How much slip is ok on a typical Toyota driveshaft?

Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
im looking for opinions and experiences here. My front 3 link will require 2.125” of driveshaft slip from full bump to full droop. That leaves only 2.5” of splines engaged. Will that be ok or do I need a long slip?
image.jpg
 

cruisermatt

ランドクル62!
SILVER Star
Joined
Jul 22, 2012
Messages
6,637
Location
Orlando Florida
The Cruiser shafts have about 3" of slip to them. So you are well within the safe range.
I usually shoot for having the diameter of the splined section as my amount of engagement at full extension. So around an inch or so?
 

65swb45

Elder Statesman
Supporting Vendor
 
Joined
Apr 14, 2004
Messages
24,690
Location
818-953-9230
The Cruiser shafts have about 3" of slip to them. So you are well within the safe range.
I usually shoot for having the diameter of the splined section as my amount of engagement at full extension. So around an inch or so?
Interesting theory. Assuming full droop will occur on an ascent, when traction is really at a premium, and maximum torque is often applied, having 'an inch or so' of spline contact hardly seems safe, and will likely lead to the female end of the slip yoke exploding.

I don't think I'd even attempt to build a linked powertrain using stock length slip yokes.
 

cruisermatt

ランドクル62!
SILVER Star
Joined
Jul 22, 2012
Messages
6,637
Location
Orlando Florida
Interesting theory. Assuming full droop will occur on an ascent, when traction is really at a premium, and maximum torque is often applied, having 'an inch or so' of spline contact hardly seems safe, and will likely lead to the female end of the slip yoke exploding.

I don't think I'd even attempt to build a linked powertrain using stock length slip yokes.
I’m up in the middle of the night sleepwalking, so hopefully I don’t butcher this too bad.

You actually don’t really need a lot of driveshaft slip at all with a linked suspension.

The axle moves in an arc with the upper and lower links acting as the sides of a parallelogram, so assuming his pinion and transfer case outputs are both near the middle of the vertical separation points on the axle and frame respectively, the driveshaft can become a sort of third line down the middle of that parallelogram. If done correctly that is.

Theoretically if you had your geometry perfect you could have zero slip yoke at all, but I wouldn’t risk that with compliance in transfer case/motor mounts, suspension bushings etc.

I’m thinking about it spline engagment more though (which is what the original question really was) and maybe you’re right and my memory is off, but IIRC there’s really only 3-3.5” of spline engagement at full DS compression, that being said I have kinda pushed the boundary on his I think, my last front setup having as little as 3/4” spline engagement at full DS extension ( :eek: not on purpose!) and I didn’t have an issue, but only with 3FE power. OP has triple power.
 

Mace

rock scientist..
Staff member
s-Moderator
 
 
 
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
21,435
Location
Las Vegas
im looking for opinions and experiences here. My front 3 link will require 2.125” of driveshaft slip from full bump to full droop. That leaves only 2.5” of splines engaged. Will that be ok or do I need a long slip?
View attachment 1799651

That shaft is way past where I would consider safe extension.
You have to remember that there is a taper at each end that is about 1/4"


I don't think I'd even attempt to build a linked powertrain using stock length slip yokes.
You actually don’t really need a lot of driveshaft slip at all with a linked suspension.
I would not have a single problem setting up a linked suspension with stock 40 slip shafts. I am doing it on the Scout build. However, There is nothing specifically about a linked system that allows for a 3" slip, driveshaft. It all depends on how you set up the links.


Depending on the link end style and the links, you could easily get enough deflection to pull that front end apart and break the female splined portion. Even more so with HP and gearing.

You will likely be good with a minitruck splined slip joint. Easy peasy to adapt.
 
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
Thanks for the comments. I’m still on the fence on the front. There will be 400hp in this mini truck so I probably should do it right.

Side note on the the rear 4 link, the shaft only needs 3/4” slip through the full range. When I built this I was really focused on roll axis and low ride height with a secondary focus on anti squat; pinion range of motion was really an afterthought.
 

ferg

 
Joined
Aug 26, 2006
Messages
698
Location
918
Still. Cruisers don't have 400hp. You need to go outside the Toyota stuff and go bigger.
 

RustyNailJustin

 
 
 
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
1,732
Location
Western CO and Southern Oregon
Its kinda like buying harbor freight tools. Run it to you realize they suck and end up getting Snap-On.

You will eventually split that female side slip, carry a spare, you will end up changing it in a mud or ice hole and that should make the replacement decision easy.
 
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
Its kinda like buying harbor freight tools. Run it to you realize they suck and end up getting Snap-On.

You will eventually split that female side slip, carry a spare, you will end up changing it in a mud or ice hole and that should make the replacement decision easy.
Thanks for the advise, this is what I’ve been considering using for a long slip, any thoughts on it?
PowerTrain Industries - 1343-20L
 
Joined
Sep 20, 2004
Messages
2,402
Location
here
I have a ?, should not the note on the green tape say full stuff ????? & if so then your full stuff mark should be right about the front edge of the green tape.

It seems, without being there to cycle the suspension that the drive should work if you get the ride height position on the slip set properly.

Really depends on how much compression you get on the up cycle ??? That Full droop line looks about where you want ride height maybe another 1/2 inch compressed if that leaves enough for full stuff, you really have to set it at full stuff, dont set it at full stop, let the slip have another 1/4 inch or better of compression left after the suspension hits full stuff. then drop it out and see where it ends up.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
I have a ?, should not the note on the green tape say full stuff ????? & if so then your full stuff mark should be right about the front edge of the green tape.

It seems, without being there to cycle the suspension that the drive should work if you get the ride height position on the slip set properly.

Really depends on how much compression you get on the up cycle ??? That Full droop line looks about where you want ride height maybe another 1/2 inch compressed if that leaves enough for full stuff, you really have to set it at full stuff, dont set it at full stop, let the slip have another 1/4 inch or better of compression left after the suspension hits full stuff. then drop it out and see where it ends up.
I wasn’t clear I guess, full stuff is where the slip yoke is bottomed out on the shaft or inserted all the way, not even allowing for that 1/4” you suggested (completely cover green tape). The droop line illustrates how far the slip will come apart as the axle droops. The pic shows the last point the splines touch, even tho you’d hope it never gets there cause it would come apart. The caliper is attempting to show how much engagement is left at droop. Hope that clairifys things.

On another note, further to some of the strength concerns noted above, Landcruiser u joints are basically the same size as 1350 joints which are stock 1 ton, and toy slips are 1.3” compared to 1.34” on the long slips Tom Woods sells. This makes me confident it will work as long as there is enough slip engagement, hence the orginal question.

My only experience in this is a stock slip on the rear of my fj43 with a 4.8 LS which makes 275-285 hp when new (which it isn’t). That slip isn’t far off the spline engagement situation I’m asking about right now although it is harder to measure slip range on leaf sprung suspension. This slip stretchs out as traction increases with compressing suspension while climbing.

Anyway, I’m at the point, based on this discussion, where I think I could make it work, and carry a spare slip yoke as suggested, but I might as well do it right and order this long slip PowerTrain Industries - 1343-20L. I plan on using 2.5” .83 tube as well.
 

Mace

rock scientist..
Staff member
s-Moderator
 
 
 
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
21,435
Location
Las Vegas
Just a fyi. Toyota joints are similar in size to 1310 Spicer joints. Not 1350..

They are however significantly stronger than 1310 joints...
 
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
Just a fyi. Toyota joints are similar in size to 1310 Spicer joints. Not 1350..

They are however significantly stronger than 1310 joints...
Help me understand this please. Internet searches say:

1310: 3.219 cross, 1.062 cap
1350: 3.622 cross, 1.188 cap
Identify Part by Dimension (J300P)

Here’s what I just measured:
369E5983-056E-4B60-B957-B8B065444859.jpeg
8C8CA3B5-E582-488A-A8E5-D4FE96F032C6.jpeg


It looks to me like this cruiser joint has the same cross measurement with a slightly bigger cap as compared to a 1350? Are my google searches wrong?
 

cruiseroutfit

Supporting Vendor
Moderator
 
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2003
Messages
8,907
Location
Utah
@cruiseroutfit can you fill in the blanks here??

Thanks!
On the Toyota LC joints? There are actually quite a few :D

We stock 5 common aftermarket Japanese joint part numbers that roughly 20 OEM numbers supercede into. The largest being the UJ36030 which is the common "4 speed" joint. It has 32mm caps, 94mm on the cross. The smallest of them (not including the steering and PTO u-joints we stock) is the UJ36011, commonly known as the "3 speed" joint. It has 28.5mm caps, 78.5mm caps.

As for the slip. The more spline you can have engaged, the better. It's well within reason that a factory slip-joint will work however long-spline ones are so easy to source that it might be worth considering just to take the guess work out of your setup.

UJ35050.jpg

Part# UJ35050 - $232.50 - Cruiser Outfitters
 
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
266
Location
Grande Prairie AB
There are differences in toyota U joints. They have made toyota/1310 conversion joints for years.
1310 to Toyota Conversion Ujoint, U-Joint, Universal Joint (TDI-1310-TOYUJ)
Even Cruisers have about 3 different U joints that I can think of.
Let me get some measurements for you.
On the Toyota LC joints? There are actually quite a few :D

We stock 5 common aftermarket Japanese joint part numbers that roughly 20 OEM numbers supercede into. The largest being the UJ36030 which is the common "4 speed" joint. It has 32mm caps, 94mm on the cross. The smallest of them (not including the steering and PTO u-joints we stock) is the UJ36011, commonly known as the "3 speed" joint. It has 28.5mm caps, 78.5mm caps.

As for the slip. The more spline you can have engaged, the better. It's well within reason that a factory slip-joint will work however long-spline ones are so easy to source that it might be worth considering just to take the guess work out of your setup.

View attachment 1806418
Part# UJ35050 - $232.50 - Cruiser Outfitters
Thanks for the great info guys, I knew there is a bunch of different yoke bolt patterns but had no idea about the different u joints. It turns out all of the yokes and shaftes I’ve been collecting are the larger ‘4 speed u joint’. I have already ordered the long slip I linked earlier in this thread because it is the same larger u joint.

719423F9-0D73-48D4-A876-F67F7FE126DD.jpeg
 
Top Bottom