Catch can - results after 1,000 miles (2 Viewers)

[molonlabemike]

I may have been one of the first to post up picture of the aluminum intake manifold split open. Showing the oil that had collected in the pockets. I wondered how much was from me using sea-foam fogger. Based on what OP posting in just 1K miles in his CC, it must have been just oil!

Interest 2UZ is know for not using oil between changes. In fact sometimes I think level has gone up in 5K miles.

View attachment 2610808

This photo is what made me want to install a catch can. Oil in the intake is never good for the motor and is only in there for emissions bull shi t

 

[flintknapper]

This photo is what made me want to install a catch can. Oil in the intake is never good for the motor and is only in there for emissions bull shi t

If running oil vapor through the intake to be 'mostly' burned in the cylinders were a GOOD thing....then engineers would have designed engines to do that ever since engines were invented. Exactly right.....emissions crap. It increases carbon build up on piston tops and the back side of the valves.

 

[2001LC]

This photo is what made me want to install a catch can. Oil in the intake is never good for the motor and is only in there for emissions bull shi t

Well, actually there are a number of good reason for PCV.

If you every look at pictures of old airplane engine cowling, before PCV. You'll see streaks of oil on running back along cowling.

Crank cases build pressure for various reason as engine running. Like heat building internally which creates expansion pressure and some combustion gas leak into crankcase building pressure. The crankcase pressure blows out oil seals and we get leaks. The heating and cooling cycles, also cause condensation. Which PCV ventilation reduces pressure to near zero by giving vapor a rout. Without the PCV ventilation rout, we'd build more slugs, get many of oil leak point and may gum up oil rings.

IMHO. Using full synthetic oil helps reduce amount of oil vapor, slugs and heat. The PCV valve of a good engine run on synthetic oil never clog, IMO!

 

[flintknapper]

Well, actually there are a number of good reason for PCV.

If you every look at pictures of old airplane engine cowling, before PCV. You'll see streaks of oil on running back along cowling.

Crank cases build pressure for various reason as engine running. Like heat building internally which creates expansion pressure and some combustion gas leak into crankcase building pressure. The crankcase pressure blows out oil seals and we get leaks. The heating and cooling cycles, also cause condensation. Which PCV ventilation reduces pressure to near zero by giving vapor a rout. Without the PCV ventilation rout, we'd build more slugs, get many of oil leak point and may gum up oil rings.

IMHO. Using full synthetic oil helps reduce amount of oil vapor, slugs and heat. The PCV valve of a good engine run on synthetic oil never clog, IMO!

We all agree that Crankcase Ventilation is a good thing.

It's WHERE it gets vented to (directly back to the intake) that is in question (by some of us).

Those of us with an Oil Separator still want that routing.....but feel the amount of Oil Vapor should be attenuated.

But....yeah, we don't want to go back to the days of 'Oil Breather Caps' on valve covers....that's for sure.

 

[molonlabemike]

We all agree that Crankcase Ventilation is a good thing.

It's WHERE it gets vented to (directly back to the intake) that is in question (by some of us).

Those of us with an Oil Separator still want that routing.....but feel the amount of Oil Vapor should be attenuated.

But....yeah, we don't want to go back to the days of 'Oil Breather Caps' on valve covers....that's for sure.

This time’s 100000

I don’t need oil lowering the octane of my gas and having more carbon build up.

 

[2001LC]

I'm not arguing against a catch can. Only pointing out that the PCV system is not "there for emissions bull shi t "

 

[flintknapper]

I'm not arguing against a catch can. Only pointing out that the PCV system is not "there for emissions bull shi t "

I think it could be argued that cycling it back through the intake without attempting to catch any of it IS either emissions/EPA inspired OR manufacturers think the added 'maintenance' would not be well accepted by owners (maybe both). In the past....(WAY in the past) it was common place to have to clean (or replace) the filter media in a breather cap. So a 'catch can' is no more troublesome than that.

But these days the average driver is completely lost if a Check Engine light were to flicker, let alone have to actually open the hood and look at something. So for the increasingly helpless public....maybe its a good thing.

 

[Shortpencils]

... OR manufacturers think the added 'maintenance' would not be well accepted by owners (maybe both).

It has also been suggested that the presence of a catch can implies a defect in, or shoddy design of the engine. Obviously not the case with the 2uz, but it seems like sufficient reason for a manufacturer to omit a catch can from the design.

 

[flintknapper]

It has also been suggested that the presence of a catch can implies a defect in, or shoddy design of the engine. Obviously not the case with the 2uz, but it seems like sufficient reason for a manufacturer to omit a catch can from the design.

Fair point. So I'll just add it myself.

 

[willbt]

There is a passenger side crankcase vent that comes from the valve cover and goes directly to the OE air box assembly. It doesn't use a PCV valve though. Wouldn't you want to tie that into the catch can too?

 

[ramangain]

OCCs have been around quite some time. There is probably factual information, even data, floating around as to why OEMs don't install them at the factory. It could be scientific, it could be cost, it could be perception. It would be nice to dig up and know.

 

[abuck99]

Is it really that big a concern that necessitates having one??

I dont see the correlation to loss of octane on a fuel injected motor- but thats just my perception. I have virtually no measureable oil loss (as it appears on the dipstick) between oil changes so I dont think much oil is being bypassed as vapor. Maybe this OCC is more relevant on higher reving engines but the 2uzfe has a fairly low rpm typical operating range for average driver- 1800-3500 rpm. I cant imagine enough blow-by to be a problem or go to the effort unless you typically drive in a much higher rpm range for some reason.

Open to empirical data that shows otherwise as it relates to our motors.

 

[J1000]

I dont see the correlation to loss of octane on a fuel injected motor- but thats just my perception.

So what? Your perception is wrong.

 

[Biga27110]

So what? Your perception is wrong.

Lets stay on topic save the debates for another thread.

This looks like a great mod. How do we mount it.

 

[2001LC]

There is a passenger side crankcase vent that comes from the valve cover and goes directly to the OE air box assembly. It doesn't use a PCV valve though. Wouldn't you want to tie that into the catch can too?

I don't find oil in air pipe for PS PCV hose. I have split the air pipe in halve, and often set them in ways any oil should run out FWIW.

IDK, as I've never measured vacuum at this BK2 PCV hoses. But I'm thinking we less vacuum at hose going into air pipe/box. Whereas BK1 is behind throttle body butterfly, getting full vacuum at of intake manifold at all times.

But would be interest to test vacuum and place catch can and see.

Is it really that big a concern that necessitates having one??

I dont see the correlation to loss of octane on a fuel injected motor- but thats just my perception. I have virtually no measureable oil loss (as it appears on the dipstick) between oil changes so I dont think much oil is being bypassed as vapor. Maybe this OCC is more relevant on higher reving engines but the 2uzfe has a fairly low rpm typical operating range for average driver- 1800-3500 rpm. I cant imagine enough blow-by to be a problem or go to the effort unless you typically drive in a much higher rpm range for some reason.

Open to empirical data that shows otherwise as it relates to our motors.

I agree.

I looked at this years ago, when I split that first intake manifold (IM). I felt it would be kind cool to install a CC and may help intake ports stay a bit cleaner. But did not see picking up much else in benefits. If the octane is getting slightly lowered. That must be bake into the OCT rating of fuel recommended, timing, knock senors, timing, ECM, etc. by engineers, as are the oil pockets in the IM of 98-05 must have been.

The VVT engine, interestingly does not have these pockets (oil catches in IM) that I can see. Those IM's we can't split without a rendering useless afterward. If I get a bad one I split it and see. I do see some (very little) oil move around inside sitting at different angles

OCCs have been around quite some time. There is probably factual information, even data, floating around as to why OEMs don't install them at the factory. It could be scientific, it could be cost, it could be perception. It would be nice to dig up and know.

Maybe all of the above reason factory did not put in OCC.

I'll toss in 1 more reason factory may not have install the OCC:

It would be A PM service point, likely not taken care of every 5k or 10K miles. If missed will reduce effective of PCV system, by clogging air flow from crank case. PVC system go for 10yr/90K miles without needing service now. Yet I find PCV systems not serviced at 90k, 180K, 270K even 360k miles. Even rigs that never missed a service call at dealership, I finds PM stuff never done including PCV systems very often. Had factory put these OCC in, instead of engineering around it. We'd have most 2UZ leaking oil like a sieve today!

 

[abuck99]

So what? Your perception is wrong.

Lol whatever dude- I dont know what your deal is, you've a habit cunty behavior here on the forum, then deleting your posts to cover your tracks. Your comment comes across as pretty douchey yet not surprising.

 

[molonlabemike]

Another update after 2300 miles, almost the same amount oil in the catch after our trip from CA to TN. Still seeing a little metallic shimmer so I might be posting off a valve cover to see whats going on. Also do for an oil change so I might cut the oil filter open and see how that’s looking.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Another update after 2300 miles, almost the same amount oil in the catch after our trip from CA to TN. Still seeing a little metallic shimmer so I might be posting off a valve cover to see whats going on. Also do for an oil change so I might cut the oil filter open and see how that’s looking.

Send a sample to Blackstone labs. Looks can be deceiving, but for $38 those reports don't lie.

 

[2001LC]

Hard to imagine metal particulates would make it to CC in vapor, of size the eye would see

A technique used in aircraft engine to inspect oil for metal. Filter oil as it's drained, then inspected filter.

I asked this once, but don't recall if you answered. What oil and filter are you using?

 

[jerryb]

cunty, haha.

the passenger side is to equalize the vent on the drivers side.
The airbox tube has almost no vac, or very little. Pressure, or lack of, can return to the crank easily. Out the drivers side, in on the pass side.


there's a port on the back of the vvti manifold for what I assume is the supercharger absolute pressure sensor.
Don't know if the aluminum intake has the same thing. I bet it does. It's the prefect place to run a tube for a vac/boost gauge.

I have a catch can, just need to make a bracket. I've cleaned my intake off/out twice in 62k miles. It's grosser than gross both times.