See post #7
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See post #7
morganism
SunkCostFallacy
from the dizzy faq
Dizzy FAQ
"The 81-87 ignition is uber reliable because the electronics are not all packed into the hot, vibrating dizzy. The finned aluminum heat sink seems to be of benefit also. Toyota moved the Ignitor to the inner fender from the head to help keep heat and vibration down."
But they didn't ground to the block again until the 100 series added a wire to block and firewall.
Sorry if you don't believe, but cleaning the hold down cage and running the ground wire works fab, and is simple and easy to try.
Seems to be up there with EGR clogs, and charcoal cannister probs, that "just happen", without altering anything else in the engine bay.
There are simple starter contact kits, even from the "HELP" series will work, but contact pitting and failure will usually cause some chatter before failure.
Dizzy FAQ
"The 81-87 ignition is uber reliable because the electronics are not all packed into the hot, vibrating dizzy. The finned aluminum heat sink seems to be of benefit also. Toyota moved the Ignitor to the inner fender from the head to help keep heat and vibration down."
But they didn't ground to the block again until the 100 series added a wire to block and firewall.
Sorry if you don't believe, but cleaning the hold down cage and running the ground wire works fab, and is simple and easy to try.
Seems to be up there with EGR clogs, and charcoal cannister probs, that "just happen", without altering anything else in the engine bay.
There are simple starter contact kits, even from the "HELP" series will work, but contact pitting and failure will usually cause some chatter before failure.
So what you are saying is that if the ground for the ignitor is poor that the starter will not engage and turn over? Correct?
Hi, Reading your original post again I find that my fj60 does the same thing. It gets driven less than the other cruisers. I find that this situation goes away when I start to daily drive it. Probably due to corrosion building up on different contacts in or at the starter and we've had a lot of rain lately. It does go away when I switch to driving it daily. Mike
I know but I still wanted to see if he would answer a direct question.
I'm a little late to this party; but my '83 displayed the same symptoms as the OP. I struggled along with the "tap the solenoid with a hammer" solution to get it to start. What I discovered is that over time the start circuit from the ignition key doesn't deliver enough juice to pull in the solenoid. So what I did is installed a relay that delivers full battery voltage to the solenoid. Problem solved. Check out any "Bosch" 30 amp relay set up and you will be golden.
SimS
SimS
Why not just replace the starter switch behind the ignition key instead of reinventing the wheel and creating a possibly unsafe (un-fused) ignition circuit ?
Those switches are not expensive and available aftermarket and a lot more reliable than a $3 Chi-com relay.
Please don't take offense, but that kind of stuff is what makes new old-truck owners say WTF did this P.O. do?
Why not just replace the starter switch behind the ignition key instead of reinventing the wheel and creating a possibly unsafe (un-fused) ignition circuit ?
Those switches are not expensive and available aftermarket and a lot more reliable than a $3 Chi-com relay.
Please don't take offense, but that kind of stuff is what makes new old-truck owners say WTF did this P.O. do?
No offense taken. Cost and availability of a new OEM switch was my motivation. As far as reliability, I have had my setup in place for +100K miles and a spare relay in the console just in case. So far, so good, no fires, no failures. To each his own.
SimS
John McVicker
SILVER Star
Sure, it can be made safe, and of course if the switch were NLA it would be a reasonable choice - I just added the safety issue because someone who doesn't really know what they're doing is gonna read it and a light-bulb in the head goes off and they're gonna try it and maybe burn the truck down. It happens.
FWIW for anybody reading these threads, the Ignition Switch is readily available aftermarket from Cruiser-specialist vendors. Any year will work in the 81-87 FJ60, though if you use one for say a 1983 in a 1987 FJ60, you will lose the buzzer if the key is left in the ignition when door is open. And the reverse, a late switch will work in the early but the connector for the buzzer goes nowhere.
I used the early switch (1983) in mine cuz I hate that buzz when working on the truck.
Even Rockauto has them.
Good luck.
John McVicker
SILVER Star
As he usually is, @Spike Strip is spot on. And if ones switch is faulty and the reason for your spotty starting, it is best to replace the switch...BUT...
Sometimes its not the switch that is causing the problem. Often it's just your old wiring that doesn't allow full voltage to get to the starter solenoid when you turn the key. When you use the 'relay fix' your are essentially bypassing a whole bunch of your older wiring and thus getting full voltage down to your starter.
Just another option if the switch itself is not your culprit.
Sometimes its not the switch that is causing the problem. Often it's just your old wiring that doesn't allow full voltage to get to the starter solenoid when you turn the key. When you use the 'relay fix' your are essentially bypassing a whole bunch of your older wiring and thus getting full voltage down to your starter.
Just another option if the switch itself is not your culprit.
- Thread starter
- #54
I am trying to follow some of these posts/suggestions. I bought the starter rebuild kit that @Spike Strip mentioned, will be here Wednesday!
morganism
SunkCostFallacy
Nice replacement set.
Yes, that is what i was saying.
Clean coil holdown cage bolts and contacts, and run a wire from ignitor case to solid body or engine block, and the clean contact will reduce draw enough to fire the starter, unless it is hung up on the clutch ring gear. In that case, just leave in 4th, E brake off, and rock it a few times.
Yes, that is what i was saying.
Clean coil holdown cage bolts and contacts, and run a wire from ignitor case to solid body or engine block, and the clean contact will reduce draw enough to fire the starter, unless it is hung up on the clutch ring gear. In that case, just leave in 4th, E brake off, and rock it a few times.
You do realize that you can take the coil and igniter out of the engine bay and put them in your refrigerator and the starter will still crank the engine, right?
Typically, the bellhousing is attached directly to the engine block. The starter is grounded directly to the bellhousing through the case.
That holds true for both the logic (solenoid) and the load (motor) side of the starter. The only ground that matters in this case is the ground from the engine block to the negative battery terminal.
The +12 for the load side comes directly from the positive battery terminal.
The +12 for the logic side comes from one of the fusible links.
On planet Earth, the coil/igniter and just about every other system can be removed from the vehicle without effecting the starter logic.
Typically, the bellhousing is attached directly to the engine block. The starter is grounded directly to the bellhousing through the case.
That holds true for both the logic (solenoid) and the load (motor) side of the starter. The only ground that matters in this case is the ground from the engine block to the negative battery terminal.
The +12 for the load side comes directly from the positive battery terminal.
The +12 for the logic side comes from one of the fusible links.
On planet Earth, the coil/igniter and just about every other system can be removed from the vehicle without effecting the starter logic.
I laughed and spit part of a turkey sandwich on the desk --
The Chihuahua thanks you cuz he got the part that went on the floor.
It's already been settled. The coil ground is not the culprit. If it was a non start concern instead of a non crank concern we might be on to something, but for now, lets just get to the bottom of the OP's concerns.
- Thread starter
- #60
Ok, team. Sorry for the hiatus! I was busy fixing other vehicles. Coincidentally, my semi-daily driver F250 had the starter go out which I replaced with a refurbished unit. Anyway, I thought I would post this video of the starting issue. It may give some better context to the issue and help resolve some of the mixed opinions in this thread! Ha!
*I do have the rebuild kit in hand, just need some time and warm weather...
*I do have the rebuild kit in hand, just need some time and warm weather...
