ppc
M Go Blue
That last picture is the inner hub seal. This should be replaced each time the wheel bearings are serviced. That seal does not contact the areas on the hub shown in previous pictures.
Front Axle Rebuild - For FAQ (6 Viewers)
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Malleus
Far west of Siegen
Actually there are a couple of points to consider, if you want the job done correctly, including lightly greasing the seal lips before installing them; the FSM section is attached.
I'm not sure what the "edges" are in your post, but the second hub in the post appears to be really worn. If you can catch your fingernail on the groove, there's a good chance the seal will leak. Unfortunately, unlike most other seals, the inner hub seal has to be located in the rear of the disc within a tolerance that's just about equal to the lip width, so there's really no good way to move it in or out so it rides on a good journal surface. It may be time to replace the hub.
As to common mistakes, see page 10, section through the hub. This is how much grease should be in the hub; no more, no less. It's a packing to make sure the grease in the bearings doesn't sling out and run the bearings dry. Oh, and pack the bearings until the grease runs out of them. I usually go around at least twice. Make sure your hands are clean and don't bother with gloves; they're more trouble than they're worth.
Use a new C-clip. Unless yours goes on fairly tight, it's stretched and you need a new one. I don't reuse the cone washers, but that's just me.
Now is also the time to inspect the drive flange and outer driveshaft splines for wear. Before you reassemble the hub and disc on the spindle, put the drive flange on the driveshaft and, holding the shaft, try to turn the flange. It should slide on easily, but not loosely and should not rattle or turn on the shaft. Look closely at both male and female spline teeth. They should all look the same, all the way around and all along length. The hub only engages the driveshaft on the end, so you'll have unused spline teeth on the driveshaft to use as a comparison for what "good" looks like.
You can punch the bearings out (please don't use a steel rod, brass is best, but aluminum will work), but you should press them in, if you have a press, or access to one. Also, properly sized press dies are a must to get the bearings and seals back in, whether you use a press or not. Anything will work, as long as it's roughly the same size as the hole. Resist the temptation to use the old bearings. The bores are deeper than the bearing width and you can't get them out once you get them stuck. In a pinch, you can use them (both cup and cone) to get new cups started, but only until the whole cup width is seated; after that, you need something smaller.
The bearing preload is important. I use the FSM procedure, but others don't and claim good results. You can search for other opinions. @BILT4ME has a pretty good write up on the procedure he uses, which is typical, I think.
HTH
Thanks for clipping that out of the FSM for me. I have a race press now and didn't use one before, I defifinetly did not pack the hub with grease between the two bearings. I also I think my preload was wrong too, I was getting some 12 and 6 O'clock movements once I got the tires off the ground so that wasnt helping. I never checked it last time after i had driven some few miles to see if it had settled any, I will this time tho. So this is still an ongoing learing experience. As far as the wear on the hub, the picture looks worse than it really is.
Malleus
Far west of Siegen
No matter how many times you do something, there's always something else to learn. I qualified my comments on the hub journal, because I know from experience how deceptive those photo images can be. You really need to be a pro with top shelf equipment to take an equipment photo and have it clearly represent what your eye sees.
So I answered my own question today and thought I would post my findings for anyone else that may be curious.
I discovered today that the last time I did this job, several years ago. I put the wheel seal in backwards and is what caused that strange wear and premature failure of the seal. Definitely a learning lesson.
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It's been a while but just wanted to thank you again, you were spot on. I finally got around to ordering the flange from here in Aus, delivered to Melbourne. Front Drive Flange suitable for Landcruiser 80 Series 94-98 FZJ80 HZJ80 HDJ80 - https://www.allfourx4.com.au/epages/shop.sf/en_AU/?ObjectPath=/Shops/allfourx4/Products/43421-60040
Now fits beautifully, no movement like before.
Sorry for asking a question that's probably been answered many times, but what could one expect to pay for a rebuild in this day and age? A local Toyota specific shop quoted me $2k... (Located in Nebraska.)
If you are paying a business to do it that's in the ballpark. It's a dirty job that takes time. IF the shop you contract does it RIGHT with ONLY OEM components, that is a reasonable number.
Much appreciated! I have a buddy who's done it a few times and who also just offered to help. I might have to go that route and save some pennies for other (more fun) mods
I urge you to do it yourself. Take your time, get help, learn the axle, understand how it goes together. You will be way ahead of a mechanic that is doing another job to get it off the rack. Only you will care enough to make sure it's right. That matters more than you may think.
I say do it. I’m finally about to do the same, ordered everything today from Cruiser outfitters and some Wits End tools and hardware, so the whole front end is getting done.
It will be my first attempt. Between this place/info and the OTRAMM vids, I actually feel pretty confident that I’ll get it done. (In 3x the amount of time it should take with 10x the profanity.)
It will be my first attempt. Between this place/info and the OTRAMM vids, I actually feel pretty confident that I’ll get it done. (In 3x the amount of time it should take with 10x the profanity.)
BillyGoatMTB
SILVER Star
I also urge you to do it yourself it's very important to not only carry spare parts on the trail but no exactly how to go in and back out correctly and knowing the front axle well is an important part.
No one and no shop will do it like you will do it, perfectly packing the bearings taking your time, packing the burfields with a tube of Molly each, resetting the axles back into the burps, verifying torque settings on your spindles, making sure your seals are properly seated. What you do all this you'll be a pro and you'll be Trail ready.
If you don't have a factory service manual get one. Toyota factory parts are best buy once cry once if you must Cruise outfitters has kits, at a minimum get the koyo bearing kit and only use Toyota factory axle seals.
If you want to regear and switch to air the air lockers now is a good time to do that I can't say enough good things about my 4:88 and ARB air lockers.
@NLXTACY has an amazing poster that shows all the part numbers and torque settings it couldn't get any easier. If you ever have to work on your axle on the trail you will thank yourself a hundred times over for doing it yourself.
80 Series Front Axle Reference Poster- 18"x27", Version 3
80 Series Front Axle Reference Poster- 18"x27", Version 3 (REF-1)
lp2k
Had a couple of drinks.. saw a couple of things
Also plan to invest in some minor tools which are needed before hand. Sure you can take a shortcut on getting the 54mm locknut off but I wouldn’t
Another thing I learned is to swap out the flange studs as part of the job, or at least have a spare set at hand just in case
+1 on the DIY. I am no mechanic, and I was extremely nervous to jump into this job. But I'm smart and can follow instructions...and I don't have money to burn...so I bit the bullet. I did each side separately because of time constraints, but in hindsight I'm glad because I applied the lessons learned on one side to help with the other.Much appreciated! I have a buddy who's done it a few times and who also just offered to help. I might have to go that route and save some pennies for other (more fun) mods
- The Wit's End poster is great! Makes double-checking steps quick, and having the torque specs right there is very helpful.
- Definitely buy extra knuckle studs and (for me anyway) extras of the little bolts that hold the seals to the back of the knuckle. I busted one on each side. Spec says 45 inch pounds, but if I were to do it again, I'd just finger tighten and then maybe another half turn and be done with it.
- Invest $25-30 in a seal driver set. I got mine from Amzn, but Harbor Freight also has them for cheap. Makes setting the seals MUCH easier and less stressful, and it saves a tons of time removing old bearing races and putting new in.
- When I did the first side, I messed up one of the inner axle seals when trying to drive it in evenly (see note above). I had the full kit, so I just used the 2nd seal since I wasn't doing both sides at once. I ordered a couple extra inner axle oil seals for when I did the 2nd side. They are less than $5 each, so the peace of mind having them on hand is worth it IMHO. You don't want to be halfway through a job like this only to have to wait on shipping if you ding/dent up a seal.
Okay, I have cold feet again. While I did order all new hardware for the knuckle service job, I’m shaky at best with my ability to extract a broken/sheared bolt.
And now I’m not sure I have everything I need. Ordering rotors and pads now, no way I’m going right back in there after doing this. That was the easy decision.
The MUD rabbit hole also has me questioning flange replacement. And which one. Etc, etc.
And now I’m not sure I have everything I need. Ordering rotors and pads now, no way I’m going right back in there after doing this. That was the easy decision.
The MUD rabbit hole also has me questioning flange replacement. And which one. Etc, etc.
Malleus
Far west of Siegen
The real trick to removing the bolt, assuming it's broken at or below the top of the hole, it to make a dimple for the drill to start in, otherwise, it'll wander off somewhere and you run this risk of drilling into the female threads. Get a spring loaded center punch (it doesn't have to be costly, they all have hardened tips and springs and that's all you need for a soft bolt) and hit the bolt a couple of times, as close to the center as you can. Remember to use successively larger drills until you get to just under the tap drill size. The first drill you should use is 7/32-in or 5.5-mm, if you're using metric drills. Anything larger won't start a hole properly and will wander off the center punch mark.
Before you select the next drill, look at the end of the drill. There's a little web there that does not cut anything (check out mark 4:00 - 4:30 for a really good explanation). Your next drill size web width has to be the same size or smaller than the drill you just used. Take your time and it'll come out.
Of course, if it broke above the hole, you can either weld a nut on it, or cut a slot in it with your Dremel and use a screwdriver.
Before you select the next drill, look at the end of the drill. There's a little web there that does not cut anything (check out mark 4:00 - 4:30 for a really good explanation). Your next drill size web width has to be the same size or smaller than the drill you just used. Take your time and it'll come out.
Of course, if it broke above the hole, you can either weld a nut on it, or cut a slot in it with your Dremel and use a screwdriver.
Excellent info - thanks for the insight. I've hacked a few of these and although it worked out, I'd rather keep this one shiny. I have a few spring center punches, and I think all of the tools needed. (Plus, the shop where I will do the job has a full complement of specialty tools as well.)
@lp2k - thoughts on flange replacement before tear down? I know you've helped out a few posters with incorrect spacing, replacement, etc.
@lp2k - thoughts on flange replacement before tear down? I know you've helped out a few posters with incorrect spacing, replacement, etc.
The flange was upgraded to a meatier version in '94. You have a '92 right?
To fit the April '94 and on uprated flange you will need a longer CV / Birf to accommodate the increased thickness on the outer end. Aftermarket Birfs are available. Toyota ones are very expensive, at least they are where I come from
To fit the April '94 and on uprated flange you will need a longer CV / Birf to accommodate the increased thickness on the outer end. Aftermarket Birfs are available. Toyota ones are very expensive, at least they are where I come from
