Panhard bar bolt came out on the highway! (1 Viewer)

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snowtaco

SILVER Star
Joined
May 10, 2018
Threads
4
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Location
Arizona
~4 weeks ago I had our LC lifted by pros with a Kings kit from Filthy motorsports, and had the installer use the Dr KDSS bracket to fix the rear panhard bar angle as part of the install. Spidertrax spacers were installed as well to prevent the front wheels from rubbing. The installer marked all bolts they touched with bolt marking compound after torquing correctly, and I’d like to say up front I don’t think they caused this issue. I think if I were guess on who to blame, it’s either a mistake by the alignment shop, or the nut on the bolt came loose due to a wobble issue, or the bolt/nut somehow failed.

We were driving on the highway earlier today, when I noticed the LC started rocking back and forth as we drove. Not too hard, but enough that it was becoming uncomfortable. I pulled over, aired the tires up a bit (maybe 4 PSI, thought it might help), and visually checked for any issues. I also double checked the bolts on all the tires, but all were tight. I did not, however, look at where the panhard bar attached to the vehicle.

We resumed driving on the highway, and a few miles later the rocking became more severe, and then suddenly the vehicle started swerving uncontrollably and I think traction control was attempting to selective brake, but either way it was an incredible dangerous situation. The semi behind us in the other lane thankfully slowed down; I think we probably came very close to getting hit.

I pulled over, checked the car out quickly, and then called the installer since I figured they could help quickly triage. We discussed it, and after crawling under the vehicle I saw that the bolt connecting the rear panhard to the frame was gone. The installer suggested using a tow hitch pin to jury rig it, which I had on hand. We resumed driving down the highway at a reduced speed & checked the pin every 30-50 miles. Due to our location between major cities, it was do this or risk being stuck on the side of the highway in the middle of the desert for hours waiting for a tow.

When we resumed driving, I thought if the rocking was caused by a loose panhard, it would be minimized with the tow hitch pin in place. It was not - it’s a relatively gentle side to side rocking motion that feels like we are on a boat. This only happens on a straight section of road, not on corners.

I am going to try and get a replacement bolt/nut from a dealership tomorrow, but that won’t likely solve the rocking/wobble issue. I plan on jacking up each tire and seeing if there is any give, which might indicate a spacer is loose, but after that I am not sure what to look at.

Any thoughts on what else to look at?
 
So why are you concerned a new bolt won’t stop the rocking? Based on what the hitch pin does?

Even if there’s a millimeter of slack in that hitch pin I can see it inducing rocking as that could allow the rear suspension to oscillate side to side. A new bolt, as long as it’s actually tight, should prevent this easily.

Also for the record I would be trying to find a fastenal or similar fastening hardware store. The dealer probably won’t have that bolt, but even if they do the nut isn’t a Toyota part.. from the factory the bolt runs into a threaded insert welded to the axle. It’s likely too large for a standard hardware store to be able to help..
 
So why are you concerned a new bolt won’t stop the rocking? Based on what the hitch pin does?

Even if there’s a millimeter of slack in that hitch pin I can see it inducing rocking as that could allow the rear suspension to oscillate side to side. A new bolt, as long as it’s actually tight, should prevent this easily.

Also for the record I would be trying to find a fastenal or similar fastening hardware store. The dealer probably won’t have that bolt, but even if they do the nut isn’t a Toyota part.. from the factory the bolt runs into a threaded insert welded to the axle. It’s likely too large for a standard hardware store to be able to help..

Hmm, good point on the rocking. Also, this isn’t axle side, this is frame side. The axle side is now attached to the dr kdss bracket, and torqued correctly.
 
Scary, glad you were able to get off the road.

Part numbers for the bolt, washer and nut.
Screenshot_20231216_075250_Chrome.jpg
 
Hmm, good point on the rocking. Also, this isn’t axle side, this is frame side. The axle side is now attached to the dr kdss bracket, and torqued correctly.
I didn't even consider there were two ends to the panhard rod.. hah.

If the dealer doesn't have it the good bolt stores may. And even if you need to run standard hardware or something slightly undersized, as long as that bolt is good and tight you'll be safe to drive.
 
Well, turns out no Toyota dealers have the bolt/nut/washer in stock. Turns out they have so rarely heard of it coming loose or being replaced it’s a special order part.

A 9/16th grade 8 bolt fits almost perfectly. Couldn’t find a flanged one so I am using a washer on both ends. Torque wrench I found in stock only went to 100 ft lbs, but spec is 111 ft lbs.

Wobble is gone completely; crazy how much it moved with even a small amount of play.
 
Well, turns out no Toyota dealers have the bolt/nut/washer in stock. Turns out they have so rarely heard of it coming loose or being replaced it’s a special order part.

A 9/16th grade 8 bolt fits almost perfectly. Couldn’t find a flanged one so I am using a washer on both ends. Torque wrench I found in stock only went to 100 ft lbs, but spec is 111 ft lbs.

Wobble is gone completely; crazy how much it moved with even a small amount of play.
Key word is almost. Just order one online and replace. Jeep owners have been plagued by similar use of improper fasteners that have allowed enlargement of holes leading to major wobble.
 
Order the the right bolt and have the installer take care of you...
 
Was this bolt loosened during install?
Seems more likely to have been loosened during the lift install than the alignment, logically.
 
Seems more likely to have been loosened during the lift install than the alignment, logically.
Agree with this. Alignemnt shop would not touch this bolt. Getting the panhard riser installed, however, absolutely requires loosening of the frame-side bolt. With 110 ft/lb torque, that bushing is very firmly in there; IIRC you can't even push the panhard up for the bracket without loosening the top end. Doing so (like with a bottle jack) would perma-torque the bushing into an untimely end. Sounds like the installer forgot to re-tighten.
 
I'd bet the installer loosened the frame side (as instructed by the DR KDSS video) and forgot to re tighten it. Torque marks mean nothing if the fasteners aren't torqued before being marked. I've seen it several times where someone tightens everything (or thinks they did) and then afterwards marks all the fasteners. It is really easy to miss one this way. Each fastener should be torqued, then immediately marked individually to lessen the chances of this error.

Replace the bolt with the right one, torque it properly, and you'll be good for the long haul as long as the bolt holes didn't get wallowed out during the time you had your hitch pin in.
 
Even a moderately wallowed out bolt hole should be fine if the hardware stays tight. The friction provided by the bolt clamping is technically what keeps the axle from moving. The only risk would be the extra room in the hole allowing the axle to move too far to one side before it is torqued, impacting alignment. But at least on my truck in the driveway the axle stays centered pretty well even when one of the panhard bolts is removed.. and from reading about other people’s bracket installs I think this is common.

@TeCKis300 to your knowledge is loosening the panhard bolts part of a full alignment procedure on a LX570? I didn’t know whether the height change at speed indicated some extra care with the rear suspension mounting.
 
@TeCKis300 to your knowledge is loosening the panhard bolts part of a full alignment procedure on a LX570? I didn’t know whether the height change at speed indicated some extra care with the rear suspension mounting.
Not that I know of, and not likely IMO. I agree with others that they forgot to torque it after installing the KDSS bracket.

Well, turns out no Toyota dealers have the bolt/nut/washer in stock. Turns out they have so rarely heard of it coming loose or being replaced it’s a special order part.

I'd highly recommend you source the OEM bolt. There's more to it than meets the eye and with critical suspension bolts like this, my preference is OEM.
 
Thanks for the insights. I have two OEM bolts, washers and nuts on the way.

I was able to torque the temporary bolt to 100 ft lbs while the LC was on the ground… that was not fun.
 
I'd bet the installer loosened the frame side (as instructed by the DR KDSS video) and forgot to re tighten it. Torque marks mean nothing if the fasteners aren't torqued before being marked. I've seen it several times where someone tightens everything (or thinks they did) and then afterwards marks all the fasteners. It is really easy to miss one this way. Each fastener should be torqued, then immediately marked individually to lessen the chances of this error.

Replace the bolt with the right one, torque it properly, and you'll be good for the long haul as long as the bolt holes didn't get wallowed out during the time you had your hitch pin in.

The bolt hole is concentric from what I see.

I should have the OEM bolt in a week or so, and that will be a better indicator than my eyeballs.
 
Not that I know of, and not likely IMO. I agree with others that they forgot to torque it after installing the KDSS bracket.



I'd highly recommend you source the OEM bolt. There's more to it than meets the eye and with critical suspension bolts like this, my preference is OEM.
I received the OEM bolt tonight. The dimensions are a bit surprising!

The OEM bolt is a hair length than 3 inches long, and takes a 19mm wrench on the head. The body of the bolt has 2 different diameters, however, across 3 sections. The threads and a stepped up region by the head are thicker than the unthreaded portion of the bolt stem.

Using my bolt size tool, the threads and the thicker portion are an M14 bolt. This means that the 9/16th bolt I have currently installed is actually thicker and fills the hole more! It’s also almost an inch longer than the OEM bolt.

Given the 9/16th is a bit thicker, should I just leave it in, or swap back to the OEM bolt? I’m leaning OEM or getting a shorter grade 8 bolt.
 
I received the OEM bolt tonight. The dimensions are a bit surprising!

The OEM bolt is a hair length than 3 inches long, and takes a 19mm wrench on the head. The body of the bolt has 2 different diameters, however, across 3 sections. The threads and a stepped up region by the head are thicker than the unthreaded portion of the bolt stem.

Using my bolt size tool, the threads and the thicker portion are an M14 bolt. This means that the 9/16th bolt I have currently installed is actually thicker and fills the hole more! It’s also almost an inch longer than the OEM bolt.

Given the 9/16th is a bit thicker, should I just leave it in, or swap back to the OEM bolt? I’m leaning OEM or getting a shorter grade 8 bolt.

Great description and thanks for reporting back.

A lot of the OEM stuff is designed to minimize stress risers for long term durability. The stepping helps the bolt manage forces throughout the shank rather than concentrating at the threads. Threads are a natural stress riser for breaks, and you don't want the weakest part to be that where forces will further concentrate, and may ultimately result in a break.

It'd be awesome if you can post a picture?
 
Great description and thanks for reporting back.

A lot of the OEM stuff is designed to minimize stress risers for long term durability. The stepping helps the bolt manage forces throughout the shank rather than concentrating at the threads. Threads are a natural stress riser for breaks, and you don't want the weakest part to be that where forces will further concentrate, and may ultimately result in a break.

It'd be awesome if you can post a picture?
Fasteners are sometimes also specced this way to get the bolt to stretch more easily and slow the progression of clamping force.
 

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