Help me understand the appeal. (1 Viewer)

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I didn't read all the responses and this thread has likely gone to hell already, as these topics tend to do, but here's my $0.02:

My frame of reference is old toyota trucks. I've had mini-trucks, 60, 62, 2 3rd gen 4runners, 2 80s, LX570 ranging in years from 1984 to 2010 ranging in miles from 164k at the lowest to 340k at the highest. Yes, they require maintenance and so does everything else on the road. To me, the biggest difference is that if you do the maintenance on time with quality parts, you will have ZERO trouble. I have wheeled with lots of other vehicles and seen lots of mechanical failures on the trail that were not due to abuse/wheeling (electrical gremlins, broken timing chains, etc) and due to wheeling (grenaded transfer case, broken tie-rods, etc). A well-maintained land cruiser (or any Toyota truck) simply will not leave you out to dry like this.

I've had two old yotas that I drove to the point they were rusting quite literally to pieces, i.e. you could see the road going by through the rockers. Both were still 100% mechanically reliable and I would have hopped in and driven across three states with nothing but a credit card for gas.

My main gripe with the 200 is the starter location makes field maintenance (or home maintenance for that matter) simply stupid. This is a shortsighted (insert european/domestic make) design, and very un-land cruiser-like. I honestly like the 200 the least of all of them, and prefer old and dumb. But we tow a camper now and my wife likes the LX.

If you don't tend to beat up your truck off road, or if you're rarely in a position where some downtime and a trip to the shop would be a big hassle, other brands definitely make more sense. If nothing else, purely from a parts cost and fuel cost perspective. Genuine toyota parts cost 2-3x as much as GM and LC parts cost more than other toyotas.
 
Just go buy a 2019-2020 X5 or X7 and you’ll be a happy camper cruising down the road, just Make sure to purchase the longest warranty before it expires. I don’t care what anyone says about them, I’ve owned a variety of Bimmer flavors since 2004+- and never once been stranded or had any of them in the shop for a month. Ok, I had a 330ci down for a week because of a bad turbo(waiting parts) and a 2014 X5 out for two days having new rear air suspension put in(under warranty)
but I was given a free Bimmer loaner. Heater core issues are outliers and never experienced this with any of mine and I’ve owned a 11 bimmers. My buddy has been driving his X5M for the last 5yrs 120k miles…no issues and that’s a high maintenance V8. B58 engines are great however.
 
My main gripe with the 200 is the starter location makes field maintenance (or home maintenance for that matter) simply stupid. This is a shortsighted (insert european/domestic make) design, and very un-land cruiser-like. I honestly like the 200 the least of all of them, and prefer old and dumb. But we tow a camper now and my wife likes the LX.

If you don't like where the starter is on the 200 you'll really hate doing a starter job on the 100...

To the main topic...

There is a major shift that has been going on for years in the auto industry. Brands are shifting more and more to assemblers rather than manufacturers. So failure rates are becoming more to do with the component vendor than the manufacturer. Take ZF. They supply transmissions to number of makes. That volume can amortize the development and testing cost over a much larger scale. In theory this results in more thoroughly developed product than could be done by a single manufacturer. And... if there is a defect, it would be seen across all makes using the component. I feel this has greatly narrowed the quality gap between brands.

The differentiator then becomes performance and features. While I think Toyota is really good with the 150 / 200 platforms offroad performance they have been very much lacking in features, at least on the interior. For some, the Toyota quality reputation excuses the mediocrity. For others, they'd rather spend time in a more modern interior.

Toyota has definitely capitalized on their quality reputation. But seeing the Tundra fail to meet Consumer Report's recommended buy criteria doesn't speak very highly of the brand. That and their mixed-message marketing, both claiming to be all-in on Overlanding yet killing off the icon of their Overland models. It makes me wonder the mission clarity of those steering the ship. Say what you want about Jeep/Ram, they know who they are and continue to deliver products true to that brand.
 
If you don't like where the starter is on the 200 you'll really hate doing a starter job on the 100...

To the main topic...

There is a major shift that has been going on for years in the auto industry. Brands are shifting more and more to assemblers rather than manufacturers. So failure rates are becoming more to do with the component vendor than the manufacturer. Take ZF. They supply transmissions to number of makes. That volume can amortize the development and testing cost over a much larger scale. In theory this results in more thoroughly developed product than could be done by a single manufacturer. And... if there is a defect, it would be seen across all makes using the component. I feel this has greatly narrowed the quality gap between brands.

The differentiator then becomes performance and features. While I think Toyota is really good with the 150 / 200 platforms offroad performance they have been very much lacking in features, at least on the interior. For some, the Toyota quality reputation excuses the mediocrity. For others, they'd rather spend time in a more modern interior.

Toyota has definitely capitalized on their quality reputation. But seeing the Tundra fail to meet Consumer Report's recommended buy criteria doesn't speak very highly of the brand. That and their mixed-message marketing, both claiming to be all-in on Overlanding yet killing off the icon of their Overland models. It makes me wonder the mission clarity of those steering the ship. Say what you want about Jeep/Ram, they know who they are and continue to deliver products true to that brand.

You speak the true true. Same exact problem in tech. And finance even. Huge consolidations everywhere and "last stage" capitalist stuff.
The Tundra wastegate issue though, while not sure if component vendor or San Antonio assembly is responsible, really turned some heads.
Toyota is in a v v precarious position right now, and id wager they are WAYYYY out of their comfort zone.
And turmoil at the top is getting worse, even since ive first commented about that months ago.

Just go buy a 2019-2020 X5 or X7 and you’ll be a happy camper cruising down the road, just Make sure to purchase the longest warranty before it expires. I don’t care what anyone says about them, I’ve owned a variety of Bimmer flavors since 2004+- and never once been stranded or had any of them in the shop for a month. Ok, I had a 330ci down for a week because of a bad turbo(waiting parts) and a 2014 X5 out for two days having new rear air suspension put in(under warranty)
but I was given a free Bimmer loaner. Heater core issues are outliers and never experienced this with any of mine and I’ve owned a 11 bimmers. My buddy has been driving his X5M for the last 5yrs 120k miles…no issues and that’s a high maintenance V8. B58 engines are great however.


And there are very reliable eras from both Merc and BMW, seems they knew what they were doing in the past.
But to @OregonLC s point, they have suffered greatly from cost reduction trends and oddball parts that were cost cut to death.
As far as Automobiles, they really have seen the least inflation overall of any industry i can think of. A 5 series is still like $60k for the last 20 years.
And its obvious where the savings have come from. Everything is cheaply made.

The B58 though i think has been a major milestone for BMW (a badge i really would lick ever since watching Pierce Brosnan remote a 740 to kill bad guys).
And in my perfect world, theres no other chassis i want to toss around than an EV M coupe. Those boys know how to build a suspension.
Im not sure how thats ever going to work though with current battery tech and the weight involved.
 
164 replies to someone who is questioning why he owns a Land Cruiser.

It should be one reply: buy something else and GTFO.

That’s it. All of this other s*** is such a trolling waste of f***ing time.

Bye bye.

Oh my bad, let me start over.

HAAALLP, my unicorn indestructible tank broke down!

Is that better?

Go ahead and delete/move this to the trash chit chat board, and also do me a favor and make a technical support page the 200 desperately needs.
 
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164 replies to someone who is questioning why he owns a Land Cruiser.

It should be one reply: buy something else and GTFO.

That’s it. All of this other s*** is such a trolling waste of f***ing time.
.....that YOU read every post of 😆
 
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.....that i read every post of 😆
I’ve really enjoyed this thread, actually.

@AnyMal, your writing style is genuine and hilarious. I’m glad you’re sticking with the truck. I don’t see you regretting it.
 
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That’s it. All of this other s*** is such a trolling waste of f***ing time.
Cancel culture definition. It would have taken zero effort to decide you're not interested in the topic and move on.

This is actually a reasonable discussion. Apropos to the current time. And it has stayed out of the dirt, avoiding ad homenim attacks.

A healthy group can discuss the 200's shortcomings openly, including what's better about the competition. The last thing we need to be is a Toyota-or-die fanboy club where real issues aren't debated.
 
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I’ve really enjoyed this thread, actually.

@AnyMal, your writing style is genuine and hilarious. I’m glad your sticking with the truck. I don’t see you regretting it.

Aaahh geez, youre the second person to tell me that. Yall gonna make me leak coolant out of my eye seals.

Even though i use zero punctuation!

(Im youngish for the forum and realized years ago i couldnt spell anymore, turned off all autocorrect on all devices years ago, and always a bit lazy)
 
164 replies to someone who is questioning why he owns a Land Cruiser.

It should be one reply: buy something else and GTFO.

That’s it. All of this other s*** is such a trolling waste of f***ing time.

Bye bye

Now this post has been deleted? Speaking of cancel culture.
 
After a little thinking I realized that this forum is, largely, dedicated to modifying 200’s to make them “better”, isn’t it? And , therefore, isn't questioning what is in need of improving a vital component of “improving”?
 
I deleted it so as not to hurt people’s feelings.
Hurt people’s OR was it done to stop humiliating youself? Another OverGold sticking his foot in his mouth again.

Remember the time when you deleted ALL your posts doubting and insulting me after being embarrassed by me? I do. 😂
 
I don't have to read magazine articles or watch YT to believe that the LC 200 is reliable.
I personally put over 60K miles on one in a year and only did required maintenance (oil and filter changes and tires).
Everything worked, still no rattles or squeaks. It currently has 94K and its a 21HE.
Went 150K in my 5th GEN 4Runner before having to repair a wheel bearing.
Extremely reliable vehicles.
 
I deleted it so as not to hurt people’s feelings.

Its okay man, no hard feelings. Ive done a lot of self work myself.
Can anyone tell?

We had a really nice discussion and i got to know a lot of folks from it. Discussion and views are healthy for the board, and its long term success too. This thread took off with thousands of views, surely the ad revenue was popping. I never meant to offend anyone anyway. And this was honestly one of the more mature threads. I enjoyed it.

Ive made numerous friends here now, and im a loud mouth sometimes. But many of my best friends IRL started out with serious conflicts. You know its true similar personalities often clash on first interactions.

So even you and I could be pals eventually.

Psych!!! 😂😂😂
 
I don't have to read magazine articles or watch YT to believe that the LC 200 is reliable.
I personally put over 60K miles on one in a year and only did required maintenance (oil and filter changes and tires).
Everything worked, still no rattles or squeaks. It currently has 94K and its a 21HE.
Went 150K in my 5th GEN 4Runner before having to repair a wheel bearing.
Extremely reliable vehicles.


That's some crazy miles on a 2021, congrats. I had two FJC's, a 2008 Trails Team and a 2012 Trails Team and both needed a front wheel bearing in the first 40K miles which I thought was nuts.
 

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