Yep no reason that wouldn't work
Landtank MAF. (3 Viewers)
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I just got in from doing a few runs with the truck. I didn't hook up my OBDII data logger as there was no need to.
The truck dumps fuel at around 3700 RPMs and the AFRs drops to 10.0. It was quite obvious and I apologize for not realizing it when I did the change and am Glad that Scottryana has brought this to my attention.
The short explanation is that the ID of the bore is too small.
I'm going to call one of my machine shops locally and get his assistance in modifying the housing I have to correct this problem. I might have things worked out by Tuesday depending on both our schedules.
For those wanting to dyno their truck I really don't see the point now but after I work out a change it would be great seeing runs on several platforms.
The current run of housings will be halted tomorrow and then resumed once a fix is determined.
The truck dumps fuel at around 3700 RPMs and the AFRs drops to 10.0. It was quite obvious and I apologize for not realizing it when I did the change and am Glad that Scottryana has brought this to my attention.
The short explanation is that the ID of the bore is too small.
I'm going to call one of my machine shops locally and get his assistance in modifying the housing I have to correct this problem. I might have things worked out by Tuesday depending on both our schedules.
For those wanting to dyno their truck I really don't see the point now but after I work out a change it would be great seeing runs on several platforms.
The current run of housings will be halted tomorrow and then resumed once a fix is determined.
Thanks for figuring out the issue. Looking forward to see what comes out of this.
NLXTACY
Wits' End
Interesting. Maybe the reason I've been so happy with the mod is I still have the Gen1 without the sleeve.
1973Guppie
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ditto, never saw a reason to mess with the gen 1 I have......
Thanks for taking the time to figure this out. Definitely looking forward to picking up the revised version!
The smaller i.d. would maybe explain the power band moving so far down the rpm range, no? I did the super charger after the ltmaf, but the maf affected off the line performance for sure. If i read the dyno sheet right, you pick up a bunch right off idle, and lose it up top. I don't know if that's really a bad thing at the range i usually run in. I know on my bikes, chasing peak dyno numbers rarely translates to the most streetable power band.
NLXTACY
Wits' End
This is what I expected which is why I opened up my Throttle Body a bit to compensate
The very beginning of the dyno chart doesn't really give you the clearest results, because try as hard has he can the dyno operator has to hit the throttle the same time at the same rpm's and with the same speed, really the repeatability is in the last 90% of the dyno where it is WOT, that way you know it isn't effected by a person doing the test.
Also why it is close to impossible to get back to back results in closed loop. Unless you had some kind of automated engine control.
Also why it is close to impossible to get back to back results in closed loop. Unless you had some kind of automated engine control.
Absolutely. Your not seeing the same dump and during open loop it's running an AFR of around 12.5 which is ideal for making power.
But the GenI required the sensing line removed to keep fuel trims in line during idle so the ID is actually a little too big.
I over compensated with the change and it effected the high end. Somewhere in the middle should be ideal. I just need to find it.
NLXTACY
Wits' End
But too wide is relative no? I have the widened TB and will soon be installing the SC now that the motor is broken in. I have zero data to support. I just know more air equals mo powa
More air only means more powa if the fueling is correct. In the case of the GENI the fueling is correct and more powa is made. In the case of the GENII it's running rich and powa decreases even though the same air is consumed.
FastCarGuy
SILVER Star
Guessing its gonna be a modified sleeve for GENI? How do I remove the sleeve I've got?
It sounds like Rick is going to devote the time to find and fix the problem so the next version will probably be Gen III, but Rick I still think there is more to it than just running rich. If you look at my dyno graph I start running rich at 2700 and it isn't until 4200 that the power really drastically falls off. Thanks for looking into this.
Once I get the AFRs dialed in I can then look at the timing pull in depth.
I can assure everyone that the running rich and pull was not in the GENI housings.
And those with the sleeves, a simple saw cut down the middle with a hack saw will allow it to fall out. But I wouldn't do that yet as I need to see what needs to be done before committing to a solution for older versions. I have no plans on leaving anyone behind.
If i can find one local I'll have mine dyno'd for kicks. Just to add a data point with a s/c'd setup i suppose. But I also have the ems exhaust, so who knows what I'd see. I guess it would be interesting to see if I get the same drop in AFR.
Just as another data point the LT MAF housing was run on a turbo'd truck at 9psi of boost and it was still seeing 10.X:1 AFR's at WOT. I would expect to see the same thing on a supercharged truck.
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The MAF with no data for the producer to back up any sort of performance improvement is really no different to his front axle alignment plates, which also have no data behind them to show fixing anything that is a supposed problem, except to the producer of them.
There may be some benefit with exhaust, and a tuning device, to fix the fuel and timing issues that will prevent more power, and the average improvement that has to be made for someone to feel any difference is 5% for sensitive in tune people and up to 8-10% for most people. This is a well documented fact in the tuning world
With no mapping voltage, recorded, and no air flow testing, the bore of the item wont kick in at a set rpm, and measuring the timing, and the knock sensor values with the proper equipment, i think its fair to say, based on the details so far, and the manufacturers reluctance to date to test it properly this device has not been tested properly, before being released to market.
This device wont make + 5,8,10% on its own, ( though maybe it seems - that amount) and the MAF is limited, which is why the vehicle has open and closed loop, so it can cover a wider range.
Installing a tuning device and a MAP sensor would make more sense, for more power, and thats what we normally do.
I will be interested to see if after testing, there is no shown gain, and in fact losses, wether all those who purchased in good faith, with no lab or real scanner and dyno proof, witll be able to get a refund?
There may be some benefit with exhaust, and a tuning device, to fix the fuel and timing issues that will prevent more power, and the average improvement that has to be made for someone to feel any difference is 5% for sensitive in tune people and up to 8-10% for most people. This is a well documented fact in the tuning world
With no mapping voltage, recorded, and no air flow testing, the bore of the item wont kick in at a set rpm, and measuring the timing, and the knock sensor values with the proper equipment, i think its fair to say, based on the details so far, and the manufacturers reluctance to date to test it properly this device has not been tested properly, before being released to market.
This device wont make + 5,8,10% on its own, ( though maybe it seems - that amount) and the MAF is limited, which is why the vehicle has open and closed loop, so it can cover a wider range.
Installing a tuning device and a MAP sensor would make more sense, for more power, and thats what we normally do.
I will be interested to see if after testing, there is no shown gain, and in fact losses, wether all those who purchased in good faith, with no lab or real scanner and dyno proof, witll be able to get a refund?
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Yup, but on tested trucks the stock MAF produced AFRs of 8.6.
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