150 Amp Alternator - Thanks Photoman (1 Viewer)

[Dave 2000]

Straight after engine started.

Aux battery around 20 seconds after starting.

Starter battery about 30 seconds after starting.

Aux battery after 50 seconds running.

Starter battery after 55 seconds running.

More to follow.

Regards

Dave

 

[Dave 2000]

After about a minute running.

Aux battery about 1 min 10 seconds running.

Starter battery after about 1 min 15 seconds.

More to follow.

Regards

Dave

 

[Dave 2000]

Left engine running for 10 minutes and figures had not moved bar the hundredths flicking up and down.

Starter battery after 10 min and 10 sec running.

Centre console display rarely changes unless at idle and engine cooling fan comes on, or perhaps headlights, never drops below 13.7 volts, even in 45+ C heat.

Apart from some guesses i.e. moving leads between batteries, and jumping in and out of the car, the times can be considered fairly accurate, the console and multimeter readings to be accepted within the realms of every day use. Note, unless the typical gauge is designed to cater for life or death use, then it would be fair to say they are rarely spot on.

An apparent anomaly is the starter battery showing a higher voltage by 1 x 1 hundreth at one moment, this was something that occured between changjng leads, but suffice to say all is well.

IMO, the above pictures from this and previous posts can be considered as being representative of a healthy charging system.

Regards

Dave

 

[LSDbrand]

Did you have an ammeter in line during winching?

Was the engine running at idle/increased revolutions?

If you are running the stock alternator IIRC 80 amps, then a low voltage is to be expected, maintain that draw on your battery and your engine will shut down.

Regards

Dave

Hey men

So yeah. I was raving it up to about 2000rpm.

I have a clamp meter so no. It wasn't inline. I just clamped the cable outside.

Thanks!!!

 

[Dave 2000]

Great stuff, you have some numbers to work with. Hopefully when you get the 150 map unit back in you should be able to null out most of the draw.

Regards

Dave

 

[LSDbrand]

Ok. New update. Seems the problem is the battery combiner.

Currently I have the Bluesea ML- ACR 500amp.

So what got me thinking was when winching. I looked at the amp draw with all accessories on. At 2000rpm. The amps going to the aux battery were only about 13amp. But the draw from the fuse box that has all the accessories connected and is only connected to the aux battery is 30amp.

So when I was winching the amps did go up. To 130-160 amp.

No it got me on the line of "maybe the controller is not letting the low end of the amps go by"

So today I disconnected the combined and just put the batteries in parallel
Permanently. To test.

Now. When I turn on all the accessories the amp going to the aux battery is about 25amps and with the 2000rpm the volts don't drop but go to 13.8 (instead of 13.1 before)

Has any one had any problems with the ML-ACR or any other battery combiner?

Thanks for the time. Tomorrow I will drive the car some more to get it warm and see how it behaves.

 

[LSDbrand]

Left engine running for 10 minutes and figures had not moved bar the hundredths flicking up and down.

View attachment 1489029


Starter battery after 10 min and 10 sec running.

View attachment 1489030


Centre console display rarely changes unless at idle and engine cooling fan comes on, or perhaps headlights, never drops below 13.7 volts, even in 45+ C heat.

View attachment 1489031


Apart from some guesses i.e. moving leads between batteries, and jumping in and out of the car, the times can be considered fairly accurate, the console and multimeter readings to be accepted within the realms of every day use. Note, unless the typical gauge is designed to cater for life or death use, then it would be fair to say they are rarely spot on.

An apparent anomaly is the starter battery showing a higher voltage by 1 x 1 hundreth at one moment, this was something that occured between changjng leads, but suffice to say all is well.

IMO, the above pictures from this and previous posts can be considered as being representative of a healthy charging system.

Regards

Dave

Very nice. Thanks!!!

Question. Can you test after 10 min of running with a good load on the car. About 50amp total see what the voltage is? At 2000rpm or something like that?

Also. How are your cables? What grounds do you have?

I just contacted Blue Sea And they are going to send another unit.

Thanks a lot for the pictures!!!

 

[Dave 2000]

Glad you got it sorted.

I replaced all cables when I converted from 24 volt starting to 12 volt. Generally D.C. voltage drop across cables is acceptable at 3.5 - 4.0% over the total length, I wanted to do it over spec, it was awhile back now, but IIRC I achieved around 1.5 - 2.0%,

Cables are:

Aux battery neg to body.
Aux battery neg to engine block.
Aux battery pos to Blue Seas ACR

ACR to start battery pos.
ACR (start battery side) to starter.
Start battery neg to body.
Start battery neg to engine block.

I think I have body to chassis negative, not strictly needed, but will check if I bothered or not.

Re a 50 amp draw test no problem, I can switch in the glow plugs, which is circa 48 maps (6×8 amps), never tested like that but when I get five minutes I will do just that. There are at least two green LED's showing straight after start up and the glow plugs are still on, so that would be at least 13.2 volts when cold from a battery that has stood for a couple of days with some parasitc draw, I will rig up a cable and jump the glow plugs bus bar, I know all 6 plugs are good as they were only tested a few weeks ago.


I have the 500 map version of the VSR and fitted it about 5 or 6 years ago, the info is in my thread (link in sig), no problems thus far, although I did forget to move a cable once after doing some mod, no harm done, the red switch just flashed up an error.

Regards

Dave

 

[Dave 2000]

Well no time like the present! Started engine and left it to run for ten minutes.

Engine idling MM shows 14.4 volts.

Connected jump lead from battery positive to glow plug bus bar, i.e. a 48 amp hit, MM dropped to 13.4 almost immediately, then started to ramp back up, reached 14.4 within about 5 or 6 seconds, revving the engine made no difference.

This is as per my earlier post, you need volts to push the amps, also worth noting is the 'stuff' keeping the engjne running, ignition circuits, injection pump solenoid and so on probably are pulling perhaps 10 amps combined?

So that is around 58 amps being pulled from a stock 80 amp alternator, so dodgy math figure is around 70% of it's available output, and it still holds good voltage.

My engine cooling fan is rated at around 25 maps on slow speed and 35 on high, hence I wanted the 150 map, for now though the 80 map doing fine.

Regards

Dave

 

[LSDbrand]

Well no time like the present! Started engine and left it to run for ten minutes.

Engine idling MM shows 14.4 volts.

Connected jump lead from battery positive to glow plug bus bar, i.e. a 48 amp hit, MM dropped to 13.4 almost immediately, then started to ramp back up, reached 14.4 within about 5 or 6 seconds, revving the engine made no difference.

This is as per my earlier post, you need volts to push the amps, also worth noting is the 'stuff' keeping the engjne running, ignition circuits, injection pump solenoid and so on probably are pulling perhaps 10 amps combined?

So that is around 58 amps being pulled from a stock 80 amp alternator, so dodgy math figure is around 70% of it's available output, and it still holds good voltage.

My engine cooling fan is rated at around 25 maps on slow speed and 35 on high, hence I wanted the 150 map, for now though the 80 map doing fine.

Regards

Dave

Dude you have a perfect workin set up!

When you did the rewire to 12 volt. Where did you connect he S(sensing) wire of the alternator?

I'm guessing I also have a wiring problem. I will look thru that when I get the 150amp alternator back. I can't get my sistem to go to 14.4 after a couple of minutes. Max at 14.1

And with 50 amp draw it goes to 13.8 tops!

Thanks men

 

[LSDbrand]

Well no time like the present! Started engine and left it to run for ten minutes.

Engine idling MM shows 14.4 volts.

Connected jump lead from battery positive to glow plug bus bar, i.e. a 48 amp hit, MM dropped to 13.4 almost immediately, then started to ramp back up, reached 14.4 within about 5 or 6 seconds, revving the engine made no difference.

This is as per my earlier post, you need volts to push the amps, also worth noting is the 'stuff' keeping the engjne running, ignition circuits, injection pump solenoid and so on probably are pulling perhaps 10 amps combined?

So that is around 58 amps being pulled from a stock 80 amp alternator, so dodgy math figure is around 70% of it's available output, and it still holds good voltage.

My engine cooling fan is rated at around 25 maps on slow speed and 35 on high, hence I wanted the 150 map, for now though the 80 map doing fine.

Regards

Dave

Ok

new question on the set up.

I have a big thick wire going from the B+ of the alternator to a braker (150amp) to the main battery terminal.

I as looking at post #12 where @Photoman showed a diagram.

I have no AM 1 fuse box (it was deleted before i got the car, but all the wires just go directly to the fuse box)
I have no Fusible Link (also missing when i got the car so i just have a ground wire)

I noticed the alternator should be connected to the AM 1 box, that looks to be a junction box for all accesoires, mine goes direct to battery post. Could this make the alternator not see the voltage drop of the sistem??

 

[LSDbrand]

sorry, meant to say its just a wire now

I have no Fusible Link (also missing when i got the car so i just have a ground wire)

 

[Dave 2000]

Dude you have a perfect workin set up!

When you did the rewire to 12 volt. Where did you connect he S(sensing) wire of the alternator?

I'm guessing I also have a wiring problem. I will look thru that when I get the 150amp alternator back. I can't get my sistem to go to 14.4 after a couple of minutes. Max at 14.1

And with 50 amp draw it goes to 13.8 tops!

Thanks men

IIRC this was a problem last year caused by me having a Blonde moment?

My original thinking was to give charging priority to the starter battery, and this worked fine for a number of years but, this did give me some minor niggles. For example, if using the car at night I would have to wait for the VSR to engage to give me some decent headlights, also the wiring run from alternator to starter positive back across the the aux positive was IMO excessive.

So I swapped the charging lead B+to the aux battery, worked fine if the VSR was engaged, but when the VSR was open the alternator ramped the voltage up to around 17v, and flashed the charge light on the dashboard.

So sense wire had to follow charge wire, makes sense but just something I forgot, I had changed a few odds and ends that day, always a mistake as mods should be done and tested if possible at each step.

Regards

Dave

 

[Dave 2000]

Remembering I have a diesel take into account mine may be different?

I had two FL's both to positive of battery, one IIRC went to AM1 and the other split into two, one glow plug relay and the other I cannot remember. I replaced FL's with fuses but suffice to say AM1 seems to be the main power circuit for the 80 cruiser.

So B+ to battery positive, which is then connected to AM1 via fuses.

I notice you have a 150 breaker on the alt cable but, is the cable heavy enough to support more than 150 amps perhaps 200?

Regards

Dave
Regards

Dave

 

[RFB]

Thanks for the nice write up and great pictures explaining the process. That's an ingenious solution for a bushing puller.
If it helps, one of many solutions to get past the large terminal at the alternator is to make up a wire from the new fuse and connect up at the lug in the AM1 box. Then insulate the old alternator "B" connector and leave it disconnected from the alternator.

Bill


View attachment 608497

one question what is AM1? I cant figure that one out or its too early

 

[TomH]

AM1 is one of the connections in the fusible link.

 

[RFB]

Left engine running for 10 minutes and figures had not moved bar the hundredths flicking up and down.

View attachment 1489029


Starter battery after 10 min and 10 sec running.

View attachment 1489030


Centre console display rarely changes unless at idle and engine cooling fan comes on, or perhaps headlights, never drops below 13.7 volts, even in 45+ C heat.

View attachment 1489031


Apart from some guesses i.e. moving leads between batteries, and jumping in and out of the car, the times can be considered fairly accurate, the console and multimeter readings to be accepted within the realms of every day use. Note, unless the typical gauge is designed to cater for life or death use, then it would be fair to say they are rarely spot on.

An apparent anomaly is the starter battery showing a higher voltage by 1 x 1 hundreth at one moment, this was something that occured between changjng leads, but suffice to say all is well.

IMO, the above pictures from this and previous posts can be considered as being representative of a healthy charging system.

Regards

Dave

CAN You post a pic of the upgraded wire from alt to fuse then battery?

 

[midfat]

What’s the deal with needing to upgrade the fuse in the fusable link with the 150A alt upgrade? I’m finding conflicting threads on this subject. @Photoman, is there an official stance on this?

 

[Photoman]

What’s the deal with needing to upgrade the fuse in the fusable link with the 150A alt upgrade? I’m finding conflicting threads on this subject. @Photoman, is there an official stance on this?

This is not an official stance, just my opinion. The fusible link and alternator charging wire (and ground) in the stock cruiser was sized by Toyota for the 80 amp alternator. The 150 amp alternator is coming from a Sequoia which has a 140 amp slow blow fuse and wire size to suit the 150 amp alternator. In the 80 cruiser in order to be correct with the 150 amp alternator upgrade, the wiring and fusing needs to be sized to closely mimic the Sequoia.

For what it is worth, I tested a new stock 80 fusible link with a 150 amp load. This should simulate an alternator putting out 150 amps through the stock 80 fusible link. In the video as I applied the load, the fusible link started smoking at 30 seconds in. I stopped the test at a minute thirty to save the fusible link which was smoking pretty good. This meant the stock fusible link took the 150 amp load for over a minute without blowing. I had a video of this on a little site my ISP allowed but they discontinued doing this so it was taken down.
It has been said before, an alternator is only going to put out what it takes to try to keep the system running and keep the battery up. The 150 amp alternator does not always put out 150 amps. It has the capacity to put out 150 amps and the Sequoia 150 amp alternator was physically designed to do this.

 

[Photoman]

one question what is AM1? I cant figure that one out or its too early

AM1 and Main are in the small plastic box that two of the fusible links connect to from battery positive.

With the box open, the large white wire on the right is the one coming from the alternator "B" post through the blue fusible link to battery positive.