OOOPS ... forgot ... I second what @abuck99 said about being careful not to scratch/nick the ID of the diff tube ... slow, deliberate action that you only allow to move a little as you work around the seal ... if you just give it a whack the seal may move too far and your tool will hit the ID of the tube.
Front Drive Shaft / Differential leak; Oil Seal & dust cover replacement (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter 2001LC
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OOOPS ... forgot ... I second what @abuck99 said about being careful not to scratch/nick the ID of the diff tube ... slow, deliberate action that you only allow to move a little as you work around the seal ... if you just give it a whack the seal may move too far and your tool will hit the ID of the tube.
- Thread starter
- #22
Channel-locks may work well.
@abuck99 tool recommendation will work great. Again you found a sweet tool for the job!
They usually come out easy. If stuck I have used small pry bar or large old junk screw driver. Just place pry under outer lip, then across outside lip of diff tube. Protect outside lip of tube with piece of leather as you hold in place pressing or tapping on pry bar. You'll notice on your new seal it has a wide lip on OD with inner lip just at outside. So inner wide lip will protect the ID seating area of the differential tube. Just don't get careless and bang the c**p out of it.
To install make sure to lightly oil the inner ID of tube to receive the seal. (See FSM next post) I use old seal often to drive in new.
I like to place a dab of grease on the new snap ring at inboard axle to aid in keeping snap ring open end pointed down. Helps to grease teeth of axle a bit too.
I position clamp on top with snap opening on bottom to keep my orientation, a chalk line works well also.
Then grease up the ID lip of seal and carefully insert the shaft. Twist the shaft slightly back and forth to mess teeth of axle.
Once shaft about 1 1/4" from being seated you'll need to snap it (snap ring) in. If axle is still in the knuckle/hub assemble as shown in post #11, just grab the upper part of knuckle near ball joint receptor and pop/snap it in. If axle is out of hub, then use the action of the the inboard CV to snap it in. A final method is to hit the end of the axle with a log (won't damage axle tip). In any of the three methods keep drive shaft align with differential tube from end to end so it's straight (dead on).
When you've seat all the way in, check to see that dust cover is just inside tube.
Be extra care not to damage either dust cover or dust shield at either end of front drive shaft. They bend very easy and will rub.
Even this thick rag didn't protect the dust shield from being bent. It needs to be keep off the LCA.
@abuck99 tool recommendation will work great. Again you found a sweet tool for the job!
They usually come out easy. If stuck I have used small pry bar or large old junk screw driver. Just place pry under outer lip, then across outside lip of diff tube. Protect outside lip of tube with piece of leather as you hold in place pressing or tapping on pry bar. You'll notice on your new seal it has a wide lip on OD with inner lip just at outside. So inner wide lip will protect the ID seating area of the differential tube. Just don't get careless and bang the c**p out of it.
To install make sure to lightly oil the inner ID of tube to receive the seal. (See FSM next post) I use old seal often to drive in new.
I like to place a dab of grease on the new snap ring at inboard axle to aid in keeping snap ring open end pointed down. Helps to grease teeth of axle a bit too.
I position clamp on top with snap opening on bottom to keep my orientation, a chalk line works well also.
Then grease up the ID lip of seal and carefully insert the shaft. Twist the shaft slightly back and forth to mess teeth of axle.
Once shaft about 1 1/4" from being seated you'll need to snap it (snap ring) in. If axle is still in the knuckle/hub assemble as shown in post #11, just grab the upper part of knuckle near ball joint receptor and pop/snap it in. If axle is out of hub, then use the action of the the inboard CV to snap it in. A final method is to hit the end of the axle with a log (won't damage axle tip). In any of the three methods keep drive shaft align with differential tube from end to end so it's straight (dead on).
When you've seat all the way in, check to see that dust cover is just inside tube.
Be extra care not to damage either dust cover or dust shield at either end of front drive shaft. They bend very easy and will rub.
Even this thick rag didn't protect the dust shield from being bent. It needs to be keep off the LCA.
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Thank you all. It wouldn’t budge prying with a small pry-bar or a big screwdriver or tugging with channel locks. I ended up cutting through the inner lip of the seal and the metal ring with bullnose snips.
Then with the channel locks I could grab that torn edge and pry the seal out. Not praying across against the opposite edge as o had tried with the pry bar and screwdriver, but prying against the close edge, bending the cut edge over itself like this:
I see now I don’t have a good photo but it was the ring of rust around the outer few mm inside the tube that I think was trapping it in. I sanded this off as well as I could bring sure not the scratch the inner face of the tube, then followed @2001LC advice using the old seal to tap in the new. It was a little tricky because I had mangled the old seal but it still worked.
I realized just now rereading your posts that I forgot to oil the outside of the seal. It still went in without trouble and I cleaned up the rusty edge so I don’t think it was damaged but I’m thinking now about capillary action without a break built in. If oil begins to draw through the seal it will continue to do it. I don’t have another seal on hand though and I’m sort of inclined to take my chances. I’ll keep my eye on it and if it starts to drip I’ll pull it apart and fix it. I think it’ll go a lot faster the second time.
Then with the channel locks I could grab that torn edge and pry the seal out. Not praying across against the opposite edge as o had tried with the pry bar and screwdriver, but prying against the close edge, bending the cut edge over itself like this:
I see now I don’t have a good photo but it was the ring of rust around the outer few mm inside the tube that I think was trapping it in. I sanded this off as well as I could bring sure not the scratch the inner face of the tube, then followed @2001LC advice using the old seal to tap in the new. It was a little tricky because I had mangled the old seal but it still worked.
I realized just now rereading your posts that I forgot to oil the outside of the seal. It still went in without trouble and I cleaned up the rusty edge so I don’t think it was damaged but I’m thinking now about capillary action without a break built in. If oil begins to draw through the seal it will continue to do it. I don’t have another seal on hand though and I’m sort of inclined to take my chances. I’ll keep my eye on it and if it starts to drip I’ll pull it apart and fix it. I think it’ll go a lot faster the second time.
Glad you got it out ok, I have got a proper seal remover but I do sometimes use a wood screw, just screw it into the seal and pull it out which is almost the same as what you done. I always lubricate the seal with whatever oil it comes into contact with, so for a diff seal I use diff oil, engine seal I use engine oil etc. Don't worry about not lubricating the outer seal, as long as you cleaned the tube with steel wool or simular that is all you need to do, it is good practise though.
ugh. I replaced my oil seal this weekend, but when I went out to the LC this morning I saw a pretty decent size puddle of gear oil! I suspect I got the seal in a bit too far. Going to pick up another new seal and a seal puller from HF. Will try the quick method of getting the axle out, but sh*t...
- Thread starter
- #27
Left side seal seems to move easily, and can by pulled/pry out to level. Make sure to grease seal before replacing front drive shaft and guild in FDS carefully so you don't bump seal.
I've a special tool I use on LH seal to bring back out a bit. Not tried the RH seal.
I've a special tool I use on LH seal to bring back out a bit. Not tried the RH seal.
Thanks Paul. Is that a SST from Toyota or something I might be able to find around town? If I can reset the seal properly without buying a new one, that is obviously preferred. I feel like a seal puller will damage the seal with its sharp edges.
- Thread starter
- #29
It just a very old angled screwdriver. It just happens to have length from 90 deg angle prefect to hit metal backing of seal and steel lip of shaft coming out LH side of differential. I can easily leverage off differential with it, pushing on backing of seal.
I'm such a pack-rate I usually find or make something around the shop/house/yard to get the job done (Macquiver it).
The trick is to go easy and not bent metal backing or damage/pinch rubber seal.
I just installed both front driveshaft and seal a few days ago. Sure enough I wasn't happy with seal position and use my tool again. I'm driving and watching for leaks now. SO far so good!
Your welcome to come by and borrow. But I'll bet you can make or find something similar faster than coming by.
By the way it is possible to pull upper ball joint and swing knuckle out of the way. On LH side you'll need to remove the two bolts from TRE bracket off the knuckle to make room to swing. You can leave front drive shaft in hub, but makes hard to get at seal. So just remove grease cap and snap ring and pull axle if room is issue for you.
I'm such a pack-rate I usually find or make something around the shop/house/yard to get the job done (Macquiver it).
The trick is to go easy and not bent metal backing or damage/pinch rubber seal.
I just installed both front driveshaft and seal a few days ago. Sure enough I wasn't happy with seal position and use my tool again. I'm driving and watching for leaks now. SO far so good!
Your welcome to come by and borrow. But I'll bet you can make or find something similar faster than coming by.
By the way it is possible to pull upper ball joint and swing knuckle out of the way. On LH side you'll need to remove the two bolts from TRE bracket off the knuckle to make room to swing. You can leave front drive shaft in hub, but makes hard to get at seal. So just remove grease cap and snap ring and pull axle if room is issue for you.
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- Thread starter
- #30
One more thing.
FSM states to replace either snap ring if removed. It's totally up to you. But I always replace inner snap ring. I'm sure you can reuse a new one you've just installed and now pulled back out. But then again, I'd hate to see you need to pull FDS again! What could happen, is drive shaft pops out to easily just driving. This is more of issue if lifted or hitting the bumps/potholes really work suspension it's full length up and down.
FSM states to replace either snap ring if removed. It's totally up to you. But I always replace inner snap ring. I'm sure you can reuse a new one you've just installed and now pulled back out. But then again, I'd hate to see you need to pull FDS again! What could happen, is drive shaft pops out to easily just driving. This is more of issue if lifted or hitting the bumps/potholes really work suspension it's full length up and down.
Is this the small snap ring on the axle (that should face down) or the one in the tube?
Using the short cut it took me ~25-30 min to get axle out of tube. True to reports. I coulda been a little bit faster because I had to put the knuckle back on the UCA ball joint to get the tie rod end connectors off.
Now I am in and I so clearly got the seal in to far. When installing I was worried about not getting it in enough. I did lube the outside of the seal with gear oil before putting in, but it does not move freely.
It sounds like it should be flush with the inner lip. where the clean metal stops way in the above picture. There also isn't alot of room to get a pry bar or screw driver behind the seal w/o leveraging against the inner tube. I will try some gentle things to try and back it out without damaging the seal, but if it doesn't work I will probably cover this up, get a new seal tomorrow and then snip out the old-new seal. Thoughts?
Now I am in and I so clearly got the seal in to far. When installing I was worried about not getting it in enough. I did lube the outside of the seal with gear oil before putting in, but it does not move freely.
It sounds like it should be flush with the inner lip. where the clean metal stops way in the above picture. There also isn't alot of room to get a pry bar or screw driver behind the seal w/o leveraging against the inner tube. I will try some gentle things to try and back it out without damaging the seal, but if it doesn't work I will probably cover this up, get a new seal tomorrow and then snip out the old-new seal. Thoughts?
- Thread starter
- #33
Yes1. The small black snap that FSM recommend open end down and shows as non reusable.
This is proper level, even 1mm further out of diff tube.
Got the seal really nice and flush with the inner lip of the tube, which puts the high point of the seal almost perfectly flush with outer lip of tube. I used the old seal and a piece of wood to tap the seal to just the right depth, checking frequently. Put a new snap ring on the axle and got 'er in there good. Cleaned up the axle tube so I can watch for leaks. So far so good after ~10 miles of driving.
Hadnt considered your method of measuring seal depth by the end of the axle housing but it appears to have produced a good result. Typically the the top of the seal (flat part with part numbers) is set flush or just fractionally raised above the edge of the race. See arrow pointing to the edge of the race-
I find it odd/interesting that you can push the seal way to far back. When you look at the axle though it makes sense what happens when it is too far in (major leak). You want the seal fully around the thicker part of the axle and flush or nearly flush with the dust cover. When I (and others) pushed the seal too far in it is probably somewhere near the green arrow. The seal is then not a seal, its just a piece of rubber in there. When I was pushing the seal in I was aiming to line it up with that inner lip, but I found it difficult to see how flush that was. I could however get right underneath the tube and see how flush the upper lip was or if one side needed to go in a bit further. ~150 mile round trip drive to Ft. Collins today, so I will be checking regularly.
I need to replace my seal that just started leaking also. I am going to make a driver tool for this job and would like to do it ahead of time. Does anyone have access to a front diff and be able to measure the outer tube I.D. with a caliper where the driver would go in? I plan on the driver seating on the inner ridge to set the depth automatically like the Toyota SST.
Thanks.
Thanks.
- Thread starter
- #38
My drive tool these days is piece of wood, works great! 3/4 x 3/4 x 24" piece of oak. I can comfortably tap in without trying to reach my hand/arms in. The 3/4 oak sets over seal and butts to flange when flush.
I have a 2002 LC. I bought some seals but I didn't get the correct ones. I am trying to replace the outer most seals on both sides of the front differential.
Can someone look up the seal part numbers so I can confirm what I have or what I need? I'm having some trouble with the parts diagrams I guess...
Can someone look up the seal part numbers so I can confirm what I have or what I need? I'm having some trouble with the parts diagrams I guess...
Drop your VIN into partsouq.com and proceed from there. You can browse by Toyota > Land Cruiser, but there are a TON of different catalogs. Using your VIN speeds the process up.
I don't know of a faster way to find parts. A quick look there looks to me like you need 90311-47012 and 90311-47013. But that's a guess, because I don't have your VIN.
