- Thread starter
- #2,221
I'm certainly seeing another round of stuff. I just hope this "adjustment" to more power mellows out and I can get back to wearing down the tires.
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I'm certainly seeing another round of stuff. I just hope this "adjustment" to more power mellows out and I can get back to wearing down the tires.
Back to basics question for you Mike, Jonny too, what (other than bread vans) did the 4bt come in?
Seems to be so much knowledge, and aftermarket support for this thing, all for/from guys doing motor swaps, or...?
Or are you applying stuff that the 12valve community has developed to the 4banger?
You'll push through this one too boots, keep getting after it! Thank you again for all the little details.
Seems to be so much knowledge, and aftermarket support for this thing, all for/from guys doing motor swaps, or...?
Or are you applying stuff that the 12valve community has developed to the 4banger?
You'll push through this one too boots, keep getting after it! Thank you again for all the little details.
4BTSwaps.com is where a ton of this info comes from. Principles are the same as the 12v motors, but turbo selection is largely based on experience with this motor specifically.
Freightliner vans, Grunman vans, etc. These motors came in a ton of different applications. I couldn't list them all.
Freightliner vans, Grunman vans, etc. These motors came in a ton of different applications. I couldn't list them all.
Keep an eye on Portland Craigslist if you're on the hunt for a bread van. There's a guy that pops up every few months with one for sale in the $1500-2000 range. He has twenty or thirty of them (bought them when a local bakery went out of business) and sells one or two when he feels like it.
Stick with it boots4! I cant belive the cooling system builds enough presseure to blow the frost plugs!
Cant wait to see what this thing does once its sorted out and running 50psi.
I just want mine to make 25psi lol
Cant wait to see what this thing does once its sorted out and running 50psi.
I just want mine to make 25psi lol
No joke, i celebrate once mine hits 18.
- Thread starter
- #2,227
Thanks guys. Hopefully I'm on the tail end of this cycle of stuff. I'm feeling the urge to get out in nature and wheel/explore so it would be nice to have things settle down. We're thinking about hitting the Rubicon towards the end of summer this year.
- Thread starter
- #2,228
Did some searching and calling for an expansion plug for the rear. Found cummins part numbers 3900965 and 3922072. Seems all online places I found had ridiculous shipping or minimum $ ordering limits. Finally ended up calling Cummins Northwest, gave them my engine serial # and he had 18 on the shelf. The nice thing about them is that they are open until midnight so I was able to let the crazy traffic die down and go last night. When I got there the guy remembered I'd called, grabbed the part and said "have a nice day." He gave me the part for free and said it probably cost me more to drive there. After a gracious thanks I returned home. So, I've got my part ready for my Saturday work party.
I'm debating if I should do the rear main seal while I'm in there. Mine's not leaking but since I'd have to pull the engine for that too maybe I just do it anyways as a preventative measure.
I'm debating if I should do the rear main seal while I'm in there. Mine's not leaking but since I'd have to pull the engine for that too maybe I just do it anyways as a preventative measure.
Update?
They make 6cyl lead blankets for the cover covers and for the oil pan. Apparently makes a noticeable difference.
- Thread starter
- #2,231
Set up a shop day with my local club and a couple guys came out to give me a hand with the rear freeze plug. Much thanks to Kyle and Mike for spending the day with me taking stuff apart and then turning around and putting it all back together! We did have nice weather so that was a plus.
I did a little prep work the night before getting stuff together and taking some things apart. I haven't taken the engine out at this place yet and I haven't poured a pad in front of the shop either so my best spot was under the carport. To deal with the lifting constraints I threw on some rollers and aired them out to drop the front end. It was just enough to make it work.
Took us 1 1/2hs to get the engine out at a decent pace. It went pretty well with just enough lifting room to slip it out.
With the engine out we could remove the flex plate and take the tranny adapter off. Behind it we could see that the freeze plug was trying to work its way out. This is what was leaking.
A few taps on the top with a punch and hammer got it so we could grab it with some pliers and pop it out. It's condition looked very good, no corrosion and the lip even looked good. I'll clean it up and keep it for a spare but since I had a new one I used that for the replacement.
Cleaned up the block to prep for the new one.
Mixed some JBweld and installed the new freeze plug. Made sure I was driving it in on the lip and not on the dish.
This fix took maybe 10 minutes. We ate some lunch and shared some stories. With the engine out I inspected the engine bay, put a better weld on my shock tab's I recently replaced on my shock hoops to get a better shock angle on the front axle, fixed a brake line issue I found and did a little cleaning. From there it was put it all back together time.
Also with the engine out I took some other pics of the twins.
Different pic of the adapter clearanced for the big turbo.
Side shot of the compound turbos.
Blurry but I changed the bolts on my vane adjustment to set screws to make it easier to get to while in the truck. The bolt heads were a little tight to get a wrench on with the wheel well right next to this.
With most of the install done the guys took off and I finished a few little things. I let is sit for a day to let the JBweld cure before I put any coolant back in the engine. I've driven it several times this week and no more leak, fix was a success.
I did a little prep work the night before getting stuff together and taking some things apart. I haven't taken the engine out at this place yet and I haven't poured a pad in front of the shop either so my best spot was under the carport. To deal with the lifting constraints I threw on some rollers and aired them out to drop the front end. It was just enough to make it work.
Took us 1 1/2hs to get the engine out at a decent pace. It went pretty well with just enough lifting room to slip it out.
With the engine out we could remove the flex plate and take the tranny adapter off. Behind it we could see that the freeze plug was trying to work its way out. This is what was leaking.
A few taps on the top with a punch and hammer got it so we could grab it with some pliers and pop it out. It's condition looked very good, no corrosion and the lip even looked good. I'll clean it up and keep it for a spare but since I had a new one I used that for the replacement.
Cleaned up the block to prep for the new one.
Mixed some JBweld and installed the new freeze plug. Made sure I was driving it in on the lip and not on the dish.
This fix took maybe 10 minutes. We ate some lunch and shared some stories. With the engine out I inspected the engine bay, put a better weld on my shock tab's I recently replaced on my shock hoops to get a better shock angle on the front axle, fixed a brake line issue I found and did a little cleaning. From there it was put it all back together time.
Also with the engine out I took some other pics of the twins.
Different pic of the adapter clearanced for the big turbo.
Side shot of the compound turbos.
Blurry but I changed the bolts on my vane adjustment to set screws to make it easier to get to while in the truck. The bolt heads were a little tight to get a wrench on with the wheel well right next to this.
With most of the install done the guys took off and I finished a few little things. I let is sit for a day to let the JBweld cure before I put any coolant back in the engine. I've driven it several times this week and no more leak, fix was a success.
Those compounds look angry! I love it.
Post wheeling look over by Boots.
A little late on the advice but check out industrial injections freeze plug fix. They use a billet plug clamped in similar to the heater setup and it cures the blow out problem. I would go ahead and take care of the side ones while you have easy access. It's been my experience that when you make the rear one solid, boost finds the next most vulnerable one.
- Thread starter
- #2,235
The problem for me with all those rear freeze plug kits is that they use those two threaded holes to fasten the plate down. If you notice in my pics the tranny adapter plate I'm using already uses those two holes and covers the freeze plug. I couldn't have anything sticking out since the adapter mounts flush.
Both side plugs have been fixed so all that is left of the block is the front plug. If that goes I will not have to pull the engine so addressing that will be simple.
A week of driving and a wheeling trip later and no leaks so I'm confident the rear plug shouldn't give me any more problems.
Both side plugs have been fixed so all that is left of the block is the front plug. If that goes I will not have to pull the engine so addressing that will be simple.
A week of driving and a wheeling trip later and no leaks so I'm confident the rear plug shouldn't give me any more problems.
Excellent work Mike! 1.5 hours to have the motor on the floor is a pretty good pace I'd say. Not sure I'd be able to pull mine that quick.
- Thread starter
- #2,238
The pyrometer was acting up after that short I had and I had narrowed it down to the probe grounding out. I ordered a new probe kit and when I pulled the old wire out I found why it was grounding out.
This wire was routed with my mechanical water temp gauge line. Over time the temp line melted into the probe wires and grounded them out. I hadn't really thought about the temp gauge line getting that hot but obviously it does so I rerouted my temp line away from everything else and ended up routing my probe wires to the passenger side loom hole through the firewall. I had to open up this hole next to the driver side firewall hole a little so that the fitting on the end of the temp line could pass through the firewall. Then I found a grommet close enough to work.
I inspected anything else this temp line may have been touching. Found a nick in my total boost line caused by heat which helped explain why the gauge wasn't quite as smooth lately.
I found some air brake line in 1/8" size at a local napa store at $.69 a foot. I only needed 6 feet so this was cheaper than buying a boost line kit. Got that fixed too.
I was still plagued by a weird boost condition that I originally thought was the injection pump dumping fuel into the crankcase through the front seal. After the IP seal replacement the problem continued. When I get to about 3/4 throttle and into the 40psi range for total boost I would see both boost gauges drop pressure and power go down. It seemed to be getting worse and started doing this sub 40psi. My goal of 50psi had become unattainable. The weird thing is if I let off the throttle and then reapplied (not as much) boost would return and be strong under that threshold. I checked all intake clamps and could not find any boost leaks, especially any that would "reseal" and hold boost again. Nor was I seeing a black cloud behind me like I've seen before when I've popped off a intake joint.
I figured it could be fuel related and thought I found a cause with my fuel line into my lift pump. Maybe the angle on the line was pinching it shut with the lift pump demanding more fuel and the engine rocking up on this side when torqueing.
I attempted to hold the hose open with zip ties as a test. Same thing happened. I found and angled hose bare instead to replace the straight one I installed originally.
I put that in and angled the fuel line so it wouldn't kink like I thought it might be.
Same boost issue happened so this wasn't the culprit.
I had been playing around with different springs on the small turbo's wastegate and recently fixed the wastegate shut for some testing. I swapped that around but it didn't stop the boost drop so this wasn't the culprit either.
I started to worry about the internals of the injection pump but it starts great and runs great; no signs that the pump is having problems. I took a friend for a ride to get some other eyes and idea's. We finally noticed that when boost would drop the large turbo would go to zero while the total boost gauge would go to about 20psi. What this told us is that the larger turbo was making no boost and the small turbo was making whatever we were reading on the total boost gauge. But sure enough, let off the throttle and then reapply and both turbos would spool up. After some discussion we concluded that the problem could be in the large turbo. The HE351VE does not have a wastegate that could be opening up and since I fixed the vanes those couldn't be opening up either. We figured it might be the compressor wheel slipping at a certain boost pressure; the shaft nut could be loose, at least loose enough to slip at a certain pressure but not slip when under that pressure. This seemed like an easy fix to test and I didn't need to take the turbo out to do this. After removing stuff in the way I removed the compressor wheel nut, put some lock tight on it and put it back on. I was trying to be careful about how much to tighten it up but it didn't feel tight enough so I added a little more, and then a little more which ended up ruining the rest of my weekend.
After the appropriate words jumped out of my mouth and a plastic lawn chair had been sacrificed by my right foot, turbo guts littered my workbench.
I thought I might had found a lucky break in my turbo scrap box when I found a turbine wheel in good shape with identical measurements. All except for one little detail. The find is on the left and the original is on the right. Notice that the base of the blades have a different height. This small 2mm difference doesn't allow the exhaust housing to fully seat. That part touches and you don't want any part of the wheel to touch any part of the housing. So this other wheel wasn't going to work. After a talk with the
I was allowed to bleed some more funds from a house project and order parts.
With the turbo's apart I've ordered a new turbine wheel for the large turbo and rebuild kits for both. I'm hoping to have those by the end of the week for a Saturday project. While the truck is down I have also dropped off my injectors to get the pop pressures reset to 255bar. Sometimes all we can do is keep on wrenching.
This wire was routed with my mechanical water temp gauge line. Over time the temp line melted into the probe wires and grounded them out. I hadn't really thought about the temp gauge line getting that hot but obviously it does so I rerouted my temp line away from everything else and ended up routing my probe wires to the passenger side loom hole through the firewall. I had to open up this hole next to the driver side firewall hole a little so that the fitting on the end of the temp line could pass through the firewall. Then I found a grommet close enough to work.
I inspected anything else this temp line may have been touching. Found a nick in my total boost line caused by heat which helped explain why the gauge wasn't quite as smooth lately.
I found some air brake line in 1/8" size at a local napa store at $.69 a foot. I only needed 6 feet so this was cheaper than buying a boost line kit. Got that fixed too.
I was still plagued by a weird boost condition that I originally thought was the injection pump dumping fuel into the crankcase through the front seal. After the IP seal replacement the problem continued. When I get to about 3/4 throttle and into the 40psi range for total boost I would see both boost gauges drop pressure and power go down. It seemed to be getting worse and started doing this sub 40psi. My goal of 50psi had become unattainable. The weird thing is if I let off the throttle and then reapplied (not as much) boost would return and be strong under that threshold. I checked all intake clamps and could not find any boost leaks, especially any that would "reseal" and hold boost again. Nor was I seeing a black cloud behind me like I've seen before when I've popped off a intake joint.
I figured it could be fuel related and thought I found a cause with my fuel line into my lift pump. Maybe the angle on the line was pinching it shut with the lift pump demanding more fuel and the engine rocking up on this side when torqueing.
I attempted to hold the hose open with zip ties as a test. Same thing happened. I found and angled hose bare instead to replace the straight one I installed originally.
I put that in and angled the fuel line so it wouldn't kink like I thought it might be.
Same boost issue happened so this wasn't the culprit.
I had been playing around with different springs on the small turbo's wastegate and recently fixed the wastegate shut for some testing. I swapped that around but it didn't stop the boost drop so this wasn't the culprit either.
I started to worry about the internals of the injection pump but it starts great and runs great; no signs that the pump is having problems. I took a friend for a ride to get some other eyes and idea's. We finally noticed that when boost would drop the large turbo would go to zero while the total boost gauge would go to about 20psi. What this told us is that the larger turbo was making no boost and the small turbo was making whatever we were reading on the total boost gauge. But sure enough, let off the throttle and then reapply and both turbos would spool up. After some discussion we concluded that the problem could be in the large turbo. The HE351VE does not have a wastegate that could be opening up and since I fixed the vanes those couldn't be opening up either. We figured it might be the compressor wheel slipping at a certain boost pressure; the shaft nut could be loose, at least loose enough to slip at a certain pressure but not slip when under that pressure. This seemed like an easy fix to test and I didn't need to take the turbo out to do this. After removing stuff in the way I removed the compressor wheel nut, put some lock tight on it and put it back on. I was trying to be careful about how much to tighten it up but it didn't feel tight enough so I added a little more, and then a little more which ended up ruining the rest of my weekend.
After the appropriate words jumped out of my mouth and a plastic lawn chair had been sacrificed by my right foot, turbo guts littered my workbench.
I thought I might had found a lucky break in my turbo scrap box when I found a turbine wheel in good shape with identical measurements. All except for one little detail. The find is on the left and the original is on the right. Notice that the base of the blades have a different height. This small 2mm difference doesn't allow the exhaust housing to fully seat. That part touches and you don't want any part of the wheel to touch any part of the housing. So this other wheel wasn't going to work. After a talk with the
I was allowed to bleed some more funds from a house project and order parts.
With the turbo's apart I've ordered a new turbine wheel for the large turbo and rebuild kits for both. I'm hoping to have those by the end of the week for a Saturday project. While the truck is down I have also dropped off my injectors to get the pop pressures reset to 255bar. Sometimes all we can do is keep on wrenching.
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Yikes! RIP lawn chair.
Damn man. Hopefully the rebuild will resolve the problem 