Converting air conditioner from R12 to R134a? (1 Viewer)

[Geezer Cruzzer]

When we bought Ms. Scarlet in 2017 the Clardy air installed in 1983 was dead. Replaced the compressor with a York and replaced the dryer. Everything else was good to go. Spent the extra money to stay with R12 for better cooling on the advise of the mechanic.

Everything has been good until this October when I noticed that the air conditioner was still cooling but not cooling as well. Tells me that after 5 1/2 years I need to recharge the system. My mechanic where I live now doesn't do R12. I'm going to make some more calls in the area to check with others.

Someone suggested I switch over to R134a. It seems to be a straight forward process. Evacuate the remaining R12, replace the fittings on the compressor to accept R134a and recharge the system.

What say you wise Cruiserheads?

 

[charliemeyer007]

Not an AC guy. Funny how every time the patent is about to expire on the fluid, it is found to be bad for the planet (read pocket of manufacture) and you need to buy a whole new system - fluid, gauges, fittings...

Hot Shot, R414B, Replaces R12, R134a, R401A, R401B, R409A, R416A, R420A, & R500

Hot Shot, R414B, Replaces R12, R134a, R401A, R401B, R409A, R416A, R420A, & R500 ICOR, HOT SHOT Refrigerant R-414B Hot Shot® Replaces R12, R134a, R401A, R401B, R409A, R416A, R420A, & R500, 28 oz. Refrigeration R-414B Refrigerant Recharge Kit (1) 28 oz. Can of Hot-Shot R-414B 1/4" male fitting on...

frosty-freezeacproducts.com

 

[atazman]

I have been using Envirosafe Industrial 134A for at least 5 years in 3 vehicles that had R12 originally. I love the stuff. You can top off your R12 system (no need to evacuate). No need to change fittings, and no need to change type of oil. Excellent cooling too.

However, if you do change from R12, I would suggest changing out the fittings to the R134 type because of the quick-disconnect feature. Much easier to add refrigerant.

 

[Geezer Cruzzer]

I have been using Envirosafe Industrial 134A for at least 5 years in 3 vehicles that had R12 originally. I love the stuff. You can top off your R12 system (no need to evacuate). No need to change fittings, and no need to change type of oil. Excellent cooling too.

However, if you do change from R12, I would suggest changing out the fittings to the R134 type because of the quick-disconnect feature. Much easier to add refrigerant.

Thanks for the information. This seems to be getting easier.

 

[White Stripe]

You need a newer dryer that has the filter in it that's for r134a and you need the adapter fittings that go from r12 fittings to r134a. Then add the oil for r134a and your ready for the refrigerant.

 

[Geezer Cruzzer]

You need a newer dryer that has the filter in it that's for r134a and you need the adapter fittings that go from r12 fittings to r134a. Then add the oil for r134a and your ready for the refrigerant.

Thanks... Keep the info coming.

 

[White Stripe]

Thanks... Keep the info coming.

You will also need to pull the compressor and dump the old oil out of it. Then add the new oil. You will need a little measuring cup to measure however many ounces of oil your compressor takes to put in the compressor. You will also need to add oil to the new dryer and add oil to the evaporator and condenser. Their should be rated amounts somewhere on the internet for your system hopefully.

 

[70fj40]

My experience is in commercial refrigeration and air conditioning not automotive but I can tell you that there are all kind of scenarios and experiences on this subject. There are situations where dumping R134 on top of R12 has on one end had acceptable results and on the other end seen systems very short lived. The fact is the two refrigerants use completely different oil. R134 and its oil acts much like a solvent which can cause a host of problems in a refrigeration system. We see lots of guys add new refrigerants to an older system without changing any components and sometimes they work. If it were my system I would follow White Stripes good advice and you will have the best chance for success.

 

[Engineer8000]

The 134A is a smaller molecule and will leak out easier. Some recommend changing to the new style rubber hose to reduce leakage.

 

[firemanj92]

I just had a shop convert our 91 Integra. It was as simple as removing old R12 and oil, installing the $6 adapter kit and reinstalling r134, then putting the new retrofit sticker on-nothing else was changed. The adapter kit can be found at any auto store from $6-16 (I think it dropped in price to the lower price).

 

[White Stripe]

From what i understand is R12 systems have XH5 desiccant in the dryer and are made up of molecular sieve powder and a clay based binder to hold the particles together into the shape of a bead. The difference between XH5 and r134a dessicant XH7 is the clay binder. The binder is what is not compatible with the R-134a and the oils used with R-134a, and causes the beads to break apart and release particles of desiccant and clog the system.

Older rubber hoses were not made to barrier r134a and it could slowly leak put through the hoses. An exception however is older rubber hoses that have had r12 for years can develop a coating or condition the hoses so that they will keep 134a from escaping and thus you may not need to replace the hoses.

 

[duncanrm]

Propane is an option.

 

[charliemeyer007]

I think 134a is on the way out. Get enough to recharge your system several times while you can.

 

[SteveH]

I think 134a is on the way out. Get enough to recharge your system several times while you can.

True - get a dozen cans of R-134a for yourself at $5-6/can before sales to the public are stopped. Recall that cans of R-12 used to be 77 cents, and now cans are $30-$50 each.

 

[Geezer Cruzzer]

I think 134a is on the way out. Get enough to recharge your system several times while you can.

I tried to verify what you said and didn't come up with anything. Can you please give me the source of the information.

 

[charliemeyer007]

Google

Is 134a going to be phased out?


What has been decided? The production of refrigerants R134a, R407C, R407F and R410A is being phased out step-by-step. In 2020, the total production of synthetic refrigerants will be reduced by around 40%. In 2030, only 20% of the currently produced synthetic refrigerants may still be marketed.

there is all kind of stuff like Last model year for 134a
Another HFC R-134a typically used in automobiles, will not be permitted to be used in Model Year 2021 vehicles; however, R-134a is not restricted for use in chillers.

I'm sure that when the patents expire on the current stuff, they have the "new" safe stuff ready for the market at the new and improved price - plus you get to buy new hases, gauges, fittings...

 

[SteveH]

@Geezer Cruzzer

Bans by region - https://www.hfcbans.com/bans-by-region.html

 

[Geezer Cruzzer]

Thanks for the information guys. Didn't do the correct search. I'll convert to R134a and buy a bunch of extra cans and put them on the shelf.

 

[Engineer8000]

I bought a 30# can a couple years ago.

 

[70fj40]

I will add that Refrigerant doesn’t go anywhere if there isn’t a leak in the system. I would certainly find and fix the leak before I charged it again. Do that and you may never need to use the rest of those several cans you buy.