Haltech Control of the A442f (1 Viewer)

[moremazda]

Highly not recommended.

Amen

 

[alia176]

This is a fascinating thread.

Just a newbie question here but given the fact that Haltec has mapped the 343F, and the OP is wanting a Haltec so wouldn't it be simpler (more muscle, less tweaking/wiring/brain tingling) to switch from A442 to A343F? I totally get if the OP is the journey vs the destination type of guy

Again, just a newb wanting to understand this mobetta.

 

[nickolai]

Highly not recommended.

Are they no good? Interesting as they're distributed in Australia by Wholesale who have a great rep (nomad valve body)

 

[moremazda]

This is a fascinating thread.

Just a newbie question here but given the fact that Haltec has mapped the 343F, and the OP is wanting a Haltec so wouldn't it be simpler (more muscle, less tweaking/wiring/brain tingling) to switch from A442 to A343F? I totally get if the OP is the journey vs the destination type of guy

Again, just a newb wanting to understand this mobetta.

Well not really. These things are really very simple from a control perspective and the effort to swap to a different trans just adds work.

The primary reason for this is to understand how much better the motor could perform under modern electronics, and document a pretty big hole that I see which is aftermarket ECU control of the transmission.

Are they no good? Interesting as they're distributed in Australia by Wholesale who have a great rep (nomad valve body)

They are fine I'm sure. They just have a super low value. They are really expensive and don't truly offer anything more than what the haltech (or any number of ecus) can do. For an 8 speed or a 10 speed, they might be worth the extra money, but for a simple 4 speed like the 442f/343f/4lxx/6lxx/ not really.

 

[nickolai]

Well not really. These things are really very simple from a control perspective and the effort to swap to a different trans just adds work.

The primary reason for this is to understand how much better the motor could perform under modern electronics, and document a pretty big hole that I see which is aftermarket ECU control of the transmission.

They are fine I'm sure. They just have a super low value. They are really expensive and don't truly offer anything more than what the haltech (or any number of ecus) can do. For an 8 speed or a 10 speed, they might be worth the extra money, but for a simple 4 speed like the 442f/343f/4lxx/6lxx/ not really.

Ah gotcha. Think the fancy screen sucked me in!

 

[PIP]

HGM/Compushift has a horrendous user interface. You have very little control over what you can tune. Back when we used them they had a fundamental hardware flaw in the Aisin control which they acknowledged, said they would fix then later decided it was not a big enough market to keep their promise or waste their very important time on.

Very difficult company to work with. I think their products are aimed at the inexperienced. People that think it's great you don't have to hook up a laptop. Those that don't know what normal tuning software looks like and why you need a decent screen and control over every parameter.

Megasquirt/Tuner studio is hands down superior to compushift.

 

[alia176]

Well not really. These things are really very simple from a control perspective and the effort to swap to a different trans just adds work.

The primary reason for this is to understand how much better the motor could perform under modern electronics, and document a pretty big hole that I see which is aftermarket ECU control of the transmission.

How much better the motor could perform under better electronics - which in this case is a modern ECU using the existing sensors. I'm curious what will be discovered with this journey from a 30yr old ECU vs a modern programmable ECU.

Fascinating indeed.

 

[Marvelicious]

I'm definitely interested in watching this unfold. There has to be some efficiency and some power left sitting on the table.

 

[Speedytech7]

I'm definitely interested in watching this unfold. There has to be some efficiency and some power left sitting on the table.

There for sure is. I have a turbocharged 1st gen tacoma on Haltech computer as well. This is a 5000lb truck on 35" tires and with the Haltech I can make the power I want and still cruise on the highway 70-75mph at 17+mpg all day long while my stock ECU NA buddies are having trouble maintaining 16mpg

 

[alia176]

There for sure is. I have a turbocharged 1st gen tacoma on Haltech computer as well. This is a 5000lb truck on 35" tires and with the Haltech I can make the power I want and still cruise on the highway 70-75mph at 17+mpg all day long while my stock ECU NA buddies are having trouble maintaining 16mpg

that's a great feedback!!!

 

[Marvelicious]

There for sure is. I have a turbocharged 1st gen tacoma on Haltech computer as well. This is a 5000lb truck on 35" tires and with the Haltech I can make the power I want and still cruise on the highway 70-75mph at 17+mpg all day long while my stock ECU NA buddies are having trouble maintaining 16mpg

Just anecdotal and a completely different platform, but someone I know put one of those newer self-learning bolt on injection systems (don't remember what specifically) on his old 350 powered Chevy pickup and it suddenly became borderline efficient. The 1FZ isn't exactly a modern motor, but it's certainly more modern than a 350!

Honestly, if I could get around 17 consistently, I'd be thrilled. Not sure if the turbo helps or harms once you have a truly well dialed ECU, but I'm interested to find out.

 

[alia176]

Just anecdotal and a completely different platform, but someone I know put one of those newer self-learning bolt on injection systems (don't remember what specifically) on his old 350 powered Chevy pickup and it suddenly became borderline efficient. The 1FZ isn't exactly a modern motor, but it's certainly more modern than a 350!

Honestly, if I could get around 17 consistently, I'd be thrilled. Not sure if the turbo helps or harms once you have a truly well dialed ECU, but I'm interested to find out.

The turbo did improve my mileage by just a tad, as in maybe 2 mpg on a consistent basis. So basically i'm up to a whopping, maybe 14mpg now. Wooohoooo.

 

[moremazda]

Alright, so I have the base map started for the transmission and here it is for everyone to use/mull-over/critique. The timing solenoid is just setup as the A340e Accumulator Solenoid example from Haltech.......and I'm going to guess that isn't right, but I don't have access to the stuff needed to scope what the solenoid actually does.......and the 2500's are back ordered until probably February. So it'll be a little bit before I get to tuning. I took guesses at all of the maps to best replicate the shift functionality described in the FSM. There is no need for the power button or the cruise control lock up signal, these functions are incorporated into the shift mapping.

The engine side of the map is just the 1FZ base map, i didn't do anything with that, just poking around to see what the trans control needs to look like.

 

[Speedytech7]

Keep in mind with a 2500 you cannot trigger the solenoids direct from an ECU output, need a solid state (or regular) relay since they draw too much power. Or if your buy an R3 or R5 you can use the HCOs

 

[moremazda]

Keep in mind with a 2500 you cannot trigger the solenoids direct from an ECU output, need a solid state (or regular) relay since they draw too much power. Or if your buy an R3 or R5 you can use the HCOs

I was curious about this, I haven't seen where in the FSM the current draw is detailed. Do you know how much they pull? The a340e base map looks like the output are setup to drive the solenoid directly.......granted probably different part numbers between the two transmissions

 

[Speedytech7]

I was curious about this, I haven't seen where in the FSM the current draw is detailed. Do you know how much they pull? The a340e base map looks like the output are setup to drive the solenoid directly.......granted probably different part numbers between the two transmissions

Unfortunately the A340 is the same actually, they both draw over one amp when energized and the inrush current is even greater. Ithink it's like 1.35-1.5a draw. Haltech recommends driving the solenoids through a fast acting relay.

 

[PIP]

I have driven them using standard ice cube relays. There's nothing high speed about the 343 or 442 so no reason to go there. Just mount the relays in the engine bay or it'll sound like a typewriter when you drive.

 

[cruisermatt]

I have driven them using standard ice cube relays. There's nothing high speed about the 343 or 442 so no reason to go there. Just mount the relays in the engine bay or it'll sound like a typewriter when you drive.

Have you used the HSD-4? I'm looking at using a MS to run a a343 in a non-Cruiser project and it seemed like a pretty clean solution

 

[PIP]

Have you used the HSD-4? I'm looking at using a MS to run a a343 in a non-Cruiser project and it seemed like a pretty clean solution

I believe I did. Iirc it was a large item and it stopped working quickly. I used relays I had on hand and they worked well. So I used relays on all consecutive ones as it was a solid KISS solution. They're all still working fine most of a decade later.

 

[cruisermatt]

I believe I did. Iirc it was a large item and it stopped working quickly. I used relays I had on hand and they worked well. So I used relays on all consecutive ones as it was a solid KISS solution. They're all still working fine most of a decade later.

that's good intel.. was hoping to save some time with that product but if it doesn't last then it's pointless.
Relay board it is if I go auto.