Builds Won a '74 40 on a coin toss... (3 Viewers)

[ginmtb]

I forgot to mention that when I was driving to work today someone cut me off and I hit the horn but no sound! Did some tests last night and I get voltage (12+) to the relay and the relay clicks but nothing from the horns. Tried cleaning up the mounting spots to expose metal... no help. I’ll try running separate grounds. If that doesn’t work I’m assuming my relay has gone bad? And I’m pretty certain the horn worked before all the swapping out of things - ignition switch and alternator.

 

[Toyota Pilot]

" ... A caveat is that those Porsche engines have a modified dry sump oiling system..."

Not really true. The standard 996 series Porsche's use a baffle system in the case, not a true separate dry sump, like the Turbos, GT2, GT3, and 993's and earlier series. They don't make 'em like they used to!

 

[ginmtb]

Ok no more junk alternator for me! Just waiting for a new plug from @Coolerman and this bad boy will be installed! Thanks so much @orangefj45 !!!

 

[ginmtb]

I shared the photo of the NOS alternator with @Racer65, we talked about the junk alternator I had initially got, and his reply was priceless:

NOS vs. POS

 

[handcannon]

Have you heard of the shop-vac trick to keep oil in the crankcase while swapping out drain plugs? Put the vac hose in the oil filler up top, and there should be enough vacuum in the crankcase to minimize oil from pouring out of the drain plug in case you need to swap it out for whatever reason. Like forgetting a washer, sticking a magnet on it, etc. I've only heard about it, never tried it.

Quite a few years ago I had the oil changed in my work van. The oil drain plug leaked, so I took it back. I watched them do this trick to put in a new gasket on the drain plug, without losing any oil. A shop rag was placed over the fill tube, a shop vacuum tube was placed over the rag on the fill tube and turned on. I wasn't where I could see the bottom of the motor so I can't say there weren't any drips during the procedure, but I was impressed with how they did it, and how clean things were (no mess).

Don

 

[ginmtb]

Doing some more horn diagnostics - no voltage to horns post relay even with independent ground run to negative battery terminal.

Checked steering wheel buttons - cleaned up rust and shined up the metal contacts. Still nothing. Noted one of the horn buttons created a little spark when depressed:



That doesn’t happen on the other two buttons. Seems not right. Need to get a steering wheel puller and check out the contacts that help ground the wheel to the column.

Any other thoughts or advice?

 

[gator25]

@ginmtb is your steering column grounded? I had to put a star washer under one of the small steering column bolts at the firewall.

I'm sorry you wouldn't get that spark if it wasn't grounded. You got something making contact that shouldn't my guess.

 

[ginmtb]

Thanks! I did install some insulation so perhaps that has isolated something that was previously grounded.

 

[algeeba]

You may have a break at the steering wheel coupler rag joint. See attached. The steering wheel column shaft is grounded via the wire to the chassis. If you do have a break you can make a connection with a wire or piece of metal.

 

[ginmtb]

You may have a break at the steering wheel coupler rag joint. See attached. The steering wheel column shaft is grounded via the wire to the chassis. If you do have a break you can make a connection with a wire or piece of metal.

View attachment 1593465

This would be surprising since I recently replaced the rag joint but I will definitely check thanks!

 

[thebigredrocker]

Hopefully your steering wheel isn’t as stuborn as mine.

 

[ginmtb]

Hopefully your steering wheel isn’t as stuborn as mine.
View attachment 1593559

Wow that’s crazy! I just tried my home made steering wheel puller made of hard wood and three bolts I thought it was going to work. Ended up splitting the wood. Will grab a real puller tomorrow...

 

[TheHardWay]

Got any 1/16" scrap steel? Make an oak samich - should protect it from splitting.

 

[ginmtb]

I just picked up a kit for $12 from Harbor Freight. 46 piece kit with own carry case. Kinda crazy - I know quality probably isn’t great but with limited usage hopefully will be fine.

 

[ginmtb]

New kit removed the steering wheel very easily. Cleaned things up, shined up the ground contacts, and... no change. Starting to lose patience... and ideas.

- 12.88V to relay
- relay clicks when horn buttons pushed
- no voltage downstream from relay
- spark at horn button
- fuse checked
- grounds cleaned up

 

[ginmtb]

I ran this @Coolerman test:

Disconnect EVERYTHING from the relay. Using jumpers, apply +12V to the B terminal. Does the relay click? (It shouldn't) if it does then that relay is grounded through the case and is not the correct relay. You can still use it but you will have to isolate the relay case from ground with some type of insulator.

If it does not click then using a jumper, ground the S terminal. Relay should click and you should measure +12V on the H terminal. IF that works then connect the horns back to the H terminal and again ground the S terminal. Horns should blow.

And horns did blow! So the relay works fine then. Eliminates that. Not sure what else to check now...

 

[mrboatman]

That's a tuff one electrical problems just plain suck.
JP

 

[ducktapeguy]

Wow that’s crazy! I just tried my home made steering wheel puller made of hard wood and three bolts I thought it was going to work. Ended up splitting the wood. Will grab a real puller tomorrow...

View attachment 1593577

I can't count how many hours of my life I've wasted trying to use makeshift tools. Sometimes they work, and sometimes they don't. The older I get the more I realize the price of tools are cheap compared to my time, so now I go out and buy whatever tool I need to make life easier. They normally pay for themselves in time saved after the first use.

 

[ducktapeguy]

New kit removed the steering wheel very easily. Cleaned things up, shined up the ground contacts, and... no change. Starting to lose patience... and ideas.

- 12.88V to relay
- relay clicks when horn buttons pushed
- no voltage downstream from relay
- spark at horn button
- fuse checked
- grounds cleaned up

View attachment 1594847

What's the voltage on the output of your relay when you press the horn button, with the horns connected? When you say no voltage downstream, is that at the horns or at the relay?

The sparking is strange, the relay shouldn't be drawing that much power on the trigger wire. Just a wild guess, but maybe the S terminal has some minor short and drawing too much power and dropping too much voltage for horns to work. I've had strange things like that happen, where the voltage looked fine with no load but dropped too much under load.

 

[ginmtb]

I can't count how many hours of my life I've wasted trying to use makeshift tools. Sometimes they work, and sometimes they don't. The older I get the more I realize the price of tools are cheap compared to my time, so now I go out and buy whatever tool I need to make life easier. They normally pay for themselves in time saved after the first use.

Yes and while Harbor Freight stuff can be suspect, for this application I think it is a really good buy ($12.17 after 20% coupon). I don’t buy anything that is mechanical typically. But consumables are good too. I did buy that cheap welder from them to try out welding and it has worked fine for me.