Help me understand the appeal. (1 Viewer)

[rscoleman]

Must have missed this thread first time around. I just got back from Grocery store in 25 year old Toyota T100 and after reading this I thought about maintenance and things I have had to do to keep it on road. Batteries, starter, clutch, windshield wiper motor, bushings on all sorts of suspension components, rear axle seals twice, brakes just pads, AC controller in dash, recharge of refrigerant, timing belt every 6 years along with water pump, oil change every 3000mile or once a year, new fabric cover for door panels. Last but not least a full repaint. In all that time I have never once been stranded on side of road in my T100. I am hoping my LC will fair as well for next 20years. Keeping vehicles for long term is a commitment. It is going to cost you 500 to 7300 dollar any given year based on what needs work. If that is not your thing trade in and out every 2 to 5 years for new vehicles. I bought my LC with idea I would keep it 20 years. I used it for road trips, towing, getting groceries. I am hoping that it stays rattle free and reliable but I will pay for maintenance as needed to keep it that way.

 

[Wicked0ne18]

LC is one of my dream rides and my ultimate warrior that will take me anywhere anytime and back. Smiles on my face every time I get in. My kids n wife have fell in love with the beast. I’ll never get rid of it. Bought it used at 60k and still going strong. Put two big trips to ouray and Telluride and Moab. Planning to make many more trips and can’t see myself in any other vehicle except my 200. Have taken me to places I’ve been dreaming of going if I ever bought the 200. The 200 has given me the life style that I’ve been yearning for.

Just take her out and enjoy it. Got lucky so far the 200 treating me good. Everything I have dreamed of.

Fack yesterday it did give me a heart attack. Couldn’t start and that was due to bad battery. Replaced battery n she’s good to go! These modern vehicles act weird and scary as heck when battery is out. All kind of flickering and noises.

@AnyMal hopefully all ur 200 issues are behind you and you can just really enjoy her.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

These modern vehicles act weird and scary as heck when battery is out.

Reminds me of an incident a couple years ago. My mom was visiting and parked her Mazda CX5 in my two-car garage, nose in. The other garage stall was occupied by my trailer, which was in a state of disassembly and not easy to remove from the garage.

Lo and behold, the Mazda's battery dies. "No problem," I think. I grab my jumper cables and quickly realize that they're not long enough to reach from my LX (parked outside), to the hood of the Mazda. I figure I'll just put the Mazda in neutral, push it out into the driveway, and jump it there. Then I go looking for the hand break... oh, interesting, it's a button instead of a lever. Surely it's a mechanical linkage and pushing the button will release the hand break, right? Right? Right? ... ... Wrong. The hand break doesn't release with a dead battery in the car. So now the car is stuck in the garage and I have no way to get it out of there.

Had to resort to the real old school trick of putting my own battery in the Mazda, starting the car, removing my battery while the car was running, and re-connecting the Mazda's original battery. All that because the damn hand break is electronic.

 

[AnyMal]

Reminds me of an incident a couple years ago. My mom was visiting and parked her Mazda CX5 in my two-car garage, nose in. The other garage stall was occupied by my trailer, which was in a state of disassembly and not easy to remove from the garage.

Lo and behold, the Mazda's battery dies. "No problem," I think. I grab my jumper cables and quickly realize that they're not long enough to reach from my LX (parked outside), to the hood of the Mazda. I figure I'll just put the Mazda in neutral, push it out into the driveway, and jump it there. Then I go looking for the hand break... oh, interesting, it's a button instead of a lever. Surely it's a mechanical linkage and pushing the button will release the hand break, right? Right? Right? ... ... Wrong. The hand break doesn't release with a dead battery in the car. So now the car is stuck in the garage and I have no way to get it out of there.

Had to resort to the real old school trick of putting my own battery in the Mazda, starting the car, removing my battery while the car was running, and re-connecting the Mazda's original battery. All that because the damn hand break is electronic.

Ill say this and hopefully don't piss anyone off...

The ONLY point that goes to the 16+ LC vs LX debate outside of the LX grille styling in my eyes is that it kept the manual parking brake.
They are otherwise mechanically identical.
I am so appalled that the Lexus got the electronic brake just because its a lexus.
It is NOT convenient or safe at all in an actual emergency and is a total pain in the ass to calibrate.
Ask me how i know....

The worst part is that in a real brake failure, instead of just yanking the handle in the LC at full drum pad force, you have to DOUBLE PULL the E paddle switch in a specific timing. Even a hold doesn't apply it fully. A hold actually disengages the auto park set feature.

So a single pull doesnt even apply the full motorized cable tension. Its actually mind bogglingly stupid.

 

[Tex68w]

Reminds me of an incident a couple years ago. My mom was visiting and parked her Mazda CX5 in my two-car garage, nose in. The other garage stall was occupied by my trailer, which was in a state of disassembly and not easy to remove from the garage.

Lo and behold, the Mazda's battery dies. "No problem," I think. I grab my jumper cables and quickly realize that they're not long enough to reach from my LX (parked outside), to the hood of the Mazda. I figure I'll just put the Mazda in neutral, push it out into the driveway, and jump it there. Then I go looking for the hand break... oh, interesting, it's a button instead of a lever. Surely it's a mechanical linkage and pushing the button will release the hand break, right? Right? Right? ... ... Wrong. The hand break doesn't release with a dead battery in the car. So now the car is stuck in the garage and I have no way to get it out of there.

Had to resort to the real old school trick of putting my own battery in the Mazda, starting the car, removing my battery while the car was running, and re-connecting the Mazda's original battery. All that because the damn hand break is electronic.

You sir need a Noco Boost pack jumper.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

You sir need a Noco Boost pack jumper.

I bought a GB70 at the end of last summer. Great thing to have!

 

[LCH21]

Ill say this and hopefully don't piss anyone off...

The ONLY point that goes to the 16+ LC vs LX debate outside of the LX grille styling in my eyes is that it kept the manual parking brake.
They are otherwise mechanically identical.
I am so appalled that the Lexus got the electronic brake just because its a lexus.
It is NOT convenient or safe at all in an actual emergency and is a total pain in the ass to calibrate.
Ask me how i know....

The worst part is that in a real brake failure, instead of just yanking the handle in the LC at full drum pad force, you have to DOUBLE PULL the E paddle switch in a specific timing. Even a hold doesn't apply it fully. A hold actually disengages the auto park set feature.

So a single pull doesnt even apply the full motorized cable tension. Its actually mind bogglingly stupid.

I absolutely agree. Electronic parking brakes are an abomination and one of the stupidest ideas ever put in a car. Scotty Kilmer hates them too. My Macan has one and it is God Awful! A real PITA to change the rear brake pads. I had to buy a fancy scan tool to place the calipers in "service position" and had to do a couple of other things to make sure the air suspension calibration did not get out of wack. Just because something can be done does not mean it should be. Electronic parking brakes are a prime example.

 

[AnyMal]

I absolutely agree. Electronic parking brakes are an abomination and one of the stupidest ideas ever put in a car. Scotty Kilmer hates them too. My Macan has one and it is God Awful! A real PITA to change the rear brake pads. I had to buy a fancy scan tool to place the calipers in "service position" and had to do a couple of other things to make sure the air suspention calibration did not get out of wack. Just because something can be done does not mean it should be. Electronic parking brakes are a prime example.

I was lucky in that the e system on the LX is still drum based and not an actuated piston caliper design.
Those are beyond dumb to service. You have to do a whole techstream sequence for example on the RX to fully de spool the motor and be able to get in there properly.

Im a bit of a nut, obviously, so i like ran practice drills to get the muscle memory right when i did my own brake job as an amateur. Just in case.
Other problem is its right behind the only place my phone mount could really go... tucked away in the least ergonomic position.

 

[Itsky]

relevant to the discussion, Chris Harris has some thoughts: Chris Harris talking about the 200 series - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/chris-harris-talking-about-the-200-series.1305514/

 

[AnyMal]

relevant to the discussion, Chris Harris has some thoughts: Chris Harris talking about the 200 series - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/chris-harris-talking-about-the-200-series.1305514/

This is what, the millionth time this has happened? Some thread were in and a YT vid manifests out of thin air directly on topic at the exact same time?

Posted 3 hours ago lol Spooky…

Conclusion is: im doing it very very wrong. Buy a 15 year old one and use it off road and get it filthy. Got it.

 

[Wicked0ne18]

Reminds me of an incident a couple years ago. My mom was visiting and parked her Mazda CX5 in my two-car garage, nose in. The other garage stall was occupied by my trailer, which was in a state of disassembly and not easy to remove from the garage.

Lo and behold, the Mazda's battery dies. "No problem," I think. I grab my jumper cables and quickly realize that they're not long enough to reach from my LX (parked outside), to the hood of the Mazda. I figure I'll just put the Mazda in neutral, push it out into the driveway, and jump it there. Then I go looking for the hand break... oh, interesting, it's a button instead of a lever. Surely it's a mechanical linkage and pushing the button will release the hand break, right? Right? Right? ... ... Wrong. The hand break doesn't release with a dead battery in the car. So now the car is stuck in the garage and I have no way to get it out of there.

Had to resort to the real old school trick of putting my own battery in the Mazda, starting the car, removing my battery while the car was running, and re-connecting the Mazda's original battery. All that because the damn hand break is electronic.

Dang!!! My lc was in same kind position. Lucky my brother in law got one of those portable battery jumper and he also had a tundra battery around.

 

[Madtiger]

Just enjoy the thing….

 

[grinchy]

Conclusion is: im doing it very very wrong. Buy a 15 year old one and use it off road and get it filthy. Got it.

Yep. This is the way.

 

[Supra Turbo]

Ill say this and hopefully don't piss anyone off...

The ONLY point that goes to the 16+ LC vs LX debate outside of the LX grille styling in my eyes is that it kept the manual parking brake.

In my eyes its a few more things starting with non-touch screen nav, stock wheel size, integrated steps and lower front/rear bumpers. Im somewhat take it or leave it on AHC too, though I can see some of its appeal. The Lexus badge is a bit flashy also, at least in my experience.

P.S. Don't pour hatorade on me. Just from my perspective.

 

[AnyMal]

In my eyes its a few more things starting with non-touch screen nav, stock wheel size, integrated steps and lower front/rear bumpers. Im somewhat take it or leave it on AHC too, though I can see some of its appeal. The Lexus badge is a bit flashy also, at least in my experience.

P.S. Don't pour hatorade on me. Just from my perspective.

Nah. Not at all.

You’re absolutely right.
I forgot the horrible 21” package that i had to get for my ultra luxury trim. Zero tires, and made me have to rush a wheel/tire purchase bc of how poor they rode.

Touchscreens for me are immediate deal breaker though. Im not lifting my arm, bumbling around, and having a greased smudged up display all the time just to sound cool on paper.

There are zero advantages, but after tesla, everyone gave up and went touch.

They are comically far away from you too if your 6’ or above too from your seating position. Nevermind missing your choice due to turbulence.

Ill die on this hill, the LX joystick is great. If you want to talk UI, nothing is more intuitive than cross directional navigation up down left right select. Nothing.

Contextual button changes are bottom of the barrel for user experience in sw design.

Think of old remotes vs apple tv for example. Zero learning curve, never takes youre eye off the screen. Compeletely adaptable to any visual layout.

 

[Supra Turbo]

Think of old remotes vs apple tv for example. Zero learning curve, never takes youre eye off the screen. Compeletely adaptable to any visual layout.

I don't know what apple tv is and the only apples I buy are the ones that grow on trees ... so I guess that answers that

 

[40Man]

They are all machines, and some will be better than others. Toyota in general, and the Land Cruiser, have been shown to have a higher build quality/standard than basically any other vehicle on the road. The current models have a lot of electronics and will likely have more long term failures than their predecessors. Having owned many domestics growing up due to a somewhat racist dad that was anti-Japanese brand having grown up during WWII, even he changed his tune after we finally got out first Toyota. To succeed, Toyota HAD to do things better, and they did.

There are some good domestic products, and quite frankly, with how often Ford turns out new powertrains for the F150, I am surprised they are as reliable as they are.

Toyota has stuck to a more tested model, which has left us enthusiasts in the cold without the newest tech, but the tradeoff is better reliability. And Land Cruisers have been consistently reliable for over 70 years.

I've seen a number of Toyotas hit 400k miles in my family, and never had one go to the scrap heap, they were all sold. I saw Mazda branded Ranger and a Dodge 600 both go to the scrap heap with less than 100k miles.

From a pure economic standpoint, a Tacoma is going to hold value better than any other mass produced vehicle. I've sold a number of high mileage Tacomas, and have been very close to getting back what I paid for them new. The 15 Tacomas were selling used for what you could have bought them for new before we had crazy inflation.

LCs hold up value well compared to luxury type SUVs, but will still take a huge hit compared to a Tacoma or 4Runner.

The 200 is great for enthusiasts that off road, but for those leaving stock and driving on the road, the 4Runner will likely be as reliable and have better resale.

 

[AnyMal]

They are all machines, and some will be better than others. Toyota in general, and the Land Cruiser, have been shown to have a higher build quality/standard than basically any other vehicle on the road. The current models have a lot of electronics and will likely have more long term failures than their predecessors. Having owned many domestics growing up due to a somewhat racist dad that was anti-Japanese brand having grown up during WWII, even he changed his tune after we finally got out first Toyota. To succeed, Toyota HAD to do things better, and they did.

There are some good domestic products, and quite frankly, with how often Ford turns out new powertrains for the F150, I am surprised they are as reliable as they are.

Toyota has stuck to a more tested model, which has left us enthusiasts in the cold without the newest tech, but the tradeoff is better reliability. And Land Cruisers have been consistently reliable for over 70 years.

I've seen a number of Toyotas hit 400k miles in my family, and never had one go to the scrap heap, they were all sold. I saw Mazda branded Ranger and a Dodge 600 both go to the scrap heap with less than 100k miles.

From a pure economic standpoint, a Tacoma is going to hold value better than any other mass produced vehicle. I've sold a number of high mileage Tacomas, and have been very close to getting back what I paid for them new. The 15 Tacomas were selling used for what you could have bought them for new before we had crazy inflation.

LCs hold up value well compared to luxury type SUVs, but will still take a huge hit compared to a Tacoma or 4Runner.

The 200 is great for enthusiasts that off road, but for those leaving stock and driving on the road, the 4Runner will likely be as reliable and have better resale.

Yeah, that was one thing I was going to say too. Ultimately if size isnt a need, a Taco or 4R will last a long long time as well.

There is definitely some unicorn piss in the LC that even Chris Harris likes the taste of.

Im a big body luxury SUV fan, so really theres no other place to be, but for a non modding non wheeling customer a family 4runner is hard to beat for the price. Again roughly 2/3 the cost of the LC.

If we could get barebones LCs in USA though, i doubt the 4R would even sell! Lol

 

[Madtiger]

Touchscreens for me are immediate deal breaker though. Im not lifting my arm, bumbling around, and having a greased smudged up display all the time just to sound cool on paper.

There are zero advantages, but after tesla, everyone gave up and went touch.

Not sure about you, but LC touchscreen is great! I don’t need to interact with it much. I mount my iPhone on AC vent next to it. Because LC has hard buttons for most functions, the touchscreen works good when i need something.

Im a big body luxury SUV fan, so really theres no other place to be, but for a non modding non wheeling customer a family 4runner is hard to beat for the price. Again roughly 2/3 the cost of the LC.

One could argue that 4runner and especially Tacos 3rd party support is FAR superior to LC. LC aftermarket off-road support is very limited.

 

[04UZJ100]

Not sure about you, but LC touchscreen is great! I don’t need to interact with it much. I mount my iPhone on AC vent next to it. Because LC has hard buttons for most functions, the touchscreen works good when i need something.

One could argue that 4runner and especially Tacos 3rd party support is FAR superior to LC. LC aftermarket off-road support is very limited.

There is no argument there - there are vastly more options and support for the 120/150 platforms than there are for the 200. Simply due to the fact there are far more insta-bros rocking them......due to their price point.