avoid problems. That said it is well documented here what needs to be done to keep the system from having problems.. though this is often too little too late for vehicles bought used. Yet another reason I’m militant about avoiding corrosion when people post here asking “is this too much rust?” on a potential purchase. It is cancer. Avoid at all costs.
Last edited:
RET2
SILVER Star
It's "turns" not mm. They should not be opened more than 3 turns period unless you want to enrich your local Toyota dealer.I just took a dental pic to mine. It felt like it was breaking some crust free but who knows. It was covered in penetrating oil and I didn't wipe it off. I figured I would just leave covered in oil while I was scraping around the valve. I am dropping it tomorrow morning for my mechanic to try and get them to turn. I wish I would have done this before I ordered my suspension parts. Let this be a warning to all who plan on adding a lift. Check you KDSS valves before you make any purchases. It's actually hard to believe that backing out these valves 2-3.5mm actually does anything? Not to beat a dead horse but why did Toyota design such a stubborn system with cheap parts. Crazy to think that I could be trading my 200 in for a 2016 model over 2 little screws? WTF Just doesn't make sense. Toyota should totally recall this. I would think there be a way to attach a device to the above shown "bleeder plug" to hold pressure on the system so we can totally remove this valves and replace them with new stainless bolt with bolt heads. Wish me luck. This may be my last shot at a 2" suspension lift.
gaijin
GOLD Star
The FSM indicates 2-3.5mm
Due to thread pitch, one turn is about 1mm, so 3 turns gets you right in the sweet spot.
HTH
So what is the consensus if the valves are seized? No dice? Or roll the dice...use floor jacks like described above to disconnect sway bars to allow coilover removal? Or roll the dice, install the lift, if she's leaning post-lift...force to re-equalize somehow? Curious about these other means and methods that are mentioned but not really described/discussed. I searched looking for the answers but didn't stumble on the right thread or I didn't use the right search words. Cheers.
My mechanic took a swing at the KDSS valves today. He used a Matco 5mm drive bit and loosened the first one! Went for 2 of 2 and no dice! His bit broke off inside of the hex head. He was luckily able to remove the driver head and made another attempt with a different 5mm drive bit. He heated the valve up slightly but was still unable to break the second one free. Sooooo close. He sent me away with a can of this spray and told me to come back on Monday for Round #2.
He told me he would be very surprised if this did not work to free the rust. Told me it was the best stuff he has ever used.
He told me he would be very surprised if this did not work to free the rust. Told me it was the best stuff he has ever used.
Last edited:
Wire wheeled, oiled over and over, mine are seised, twisted two snap on keys. Rolled the dice, Put new suspension in anyway, was a bitch. Yup 2” to 3” lean. Took to local dealer. They want To sell me a new system to a almost 4K cost. I’ll try welding on some nuts or even chisel them out. I have nothing to lose at this point.
Hand held Torch seemed to work. My guy heated them up a few times with extreme heat. Didn’t watch the entire process at. He called me to to me they got the 2nd one free and it was all easy from there on out. Once they are both backed out the appropriate 3 turns everything went like clock work after that. Just made sure to coat them with ample marine grease so they are protected in the future. Good luck don’t give up. Don’t take it Toyota. They don’t have a clue what they are doing!
bloc
SILVER Star
There are rubber o-rings in the valve block about 3/4" above the bottom face, holding back 400+ psi of oil, so somewhere somehow there is a limit on the amount of heat that should be put into the valve to free the screws.
Thing is.. if they won't free, you may end up replacing it anyway.
The nice thing about welding is it's a ton of heat in a short period of time, "heat shocking" the screw more than the valve block.. which is exactly what you need to do to get it to move. But this does require someone with some experience..
Thing is.. if they won't free, you may end up replacing it anyway.
The nice thing about welding is it's a ton of heat in a short period of time, "heat shocking" the screw more than the valve block.. which is exactly what you need to do to get it to move. But this does require someone with some experience..
