Replacing All Brake Lines - A Ton of Questions

[RWBeringer4x4]

Going to add @bikersmurf as well - since he has an early 40 and with a V8 - Bikersmurf: interested to see/hear about how you ran your front brake hard line (MC down to soft line between axle/frame). My current setup is above, would like to get the line out of harm's way.

 

[Stumpalama]

Make sure your brake line has about 4 coils in it when you route it down from the master. This allows it to flex and not crack when the frame flexes. If you get a nice long soft hose, you can terminate the hard line before the engine mount and drop the end of the hard line down to point at the t-union.

 

[DSRTRDR]

mine run inside the frame - IIRC, looked like the original tabs were used

and X2 on the coils below the master - for illustration:

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Make sure your brake line has about 4 coils in it when you route it down from the master. This allows it to flex and not crack when the frame flexes. If you get a nice long soft hose, you can terminate the hard line before the engine mount and drop the end of the hard line down to point at the t-union.

I definitely plan on adding coils. The current line doesn't have any... Ideally, I would route this line along the top of the frame, then do two 90 degree bents to a tombstone mounted on the inside of the rail. The issue with terminating before the engine mount is the header: Very tight, and probably not somewhere you want to run a rubber line...I'm sure once I have the truck in front of me, something will click.

Kind of a blury picture, but you can see how close the engine mount is to the Ram's horn:

The steering shaft gets in the way in front.

Worst case scenario, I'll run it along the top of the frame as far as I can, then down the outside and under, like it currently is - that will at least keep the majority of it out of the way.

mine run inside the frame - IIRC, looked like the original tabs were used

In your case, I have no doubt they were: You're running an F-engine still, if I recall...In my case I think it was the V8 conversion that caused the re-route. I was really more interested in your thoughts on whether or not my current setup was as much of a rock/brush catcher as I was thinking it would be!

 

[DSRTRDR]

I do not see that as a major problem unless you drive through thick underbrush or swamp with unknown underwater obstacles - in which case it could also catch if run on the inside of the frame

 

[pb4ugo]

I just replaced the lines on my 75 40. I opted to run them like the 76 to 78 models. I think it's a cleaner setup imo. Plus folks who know 40's will notice. You will probably have to find some used brakeline fittings to do the job. I know the elbows on the frame are no longer available. SOR shows how they are run. When the po did the frt disc conversion on my 40, he did it similar to yours but in a much scarier way. Good luck

 

[bikersmurf]

mine run inside the frame - IIRC, looked like the original tabs were used

and X2 on the coils below the master - for illustration:

This looks like mine currently. I'd blame it on a PO, but I did the conversion back in 1996. It looks like the rigid to flex line attachment used to be at the motor mount location, now it's above the front axle... I believe I moved it forward to clear the mount. It comes down from the master, has a couple coils, slopes downwards over the steering box and then attaches to the inside of the frame above the center of the axle.

I wouldn't run it on the outside. I've had mufflers and fenders crushed by sticks that've bounced up after driving over them.

In the future I plan to either run it over to the passenger side like on newer 40s, or once the steering box is removed (Scout II) run it down the top of the frame on the drivers side and connect up to the flex line where it is. A lot depends on timing... I've got a 77 housing that I may clean up, install 3.70 gears, paint, swap in, and add disk knuckles... That'd have me half way to having the line moved across.





For those paying attention and going, "huh?", its a 45 housing and in 77, they had massive oversized drums... Not discs. Since I've got 4 wheel discs, I'll be keeping them. Family, health, life, etc. have got in the way of completing the switch to 3.70 gears. It sucks having mismatched 3rds, but what can I do.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

This looks like mine currently. I'd blame it on a PO, but I did the conversion back in 1996. It looks like the rigid to flex line attachment used to be at the motor mount location, now it's above the front axle... I believe I moved it forward to clear the mount. It comes down from the master, has a couple coils, slopes downwards over the steering box and then attaches to the inside of the frame above the center of the axle.

I wouldn't run it on the outside. I've had mufflers and fenders crushed by sticks that've bounced up after driving over them.

In the future I plan to either run it over to the passenger side like on newer 40s, or once the steering box is removed (Scout II) run it down the top of the frame on the drivers side and connect up to the flex line where it is.

Given the tight clearance of my saginaw steering column to the frame in front of the motor mount, I'm not sure that is going to be an option for me. That's unfortunate because it really is the ideal solution. Really, part of the issue is that my engine is WAY too far forward...but I don't have the time, energy, or cash to invest in that nightmare yet.

 

[DSRTRDR]

I would just route them inside wherever you can, or wherever it makes sense - get the truck running and see what your uses are in the next year - the truck will tell you what it needs

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

I would just route them inside wherever you can, or wherever it makes sense - get the truck running and see what your uses are in the next year - the truck will tell you what it needs

Very true - I tend to get caught up in doing it once, correctly, primarily because my PO did virtually everything incorrectly, and I have had the joy of trying to make sense of it all. It has entrenched a deep hatred for hack jobs and half-assedry! In this case though, you're right, I'm splitting hairs. This truck hasn't been off road in the last 2 years, and probably won't for at least another, and I doubt I'll be hitting any bushes on the street large enough to cause any real problems!

 

[DSRTRDR]

the one good thing with not driving the 40 is you can't mangle it (stay tuned for the newest installment of what I managed to destroy this weekend )

 

[bikersmurf]

Given the tight clearance of my saginaw steering column to the frame in front of the motor mount, I'm not sure that is going to be an option for me. That's unfortunate because it really is the ideal solution. Really, part of the issue is that my engine is WAY too far forward...but I don't have the time, energy, or cash to invest in that nightmare yet.

Sounds like you'd be best to run them across the firewall and forward on the passenger side like the 75+ setup... They'd be away from the steering shaft, and only hae the passenger side mounts. How far is it forward, it might not be necessary to move it.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Sounds like you'd be best to run them across the firewall and forward on the passenger side like the 75+ setup... They'd be away from the steering shaft, and only hae the passenger side mounts. How far is it forward, it might not be necessary to move it.

I wish I had a decent picture, but the transmission tower is butted right up against the firewall in my truck. As a result, the engine is far enough forward that my belt-drive fan is about 1/4-1/2in from my radiator (can't fit a finger between fan and radiator). There IS a fan spacer (~2"), so I could fix that without too much hassle, but if I ever want to run a clutch fan, or something along those lines, I'd have to move the engine back. That is a battle for another day! For the time being, I'll either route the lines to the passenger side, or try to find a creative way to keep them on the driver's side.

 

[Stumpalama]

Can you route along the top, past the engine mount then back under the mount? I'd need to see where your axle falls in relation to the engine mount. One thing to think about, is pulling the DS fender since you will be working on the master and the brake lines. It is simple to remove and replace and make access sooo much better.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Can you route along the top, past the engine mount then back under the mount? I'd need to see where your axle falls in relation to the engine mount. One thing to think about, is pulling the DS fender since you will be working on the master and the brake lines. It is simple to remove and replace and make access sooo much better.

I'm not going to lie, pulling the fender has crossed my mind...

I believe the the axle sits in front of the engine mount. The perfect solution would be to terminate the hard line at a clip on the inside of the frame rail, just behind the mount, then run the soft line under the mount to the axle. The only big concern there, as I mentioned, is that the exhaust header is right there. Not sure how close is too close when it comes to high-temperature situations and brake components, particularly soft lines. I'll have to do some measuring when I get back to it, but my guess is that the hard line/soft line junction would be within an inch or two of the header.

 

[DSRTRDR]

how about leaving it where it is now, for the time being ?

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

how about leaving it where it is now, for the time being ?

That will be the last resort, if I can't route it along the top and inside, somewhere. I'm not going to let this stall the entire project, but if I can route it somewhere more out of harm's way, now is as good a time as any to take care of it!

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

This will (hopefully) be my last really dumb question:

I bought the weld-on tombstone brake clips for mounting my new soft/hard line junctions. I've run into an issue. It would appear that the brake hose part number 38881 has a "hex" portion that prevents the hose from sliding far enough through the tombstone to gain access to the clip channel:

What's the best recourse here? File out the tombstone so that the hex passes through? Buy a larger-diameter tombstone? Haven't seen this mentioned in the other disc conversion threads.

@DSRTRDR and @Tools R Us - I believe you used the same line in your disc conversion.

Seems like filing out the tombstone mount is the best option, just want to check before I grind!

 

[Cdaniel]

I had the same problem with my home made brackets. My solution was to machine a groove to fit the hex on the face of the bracket to bring the thickness to where it needed to be.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

I had the same problem with my home made brackets. My solution was to machine a groove to fit the hex on the face of the bracket to bring the thickness to where it needed to be.

Thanks - I figured as much but wanted to confirm. Curious as to how the mounting tabs look on the 80-series this came from! I'll Just file in the points to allow the hex through - should solve my issues!