I am also waiting on an order, # 38585, placed May 30th for a fuel pump rebuild kit and a fuel filter for an 80. Sent an email, no reply.
Wits End Order Issues / Joey Romero (4 Viewers)
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- Start date
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Again…just because someone has had a good experience doesn’t mean that they are excusing anything. You’re displaying both ignorance and bigotry.
Like all things on the internet they are taken with a grain of salt both with the good and the bad.
Time will tell if he’s truly guilty of fraud.
I can tell you I have seen this with:
Insain Fab
Mobtown Offroad
AllPro
Pelfrey Built
And others all with different customer outcomes.
I personally hope it works out for everyone.
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I thought I'd provide full transparency on my experience with Wits End.
From the perspective of a person who likes Joey's products and someone with E-Commerce experience.
I've placed 4 orders total.
2 of them arrived within two weeks.
1 With the exception of known lead time of pre-order item, QPM which arrived 1 month within ETA . (delays with the powder coating).
One order, the air compressor shelf for FJ80.
Placed October 10th 2021. This was the only not delivered purchase I've made.
As I recall, I placed this order around the time he made the post about his commerce partner / website having issues with order data. (Per Social media post).
I reached out once every couple months to check in with the understanding they were flooded with "were is my stuff?" messages. (Comments on Social media)
(Anecdotal) Likely, the only way to confirm someone actually purchased something is to look at the bank statements and cross reference purchases versus invoice & transaction numbers people provided to him as his site likely didn't retain any invoice data or incorrectly assigned invoice & transaction numbers.
Again, this is an assumption drawn from experience, No one would want to admit their store has no record of purchases.
(December 13th 2021) Jessi reached out to apologies for the delay and admitted that the order was screwed up. She assured me I have not been forgotten and they will rectify the issue.
(Jan 7th 2022) Jessi updated me about some of the key parts being in a cargo ship floating around in the ocean from China.
This lines up with the supply chain shock we experienced during the peak covid era. Understandably that some of the parts were somewhere in the ocean. I was in no rush, and there certainly wasn't anyone else offering a similar product.
This was the last time I heard from Jessi, presumably for health or personal issues.
I sent an update email once every other month until I got an update from Joey.
(May 8th 2022) Joey told me he received a notice that inventory has arrived and he will be getting his order soon.
(October 27th 2022) A refund for 95% of the purchase was returned to my card. 5% store credit applied.
(March 17th 2023) Purchased some odds and ends. Shipped March 21st 2023.
(July 6th 2023) Purchased some more bits. Shipped July 7th 2023.
I'm not here to defend Wits End, this is my experience and everything beyond this point is speculation.
Online retail stores can be really difficult, especially if you don't pick the correct commerce partner or they don't support you.
(Speaking from experience).
These last few was rough for online retail. Excluding any of the personal health or financial situation he may be in or was in.
Of course, this is not an excuse to not communicate. Sometimes customers just want to be acknowledged at a minimum.
Its incredible how far just that little step will afford you in screw ups. This person for wits end IS Jessi.
Understandably, this lack of communication is not acceptable for people who spent thousands of dollars on kits they allegedly received no communication on.
Now he gets to play damage control.
I do hope he has the chance to hire someone to do the process of order flow and 'customer service' for the front end of the store so he can focus on what he does best.
At this point, those who didn't do a chargeback within the time limit is pretty much screwed.
I believe its in everyone's best interest to make sure that he even wants to run a store to have the opportunity to make things right, instead of burying them or doxing them.
This part isn't easy as it does not serve as an instrument of leverage. It's totally counterintuitive to the human psychology. Many people are terrible about asking for support or help, or admitting that they need it.
Communities can be awesome. It provides so much opportunities for niche products to exist and for someone to run a business that otherwise wouldn't be able to.
It started only with the support of a few people. Exactly the same way it can end.
I hope people are made whole one way or another.
(This is my opinion and I am just an idiot on the internet with a keyboard who hates money.
)
From the perspective of a person who likes Joey's products and someone with E-Commerce experience.
I've placed 4 orders total.
2 of them arrived within two weeks.
1 With the exception of known lead time of pre-order item, QPM which arrived 1 month within ETA . (delays with the powder coating).
One order, the air compressor shelf for FJ80.
Placed October 10th 2021. This was the only not delivered purchase I've made.
As I recall, I placed this order around the time he made the post about his commerce partner / website having issues with order data. (Per Social media post).
I reached out once every couple months to check in with the understanding they were flooded with "were is my stuff?" messages. (Comments on Social media)
(Anecdotal) Likely, the only way to confirm someone actually purchased something is to look at the bank statements and cross reference purchases versus invoice & transaction numbers people provided to him as his site likely didn't retain any invoice data or incorrectly assigned invoice & transaction numbers.
Again, this is an assumption drawn from experience, No one would want to admit their store has no record of purchases.
(December 13th 2021) Jessi reached out to apologies for the delay and admitted that the order was screwed up. She assured me I have not been forgotten and they will rectify the issue.
(Jan 7th 2022) Jessi updated me about some of the key parts being in a cargo ship floating around in the ocean from China.
This lines up with the supply chain shock we experienced during the peak covid era. Understandably that some of the parts were somewhere in the ocean. I was in no rush, and there certainly wasn't anyone else offering a similar product.
This was the last time I heard from Jessi, presumably for health or personal issues.
I sent an update email once every other month until I got an update from Joey.
(May 8th 2022) Joey told me he received a notice that inventory has arrived and he will be getting his order soon.
(October 27th 2022) A refund for 95% of the purchase was returned to my card. 5% store credit applied.
(March 17th 2023) Purchased some odds and ends. Shipped March 21st 2023.
(July 6th 2023) Purchased some more bits. Shipped July 7th 2023.
I'm not here to defend Wits End, this is my experience and everything beyond this point is speculation.
Online retail stores can be really difficult, especially if you don't pick the correct commerce partner or they don't support you.
(Speaking from experience).
These last few was rough for online retail. Excluding any of the personal health or financial situation he may be in or was in.
Of course, this is not an excuse to not communicate. Sometimes customers just want to be acknowledged at a minimum.
Its incredible how far just that little step will afford you in screw ups. This person for wits end IS Jessi.
Understandably, this lack of communication is not acceptable for people who spent thousands of dollars on kits they allegedly received no communication on.
Now he gets to play damage control.
I do hope he has the chance to hire someone to do the process of order flow and 'customer service' for the front end of the store so he can focus on what he does best.
At this point, those who didn't do a chargeback within the time limit is pretty much screwed.
I believe its in everyone's best interest to make sure that he even wants to run a store to have the opportunity to make things right, instead of burying them or doxing them.
This part isn't easy as it does not serve as an instrument of leverage. It's totally counterintuitive to the human psychology. Many people are terrible about asking for support or help, or admitting that they need it.
Communities can be awesome. It provides so much opportunities for niche products to exist and for someone to run a business that otherwise wouldn't be able to.
It started only with the support of a few people. Exactly the same way it can end.
I hope people are made whole one way or another.
(This is my opinion and I am just an idiot on the internet with a keyboard who hates money.
)
- Thread starter
- #24
Exactly. There are countless threads with issues and people specifically looking for contact information. I put it in one place for ease of others with issues to reach out and attempt resolution. And I only posted business contact information for the two owners that has been provided and used by the business.
Francis K
SILVER Star
The guy used that to justify blowing off his customers, he should be ashamed before anyone.
I do e-commerce, I'm a "family" business, I have a much larger operation than wits end and I am a "one man show"...
Those of you defending anything wits end has done have no idea what you're talking about, there is no defense for what he does to his customer he is simply preying on the community and you're enabling it. I can pick apart every single one of his bs excuses and the excuses made for him, they are all trash. From his "one man show" routine to his bs about the site issues to his claims of all his orders....it's all complete nonsense to anyone that knows e-commerce.
The guy takes orders for things he doesn't have in stock and waits for enough people to order for it to be worth doing a production run or bulk purchase of them. Or he comes up with a product and uses all the pre-order money to fund it or just to fund something else until he decides to circle back it whenever if at all. The guy is essentially running a Ponzi scheme at this point and he knows he can get away with it with this community. Funny part is that he would get away with it forever if he would just pretend to be a reputable businessman and give his customers some honesty instead of taking the complete opposite route.
Guaranteed he is watching this thread as we speak, a little while back he changed his account settings so you can't see what his activity is on here. At this point he's just a bad person doing bad things to people, it's not business anymore, logistics, family troubles or whatever other nonsense excuse he comes up with or is made for him.
Anyone remember EMS? I sure do, I was one of the last ones to get burned by their garbage exhaust system because all their fanboys didn't allow anyone to speak up about it and when it became undeniably true that i got ripped off as did multiple others i was still shot down and told to shutup about it. Some here seem hell bent on letting that repeat itself over and over, that's not going to happen again if I'm still around, sorry.
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I have a decent sized ecommerce operation as well. I'm skeptical of ecommerce businesses that carefully employ social media marketing and make suspect claims (like "We have shipped 30,000 orders!" or such), but don't exactly have the pieces in place to back it up- Such as not investing in hiring employees or in-housing manufacturing.
One man can only do one man's work. Social media can put a rose colored spin on things. That can be beneficial to getting a small operation off the ground, but it can't make up for a lack of manpower or poor risk management.
Payments for products that are not on the shelves is a dangerous way to attempt a business. Personal problems- Cancer, divorce, health issues, car wreck, whatever- can upend your world.
I do not know what is going on, but I agree that the claims of this "one man show" bring some questions to mind to those that make a living with ecommerce.
Out of exasperation, I finally wrote my cc company and disputed the charges for my turbo order within days of the window closing. I would have rather had a turbo but given my experience to date and those of others, I don’t believe that’s a reality.
Best of luck to all.
Cheers
Pete
Best of luck to all.
Cheers
Pete
Francis K
SILVER Star
You were left with no choice, you did the right thing. The crazy part is that a simple "hey sorry I'm still working on it" probably would have placated you...
Honestly the entire situation is disgusting.
george.arnold
SILVER Star
After being a long-time Wits' End customer and enjoying his contributions to the 80 Series community, I had to give up and move my business elsewhere. After repeated emails, phone calls, text messages, Mud DMs, social media DMs, and more over more than 24 months, and with zero response, I had to reach out to one of my best friends, who is also a well-known and trusted member of the LC/GX community. My friend messaged Joey about an 'order' he needed an update on. Joey immediately responded to my friend, saying, 'I don't see an order for you. Do you have the order number?' That's when my friend provided my order number and name. Joey promptly refunded the balance of that 24-month-old order and texted me, 'Order has been refunded.' That's it. Nothing else. It's just a huge disappointment.
I understand that Wits' End is a family-run business and families go through hardships, and Joey's family has been through many. As with any business, customers are afforded the ability to shop where they wish. I will not continue doing business with Wits' End and cannot recommend them to anyone else.
I understand that Wits' End is a family-run business and families go through hardships, and Joey's family has been through many. As with any business, customers are afforded the ability to shop where they wish. I will not continue doing business with Wits' End and cannot recommend them to anyone else.
Francis K
SILVER Star
24 months?
Brother your order wasn't even on his radar anymore as in "hey I just haven't gotten to it yet", your money was long gone if it wasn't for your friend. Happy you got your money back, if that were me or most other guys we were not getting our money back and we would have had no recourse.
This 
is such a scammer. I went on his FB page and was going to post this thread under his reviews but noticed someone already did. Looking at all his positive reviews I caught that almost all his glowing 5 star reviews were posted on the same day 9/16/21. Dude probably sent a message out to all his fanboys to post a positive review for him. He literally is one of those sh*t restaurants that give u diarrhea but somehow are always praised on FB and Yelp because they incentivize people to post fake reviews.
is such a scammer. I went on his FB page and was going to post this thread under his reviews but noticed someone already did. Looking at all his positive reviews I caught that almost all his glowing 5 star reviews were posted on the same day 9/16/21. Dude probably sent a message out to all his fanboys to post a positive review for him. He literally is one of those sh*t restaurants that give u diarrhea but somehow are always praised on FB and Yelp because they incentivize people to post fake reviews.It may have taken a bit more than that, at this point….
The whole “family run business”excuse is such a pile of bull****. It’s playing on peoples sense of family love and it’s more important than the money you sent.
Well it isn’t, your hard earned money is not charity to a poorly run business.
Family run business gives the sense there are multiple family members participating in operations. Then the next breath is “a one man show” which is just another excuse.
I have not purchased from Wits End, I was going to but I always carefully examine who I will purchase from. I look up feedback, look at their posts and how they behave and make decisions from there.
When the turbo kit came to “market” I seriously looked at it. But with the currency exchange rate, the E-commerce business and some of his posts plus feedback I decided not now, I’ll wait.
Man, I’m glad I did! Being in Canada and dealing with getting ripped off by the clown from another country would have pretty much guaranteed I would be out close to $8000 Cdn
.
Dodged that bullet
Well it isn’t, your hard earned money is not charity to a poorly run business.
Family run business gives the sense there are multiple family members participating in operations. Then the next breath is “a one man show” which is just another excuse.
I have not purchased from Wits End, I was going to but I always carefully examine who I will purchase from. I look up feedback, look at their posts and how they behave and make decisions from there.
When the turbo kit came to “market” I seriously looked at it. But with the currency exchange rate, the E-commerce business and some of his posts plus feedback I decided not now, I’ll wait.
Man, I’m glad I did! Being in Canada and dealing with getting ripped off by the clown from another country would have pretty much guaranteed I would be out close to $8000 Cdn
.Dodged that bullet
I'm one of the remaining turbo kit pre-orders and one of those being ignored by the mighty Joey.
I was a fan boy and I defended him vociferously after happily sending him my 6000+ dollars.
He was decently communicative at first, via text and FB Messenger, then it all stopped....
I messaged on all platforms and have to believe I'm blocked everywhere now.
I started out pretty polite and professional, as that's how I conduct my business,
No replies to any form of message at all.
I still defended him and believed the BS.
Not so much anymore and I'm done with polite.
I'd prefer that he man's up and owns his miss-management of this whole, sad situation, maybe even eventually delivering on the promise of turbo kits, though at this point I seriously doubt I'll ever see any boost making goodness from him.
In the meantime, all he has to do is communicate.
Talk to those of us hanging in the wind and give us an honest accounting of wtf is going on.
I was a fan boy and I defended him vociferously after happily sending him my 6000+ dollars.
He was decently communicative at first, via text and FB Messenger, then it all stopped....
I messaged on all platforms and have to believe I'm blocked everywhere now.
I started out pretty polite and professional, as that's how I conduct my business,
No replies to any form of message at all.
I still defended him and believed the BS.
Not so much anymore and I'm done with polite.
I'd prefer that he man's up and owns his miss-management of this whole, sad situation, maybe even eventually delivering on the promise of turbo kits, though at this point I seriously doubt I'll ever see any boost making goodness from him.
In the meantime, all he has to do is communicate.
Talk to those of us hanging in the wind and give us an honest accounting of wtf is going on.
- Thread starter
- #36
This 1000%
Francis K
SILVER Star
Be careful with that because you're just giving him an out, he'll start responding just to hold on to your money, keep playing the community and still never deliver anything...he obviously has no shame or accountability towards any of it.
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I get that, and my intention is not to give him an out, as much just open a line of communication.
I'd really like to believe that Joey is a decent human being who still has a shred of integrity and one way or another wants to make this right.
Amazing people like @woody and @Idaho Savage still accept joey's excuses. I have been patiently waiting for 3 years (ok, 2 years and 50ish weeks). There is no communication and based on what we know today, we are likely to be stiffed for our turbo orders. I can list all my issues since putting $6000+ down on a turbo kit, which include getting laid off, having to switch careers (~1/4 of what I used to make), shoulder surgery, etc. It's irrelevant. We've all been fleeced, and some people want to continue to be fleeced. If you would like to support Joey, specifically woody and idaho savage, put your money where your mouth is. My order is for sale, $1000 discount. Even if you don't need it, assuming Joey delivers, you can sell the kit easily if it is delivered and I put some meat on the bone for you. No one has taken me up on my offer yet.
Placed Turbo order on January 18, 2022, after a 5 month waitlist. Just wanting or waiting for an update.
I've ordered a bunch of stuff from him in the past and he's always delivered.
But this time no more communication. Last message I received, referred me to the MUD Turbo Thread for updates.
I've ordered a bunch of stuff from him in the past and he's always delivered.
But this time no more communication. Last message I received, referred me to the MUD Turbo Thread for updates.
