ARCHIVE Wits' End Turbo Test Mule #3- no cartwheeling allowed (1 Viewer)

[CHDAZ80]

What are your thoughts on plumbing the liquid cooled side of the turbo. Not suggesting adding it to the kit, but I'd like to look into it during install. Should help lower underhood temps and turbo life. Im sure you considered it at some point. Watcha think?

 

[NLXTACY]

What are your thoughts on plumbing the liquid cooled side of the turbo. Not suggesting adding it to the kit, but I'd like to look into it during install. Should help lower underhood temps and turbo life. Im sure you considered it at some point. Watcha think?

I did consider it but honestly I’d rather replace a burned out turbo than overheated 1FZ. No reason adding more heat, from the turbo, to the cooling system. I’m open to opinions tho.

 

[Marco Lau]

Agreed, replacing turbo is much easier than replacing HG. Just don't work the turbo super hard and keep it off boost the last few miles prior to shutting the engine down goes a long way in keeping things cool....

 

[Heckraiser]

This turbo wont be generating a ton of heat as it will be working in the "brisk trot" end of it's performance range in this application. Water cooling not necessary, IMO.

 

[CHDAZ80]

I figured the radiator would be efficient enough to remove excess heat from the system. I'll be watching temps very close. Just did HG 3k miles ago. Guess I'm just thinking like a desert rat, always trying to find a way to cool off! Good info, thanks!

 

[Rivman1243]

If the turbo is getting hot I would start looking at oil temps and possibly add an oil cooler like others have mentioned. I've often wondered if people's overheating problems are a lack of proper oil cooling.

 

[NLXTACY]

If the turbo is getting hot I would start looking at oil temps and possibly add an oil cooler like others have mentioned. I've often wondered if people's overheating problems are a lack of proper oil cooling.

Well the Oil PeacePipe I provide does include an extra 1/8NPT to add a temp gauge. That helps.

 

[NLXTACY]

Making up a few of these. Let’s see if anyone can guess. No one really “needs” them but its an issue that pops up every now and then

 

[Bambusiero]

Just an armchair quarterback opinion here, but it seems to me that circulating a relatively small volume of coolant (relative to the total engine coolant flow), plus engine oil, through the turbo housing, isn't a significant difference in total heat transfer into the engine as compared to engine oil alone. The main difference would be that the oil's temperature rise would be less, extending it's useful lifetime, plus the turbo bearings and compressor housing would be kept closer to the engine operating temperature, because coolant heat capacity and heat transfer rate is better than oil. And besides that, if the oil is heated up more, because there's no water filling that cavity, then it goes through the oil to coolant heat exchanger in the engine anyway, so doesn't the same heat make it's way into the coolant loop regardless?

I just don't really buy the idea that it's a failure trade - turbo or head gasket - pick your poison. Nah.

Water cooling the turbo housing is a long term reliability improvement by way of getting the turbo bearings up to engine operating temperature quicker at every cold start, and keeping it there day in and day out with much less severe excursions from average. Consistency. Also, a thermal powered convective coolant loop is there after shutdown. Maybe a minor benefit, maybe more, but it's there.

Not saying anything at all about the kit here, wheather it should be there or not. But, I don't see it as a big or complicated undertaking for the kit buyer to plumb in water cooling on their own. Check out the Safari Turbo photo thread and see what you can see there.

 

[Bambusiero]

Then I'll throw this in as well.

This turbo wont be generating a ton of heat as it will be working in the "brisk trot" end of it's performance range in this application. Water cooling not necessary, IMO.

Agreed. Not a severe duty situation, and water cooling not a necessity.
But - necessity for water cooling this isn't a binary thing. it's not yes/no, zero or one.
It's more a matter of degree, a relative long term reliability benefit.
Might turn a 50,000 mile component into 150,000 miles, for instance, or cover relatively rare severe use cases, and let them survive rather than failing.
So it seems to me.

 

[NLXTACY]

Then I'll throw this in as well.



Agreed. Not a severe duty situation, and water cooling not a necessity.
But - necessity for water cooling this isn't a binary thing. it's not yes/no, zero or one.
It's more a matter of degree, a relative long term reliability benefit.
Might turn a 50,000 mile component into 150,000 miles, for instance, or cover relatively rare severe use cases, and let them survive rather than failing.
So it seems to me.

If we were taking the turbo anywhere near it’s potential I’d say sure. Running 7psi to push the truck to elevation? Not even close to taxing the turbo to be overly concerned about it.

 

[NLXTACY]

Not sure how but the fusepanel cover on the new LX450 had the writing worn away. Ordered up a new cover but as it turns out, there is another difference between the Lexus and Land Cruiser. The Lexus version of the 80 series came with the cell phone option and the fuse for it was in the engine bay. I could technically use this but I’d rather keep the correct one so I’ll be ordering up the Lexus one.

 

[Dissent]

Not sure how but the fusepanel cover on the new LX450 had the writing worn away. Ordered up a new cover but as it turns out, there is another difference between the Lexus and Land Cruiser. The Lexus version of the 80 series came with the cell phone option and the fuse for it was in the engine bay. I could technically use this but I’d rather keep the correct one so I’ll be ordering up the Lexus one.

View attachment 2012346

I guess some of the mystery connectors under the console are for the Telephone fuse. Good to know!

 

[Jgunner]

Not sure how but the fusepanel cover on the new LX450 had the writing worn away. Ordered up a new cover but as it turns out, there is another difference between the Lexus and Land Cruiser. The Lexus version of the 80 series came with the cell phone option and the fuse for it was in the engine bay. I could technically use this but I’d rather keep the correct one so I’ll be ordering up the Lexus one.

View attachment 2012346

Huh, wasn’t aware the fuse panel said ANYTHING, let alone all that! My poor cruiser

 

[Heckraiser]

Then I'll throw this in as well.



Agreed. Not a severe duty situation, and water cooling not a necessity.
But - necessity for water cooling this isn't a binary thing. it's not yes/no, zero or one.
It's more a matter of degree, a relative long term reliability benefit.
Might turn a 50,000 mile component into 150,000 miles, for instance, or cover relatively rare severe use cases, and let them survive rather than failing.
So it seems to me.

That is absolutely right. But in this case we're using the turbo to maybe 20% of it's total capacity at the most taxing (and infrequent) scenarios. I think your analogy might be more like making a 150k mile component and turning it into a 400k mile component. Or maybe I've just had a a taste of coolaid.

 

[HDJdreams]

That is absolutely right. But in this case we're using the turbo to maybe 20% of it's total capacity at the most taxing (and infrequent) scenarios. I think your analogy might be more like making a 150k mile component and turning it into a 400k mile component. Or maybe I've just had a a taste of coolaid.

I disagree with 150k to 400k analogy. If it’s true that the turbo is only pushing around 20% capacity at it’s peak, the adding additional cooling isn’t going to make a difference in life is the oil cooling is able to adequately cool it. If anything the added complexity water cooling system is more likely to reduce system reliability. That’s just my speculation.

But if @scottryana running considerably more boost for years says it’s a nonissue, I certainly take his word for it.

 

[scottryana]

In the act of full disclosure, my turbo setup is ball bearing and water and oil cooled, but there won't be any issues with this turbo running at 7psi and not having water cooling. Like has been mentioned before it is going to be so under driven that the turbine speed is going to be very low. The oil cooled only turbos that need to have turbo timers etc are because they are being pushed to max turbine speed and the oil is being cooked.

I disagree with 150k to 400k analogy. If it’s true that the turbo is only pushing around 20% capacity at it’s peak, the adding additional cooling isn’t going to make a difference in life is the oil cooling is able to adequately cool it. If anything the added complexity water cooling system is more likely to reduce system reliability. That’s just my speculation.

But if @scottryana running considerably more boost for years says it’s a nonissue, I certainly take his word for it.

 

[Kernal]

Will the use of a full synthetic motor oil help any in this situation? Are we talking about the Turbo bearings wearing out prematurely due to heat, oil sludge, both, or??

 

[scottryana]

We are talking about blowing something way out of proportion like Mud often has the propensity to do. lol.

Back in the 80's-90's turbo technology was a long way off from where it is today. There was no ball bearing turbos, turbine and compressor wheels were very heavy, etc. so turbos were sized small and that meant at high RPM's you were running at the max operating RPM's of the turbo. In some turbos that is as high as 160,000RPMs. The shafts would get hot and then if you turned the car off the oil would sit against that shaft that was spinning 160,000RPMs and cook. This turbo at less than 1/2 the max RPM (~64,000RPMs), very little shaft temp, so oil cooking is not an issue.

Will the use of a full synthetic motor oil help any in this situation? Are we talking about the Turbo bearings wearing out prematurely due to heat, oil sludge, both, or??

 

[Cass007]

But .... but, I wanna go back to being one of the cool kids that can get out of my car while it's still running and have it turn off automatically 30 seconds later